6 ms·

Top cancer researcher fails to disclose corporate ties in major journals

74 points by DrJaws 8y ago

mirimir 8y ago
He's arguably done a better job at disclosure than many politicians and judges, at least. It's not so well known, but judges in the US are courted by monied interests as much as physicians and politicians are. Some decades ago, there was a public-interest site that reported on that, but it got nuked from orbit.
- drdeca 8y ago
  Do you happen to know the URL / if it was archived on internet archive?
  - mirimir 8y ago
    No, sorry. The site had mainly focused on meta-policing stuff. Stories behind crime reporting. Almost police fandom. And then they started hosting FOIA data about financial reporting by judges. And investigative stories about conferences for judges, speaking fees, and so on. Basically the same stuff that's well known for the medical sector. And then the site just disappeared. Edit: Maybe https://www.judicialwatch.org/judicial-financial-disclosure/ https://www.judicialwatch.org/judicial-financial-disclosure/ is a descendant. But damn, they seem rather on the right-wing fringe. Edit: Found it! It was APBnews.com.[0] And it seems that I was wrong. It apparently just disappeared during 2003-2004.[1] I don't have the patience to trawl through all that, to see what they actually said on their site. Also, it seems that the National Law Journal has been publishing redacted disclosure data.[2] 0) https://www.rcfp.org/browse-media-law-resources/news-media-law/news-media-and-law-spring-2000/judges-decide-release-finan https://www.rcfp.org/browse-media-law-resources/news-media-l... 1) https://web.archive.org/web/20000101000000*/APBnews.com https://web.archive.org/web/20000101000000*/APBnews.com 2) https://www.rcfp.org/browse-media-law-resources/news/legal-site-releases-judges-financial-disclosure-data-highlighting-te https://www.rcfp.org/browse-media-law-resources/news/legal-s...
wallace_f 8y ago
Sometimes I wonder if there is any place for monks in modern Western society. We already know certain parts of society need specific protections from other parts of society: professors, journalists, judicial-administrators, etc. Is it a legitimate extension of that concern that certain parts may, at least in part, need protection from other parts of society? I mean... leading scientists from schools like Harvard have knowingly lied to the population about the dangers of things like lead, sugar, etc.
- mirimir 8y ago
  Sure, but "protections"? As they say, money doesn't talk, it swears.
- dragonwriter 8y ago
  > We already know certain parts of society need specific protections from other parts of society [...] > Is it a legitimate extension of that concern that certain parts may, at least in part, need protection from other parts of society? That's not an extension, it's just a restatement, and not even in different words.
  - wallace_f 8y ago
    Yea what I mean is in some sense it seems obviously logical. But I admit the use of the word other does change from one sentence to the other.
user1324345 8y ago
Nothing is ever as it seems with people. Public perception and our methods of assigning legitimacy to public figures is deeply flawed. How any public individuals are we incorrectly demonizing? How many bad ones do we think are good? Surely more than we are currently aware of.
- mirimir 8y ago
  To make it personal, consider that the general practitioner that you see has likely been bribed by the pharmaceutical industry throughout their career. Starting in med school, with free food and toys. But if pressed, they'd all say that gifts don't affect their professional judgment. But in fact, studies have shown that they do. For example:[0] > For years, the evidence has suggested that even small gifts can influence physicians’ behavior, create a mindset of entitlement, and help to promote allegiance to companies and their products. Recently, with the availability of Open Payments data and research made possible by these data, the evidence has become stronger. Using Open Payments data, a 2016 study found that receipt of industry-sponsored meals, even just a single meal, was associated with an increase in the rate of prescribing the brand-name drug that was being promoted. 0) Steinbrook (2017) Physicians, Industry Payments for Food and Beverages, and Drug Prescribing. https://sci-hub.tw/10.1001/jama.2017.2477 https://sci-hub.tw/10.1001/jama.2017.2477
- colordrops 8y ago
  Curious that there's a lot of downvoting of reasonable comments in this thread.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
aviv 8y ago
And people still wonder why it is taking so long to find a "cure". Everyone invovled is incentivized to never actually get to a point where "cancer" is a solved problem. Of course, that is beside the point. One of the most effective treatments remains a series of prolonged dry or water fasts. ~10 and ~40 days respectively. But because no one can patent it or make $3M a year in kickbacks, I doubt it will ever be known to the mainstream in my lifetime.
- saagarjha 8y ago
  There is no one “cure” to cancer. Each cancer requires its own set of treatments.
  - aviv 8y ago
    No. Absolutely not true. There are no 100 types of cancer. This is just the medical world concept of selling you on the equivalent to 100 types of morning cereal. There are of course different locations in the body where these damaged cells are located, but that's all there is to it. We turned a very very simple concept of damaged cells that the body cannot repair using the lymphatic system and flush out of the kidneys due to constant state of acidosis into a trillion dollar boogieman.
    - saagarjha 8y ago
      I am not a medical expert, but as far as I am aware there are different treatments for different cancers, all tailored to be the most effective for that particular type.
- araker 8y ago
  Could you provide some sources to back this claim?
- jeswin 8y ago
  > One of the most effective treatments remains a prolonged dry or water fast. What are the best sources you have seen to support this? I have seen articles via Google, but I'd like to see more sources. (Writing this comment sitting next to a cancer fighter on a 48-hr chemo session.)
Gatsky 8y ago
(I work in this field and have met the subject of the article.) There isn't much to say except he couldn't be bothered. The article tries to find some kind of angle to make this more interesting, but fails. It's sloppy for someone in such a high position, but that's about it. If he had disclosed all his conflicts, the same research would have been published in the same places with the same people. Nothing would have changed. At conferences academic oncologists get up and flash a slide with many conflicts of interest at the start of their talk. Nobody really cares or pays much attention. When it comes to clinical trials, there are many checks and balances that prevent a 'rogue' conflicted investigator from influencing the results. Not the least of these are the other investigators on the study which put their name on the paper, who are free thinking individuals. The data is also collected and analysed by an independent data monitoring committee, who will for example stop the study early if it is looking futile, whatever the drug company thinks should happen. Independent clinical trial staff will also send out teams to hospitals running the trial and inspect the data and talk to the staff. For trials going for regulatory approval of the drug, there is often a formal independent audit which goes even deeper, to the point of interviewing staff in a confidential setting and asking them if they have been coerced for example.
- sixstringbudha 8y ago
  >If he had disclosed all his conflicts, the same research would have been published in the same places with the same people. Nothing would have changed. Speculation. > Nobody really cares or pays much attention. Maybe they should. >When it comes to clinical trials, there are many checks and balances that prevent a 'rogue' conflicted investigator from influencing the results. And you think these checks and balances work good enough, most of the time?
  - rrock 8y ago
    He has to declare his conflicts annually to his institution, and has to provide updates with any new conflicts within 90 days. They would almost certainly have a conflict management plan in place for this situation
- TangoTrotFox 8y ago
danso 8y ago
More than 10 years ago, the NYT [0] and a Mt. Sinai researcher [1] published exposes of doctors being paid heavily by drug companies, after examining the paper records that companies were required to file in the state of Minnesota. That helped spur the creation of the federal Open Payments database (https://www.cms.gov/openpayments/ https://www.cms.gov/openpayments/), which, for a government web-facing database, is actually pretty good. That prominent doctors are still comfortable with flouting the disclosure rules is a nice example of how availability of data and records is still toothless without people (including journalists) being vigilant. [0] https://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/03/health/03docs.html https://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/03/health/03docs.html [1] https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/206127 https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/206127

