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HN is at least 90% anti-Trump. If you're getting downvoted for a Trump criticism, you've screwed up somewhere other than pissing off the three people on HN who

HN is at least 90% anti-Trump. If you're getting downvoted for a Trump criticism, you've screwed up somewhere other than pissing off the three people on HN who have voting privileges and like Trump. Ok, I can accept that. How did I screw up?

jerf 8y ago
I didn't do it, so I don't know exactly. Possible that "illegals" aren't really a group in the sense that matters? You can choose whether or not to be an illegal; discrimination against innate traits is what really has historically been a problem. It is also valid to infer certain limited things from having the "illegal" status, such as that basically by definition these are people who don't have much regard for the law. (It isn't irrational or invalid to point out that there is a selection process, which I mean in the more-or-less Darwinian sense, that makes it so that illegal immigrants are very likely to have disproportionate numbers of people who are going to break your other laws.) It is, again, not the same as making statements based on immutable characteristics. I'd go so far as to suggest that those who deliberately try to conflate the matter of judging people based on their immutable vs. chosen characteristics are themselves contributing to the problem. If you force people who have problems with the legality of certain immigration procedures to also get themselves declared "racist" or whathaveyou, you shouldn't be surprised when people decide to accept the label instead. "Racism" and other similar labels has lost its sting in large part because it got horribly, horribly overused in places where it was not applicable, and now, surprise surprise, we find ourselves living in a culture where people care less about that label. It was not a good choice to try to spend the political capital the labels had that way.
- mikeash 8y ago
  Discrimination against religion and sexual activities are prominent examples of highly problematic discrimination against things you can choose. Also, people aren’t being called racists because they’re against illegal immigration. They’re being called racist because their stance against illegal immigration is obviously racist (for example, ignoring white illegal immigrants).
luckydata 8y ago
Or maybe you're underestimating the significant number of people working in tech whose empathy skills are definitely below par and sympathize with the right because "the best and smartest always win"?

jerf 8y ago

I didn't do it, so I don't know exactly. Possible that "illegals" aren't really a group in the sense that matters? You can choose whether or not to be an illegal; discrimination against innate traits is what really has historically been a problem. It is also valid to infer certain limited things from having the "illegal" status, such as that basically by definition these are people who don't have much regard for the law. (It isn't irrational or invalid to point out that there is a selection process, which I mean in the more-or-less Darwinian sense, that makes it so that illegal immigrants are very likely to have disproportionate numbers of people who are going to break your other laws.) It is, again, not the same as making statements based on immutable characteristics. I'd go so far as to suggest that those who deliberately try to conflate the matter of judging people based on their immutable vs. chosen characteristics are themselves contributing to the problem. If you force people who have problems with the legality of certain immigration procedures to also get themselves declared "racist" or whathaveyou, you shouldn't be surprised when people decide to accept the label instead. "Racism" and other similar labels has lost its sting in large part because it got horribly, horribly overused in places where it was not applicable, and now, surprise surprise, we find ourselves living in a culture where people care less about that label. It was not a good choice to try to spend the political capital the labels had that way.

mikeash 8y ago
Discrimination against religion and sexual activities are prominent examples of highly problematic discrimination against things you can choose. Also, people aren’t being called racists because they’re against illegal immigration. They’re being called racist because their stance against illegal immigration is obviously racist (for example, ignoring white illegal immigrants).

luckydata 8y ago

Or maybe you're underestimating the significant number of people working in tech whose empathy skills are definitely below par and sympathize with the right because "the best and smartest always win"?