6 ms·

This is an embarrassment and totally changes the colour of my view of brexit in one fell swoop. I would not want to be a member state of an organization that t

This is an embarrassment and totally changes the colour of my view of brexit in one fell swoop. I would not want to be a member state of an organization that thinks this is remotely ok either.

cultus 8y ago
I wasn't a Brexit fan but the EU seems to make boneheaded decisions like this pretty often. It really does suggest some fundamental structural reform could be in order.
- jimnotgym 8y ago
  It hasn't made a decision. The EU parliament is just one step.
- etatoby 8y ago
  The EU in its current shape seems almost purpose-built to detach the decision making process from public scrutiny, influence, and accountability. At the same time, it facilitates lobbying by private interests to a dangerous degree. I don't know whether those responsible for creating it did so on purpose, or by incompetence.
Someguywhatever 8y ago
Lets build a gigantic bureaucracy and allow the most technologically illiterate people to decide weighty matters they haven't the foggiest clue about. What could go possibly go wrong?
- _emacsomancer_ 8y ago
  I think you just wrote "A Brief History of the World since 1689".
- nnain 8y ago
  May I use this everytime I describe the Politics+Tech situation in India!
themihai 8y ago
I wonder how UK voted...it seems they supported the this law from the beginning.
- jimnotgym 8y ago
  The UK hasn't had it's say yet. MEPs from the UK can vote how they like, but the European Parliament is but one stage in the process. National governments go next...
  - dudul 8y ago
    National governments are obligated to ratify, and turn into national laws directives and laws coming from Brussels. If they don't they get fined after a certain period of time.
    - themihai 8y ago
      My point was that UK MPs voted/supported this law so it's not really like this law will be forced upon UK thus the argument about Brexit is pointless. I'm pretty sure it will be translated into national law after Brexit.
  - themihai 8y ago
    >> The UK hasn't had it's say yet. MEPs from the UK can vote how they like I assumed that MEPs from the UK represent the UK. Isn't that the case?
    - jimnotgym 8y ago
      They represent parts of the UK, and are unlikely to vote as a bloc, representing all sides of political spectrum. The UK is represented as a country on the Council, not in the parliament.
      - themihai 8y ago
        >> They represent parts of the UK, and are unlikely to vote as a bloc, representing all sides of political spectrum. I don't think this changes the fact that UK people voted those MPs and they are expecting to be represented by them in the EU Parliament and vote on laws(i.e. this law) on their behalf.
jimnotgym 8y ago
It hasn't been decided yet. The EU parliament can stop a law, but not force one through. It is still a long way from being ratified
- kodablah 8y ago
  You've mentioned this multiple times in this thread, unnecessarily. The comment you are responding to said nothing about ratification, only "an organization that thinks this is remotely ok" which qualifies (domestic government hypocrisy notwithstanding).
- vsl 8y ago
  It is one rubber-stamping, always done, step from becoming law. Closed-doors tri-dialogs always reach a compromise in practice. The parliament always rubber-stamps the outcome (“always” as in there was one case of compromise rejection in years).
mcjiggerlog 8y ago
Except it was supported by both Labour and the Conservatives, so we apparently would be more than happy to introduce the law for ourselves should the EU not have. I am hugely pro-european but things like this make me despair.
meowface 8y ago
Agreed, but Britain also has a pretty bad track record when it comes to surveillance, basic liberties, and Internet freedom. I would not be surprised if they independently pass a similar law in the future.
- shard972 8y ago
  At least you have the ability as a nation to fight back within your nation. With the EU you could convince everyone in your country to vote correctly but still be out of luck unless you convince everyone in 10 others countries as well.
  - philpem 8y ago
    This only really works with governments which give a damn about public perception. If rolling strikes on national infrastructure and marches in the streets won't do it, where next?
briandear 8y ago
When the EU tried to regulate cucumber shapes and tea kettles, that’s when they lost me.

This is an embarrassment and totally changes the colour of my view of brexit in one fell swoop. I would not want to be a member state of an organization that thinks this is remotely ok either.

cultus 8y ago

I wasn't a Brexit fan but the EU seems to make boneheaded decisions like this pretty often. It really does suggest some fundamental structural reform could be in order.

jimnotgym 8y ago
It hasn't made a decision. The EU parliament is just one step.
etatoby 8y ago
The EU in its current shape seems almost purpose-built to detach the decision making process from public scrutiny, influence, and accountability. At the same time, it facilitates lobbying by private interests to a dangerous degree. I don't know whether those responsible for creating it did so on purpose, or by incompetence.

Someguywhatever 8y ago

Lets build a gigantic bureaucracy and allow the most technologically illiterate people to decide weighty matters they haven't the foggiest clue about. What could go possibly go wrong?

_emacsomancer_ 8y ago
I think you just wrote "A Brief History of the World since 1689".
nnain 8y ago
May I use this everytime I describe the Politics+Tech situation in India!

themihai 8y ago

I wonder how UK voted...it seems they supported the this law from the beginning.

jimnotgym 8y ago
The UK hasn't had it's say yet. MEPs from the UK can vote how they like, but the European Parliament is but one stage in the process. National governments go next...
- dudul 8y ago
  National governments are obligated to ratify, and turn into national laws directives and laws coming from Brussels. If they don't they get fined after a certain period of time.
  - themihai 8y ago
    My point was that UK MPs voted/supported this law so it's not really like this law will be forced upon UK thus the argument about Brexit is pointless. I'm pretty sure it will be translated into national law after Brexit.
- themihai 8y ago
  >> The UK hasn't had it's say yet. MEPs from the UK can vote how they like I assumed that MEPs from the UK represent the UK. Isn't that the case?
  - jimnotgym 8y ago
    They represent parts of the UK, and are unlikely to vote as a bloc, representing all sides of political spectrum. The UK is represented as a country on the Council, not in the parliament.
    - themihai 8y ago
      >> They represent parts of the UK, and are unlikely to vote as a bloc, representing all sides of political spectrum. I don't think this changes the fact that UK people voted those MPs and they are expecting to be represented by them in the EU Parliament and vote on laws(i.e. this law) on their behalf.

jimnotgym 8y ago

It hasn't been decided yet. The EU parliament can stop a law, but not force one through. It is still a long way from being ratified

kodablah 8y ago
You've mentioned this multiple times in this thread, unnecessarily. The comment you are responding to said nothing about ratification, only "an organization that thinks this is remotely ok" which qualifies (domestic government hypocrisy notwithstanding).
vsl 8y ago
It is one rubber-stamping, always done, step from becoming law. Closed-doors tri-dialogs always reach a compromise in practice. The parliament always rubber-stamps the outcome (“always” as in there was one case of compromise rejection in years).

mcjiggerlog 8y ago

Except it was supported by both Labour and the Conservatives, so we apparently would be more than happy to introduce the law for ourselves should the EU not have. I am hugely pro-european but things like this make me despair.

meowface 8y ago

Agreed, but Britain also has a pretty bad track record when it comes to surveillance, basic liberties, and Internet freedom. I would not be surprised if they independently pass a similar law in the future.

shard972 8y ago
At least you have the ability as a nation to fight back within your nation. With the EU you could convince everyone in your country to vote correctly but still be out of luck unless you convince everyone in 10 others countries as well.
- philpem 8y ago
  This only really works with governments which give a damn about public perception. If rolling strikes on national infrastructure and marches in the streets won't do it, where next?

briandear 8y ago

When the EU tried to regulate cucumber shapes and tea kettles, that’s when they lost me.