4 ms·

Does the EU have a problem with wealthy donors? I've heard this criticism levelled against US politicians and it's justified, but in this case I think it might

by untog 8y ago

Does the EU have a problem with wealthy donors? I've heard this criticism levelled against US politicians and it's justified, but in this case I think it might just be sheer ignorance on the part of the EU legislators.

fetbaffe 8y ago
Don’t know how common it is, but it has happened https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_cash_for_influence_scandal https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_cash_for_influence_scan...
- int_19h 8y ago
  That's outright bribery. Lobbying usually implies that it's legal.
adrianratnapala 8y ago
Everywhere has this phenomenon in some guise, it's only the US that's self absorbed enough to think it is unique.
- anigbrowl 8y ago
  That's essentially a religious argument. Please provide evidence for your claim.
  - TylerE 8y ago
    Corporations exist
    - anigbrowl 8y ago
      That's not much of an argument. Have a nice day.
  - antidesitter 8y ago
    > That's essentially a religious argument. ?
mcv 8y ago
Not in the same way as in the US, and I don't think campaign contributions are a thing, at least not at the same level as in the US. But there are many, many lobbyists active in the EU, and some of them have a surprising amount of influence over politicians. There has even been a case where two different parties, independently from each other, introduced the exact same bill, which had been written by a lobbyist.
- int_19h 8y ago
  What leverage do they use for lobbying, if campaign contributions are off the tables?
  - jeremyt 8y ago
    Bribery. I'm only half joking. There's lots of dark international money slushing around out there that happens to make it into someone's wife's friend's company.
  - sosborn 8y ago
    The art of lobbying doesn't have anything to do with contributions. They will typically donate equally to all viable candidates and sitting politicians to avoid becoming anyone's enemy. The leverage they use is their relationships with other politicians to engage in vote trading.
  - cmsefton 8y ago
    This is one mechanism: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolving_door_(politics) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolving_door_(politics)
  - klmr 8y ago
    They are still (ostensibly) the subject matter experts so politicians defer to them. This in itself isn’t a problem: they should defer to experts on complex matters. And often these experts are organised in industry interest groups. The problem arises when opposing view-points are downplayed. In the current case this is done because the industry interest groups backing the legislation are predominantly European content rights owners. Whereas the interest groups opposing the legislation appear mostly organised by non-EU groups, and therefore thus are less of a concern for EU legislators, and potentially don’t have the same kind of immediate access to them.
ionised 8y ago
Not quite as brazenly corrupt as it is in the US but it is still a huge problem.

by untog 8y ago

fetbaffe 8y ago

Don’t know how common it is, but it has happened https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_cash_for_influence_scandal https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_cash_for_influence_scan...

int_19h 8y ago
That's outright bribery. Lobbying usually implies that it's legal.

adrianratnapala 8y ago

Everywhere has this phenomenon in some guise, it's only the US that's self absorbed enough to think it is unique.

anigbrowl 8y ago
That's essentially a religious argument. Please provide evidence for your claim.
- TylerE 8y ago
  Corporations exist
  - anigbrowl 8y ago
    That's not much of an argument. Have a nice day.
- antidesitter 8y ago
  > That's essentially a religious argument. ?

mcv 8y ago

Not in the same way as in the US, and I don't think campaign contributions are a thing, at least not at the same level as in the US. But there are many, many lobbyists active in the EU, and some of them have a surprising amount of influence over politicians. There has even been a case where two different parties, independently from each other, introduced the exact same bill, which had been written by a lobbyist.

int_19h 8y ago
What leverage do they use for lobbying, if campaign contributions are off the tables?
- jeremyt 8y ago
  Bribery. I'm only half joking. There's lots of dark international money slushing around out there that happens to make it into someone's wife's friend's company.
- sosborn 8y ago
  The art of lobbying doesn't have anything to do with contributions. They will typically donate equally to all viable candidates and sitting politicians to avoid becoming anyone's enemy. The leverage they use is their relationships with other politicians to engage in vote trading.
- cmsefton 8y ago
  This is one mechanism: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolving_door_(politics) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolving_door_(politics)
- klmr 8y ago
  They are still (ostensibly) the subject matter experts so politicians defer to them. This in itself isn’t a problem: they should defer to experts on complex matters. And often these experts are organised in industry interest groups. The problem arises when opposing view-points are downplayed. In the current case this is done because the industry interest groups backing the legislation are predominantly European content rights owners. Whereas the interest groups opposing the legislation appear mostly organised by non-EU groups, and therefore thus are less of a concern for EU legislators, and potentially don’t have the same kind of immediate access to them.

ionised 8y ago

Not quite as brazenly corrupt as it is in the US but it is still a huge problem.