74 points by DrJaws 8y ago

He's arguably done a better job at disclosure than many politicians and judges, at least. It's not so well known, but judges in the US are courted by monied interests as much as physicians and politicians are. Some decades ago, there was a public-interest site that reported on that, but it got nuked from orbit.

drdeca 8y ago
Do you happen to know the URL / if it was archived on internet archive?
- mirimir 8y ago
  No, sorry. The site had mainly focused on meta-policing stuff. Stories behind crime reporting. Almost police fandom. And then they started hosting FOIA data about financial reporting by judges. And investigative stories about conferences for judges, speaking fees, and so on. Basically the same stuff that's well known for the medical sector. And then the site just disappeared. Edit: Maybe https://www.judicialwatch.org/judicial-financial-disclosure/ https://www.judicialwatch.org/judicial-financial-disclosure/ is a descendant. But damn, they seem rather on the right-wing fringe. Edit: Found it! It was APBnews.com.[0] And it seems that I was wrong. It apparently just disappeared during 2003-2004.[1] I don't have the patience to trawl through all that, to see what they actually said on their site. Also, it seems that the National Law Journal has been publishing redacted disclosure data.[2] 0) https://www.rcfp.org/browse-media-law-resources/news-media-law/news-media-and-law-spring-2000/judges-decide-release-finan https://www.rcfp.org/browse-media-law-resources/news-media-l... 1) https://web.archive.org/web/20000101000000*/APBnews.com https://web.archive.org/web/20000101000000*/APBnews.com 2) https://www.rcfp.org/browse-media-law-resources/news/legal-site-releases-judges-financial-disclosure-data-highlighting-te https://www.rcfp.org/browse-media-law-resources/news/legal-s...

wallace_f 8y ago

Sometimes I wonder if there is any place for monks in modern Western society. We already know certain parts of society need specific protections from other parts of society: professors, journalists, judicial-administrators, etc. Is it a legitimate extension of that concern that certain parts may, at least in part, need protection from other parts of society? I mean... leading scientists from schools like Harvard have knowingly lied to the population about the dangers of things like lead, sugar, etc.

mirimir 8y ago
Sure, but "protections"? As they say, money doesn't talk, it swears.
dragonwriter 8y ago
> We already know certain parts of society need specific protections from other parts of society [...] > Is it a legitimate extension of that concern that certain parts may, at least in part, need protection from other parts of society? That's not an extension, it's just a restatement, and not even in different words.
- wallace_f 8y ago
  Yea what I mean is in some sense it seems obviously logical. But I admit the use of the word other does change from one sentence to the other.

user1324345 8y ago

Nothing is ever as it seems with people. Public perception and our methods of assigning legitimacy to public figures is deeply flawed. How any public individuals are we incorrectly demonizing? How many bad ones do we think are good? Surely more than we are currently aware of.

mirimir 8y ago
To make it personal, consider that the general practitioner that you see has likely been bribed by the pharmaceutical industry throughout their career. Starting in med school, with free food and toys. But if pressed, they'd all say that gifts don't affect their professional judgment. But in fact, studies have shown that they do. For example:[0] > For years, the evidence has suggested that even small gifts can influence physicians’ behavior, create a mindset of entitlement, and help to promote allegiance to companies and their products. Recently, with the availability of Open Payments data and research made possible by these data, the evidence has become stronger. Using Open Payments data, a 2016 study found that receipt of industry-sponsored meals, even just a single meal, was associated with an increase in the rate of prescribing the brand-name drug that was being promoted. 0) Steinbrook (2017) Physicians, Industry Payments for Food and Beverages, and Drug Prescribing. https://sci-hub.tw/10.1001/jama.2017.2477 https://sci-hub.tw/10.1001/jama.2017.2477
colordrops 8y ago
Curious that there's a lot of downvoting of reasonable comments in this thread.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]

aviv 8y ago

And people still wonder why it is taking so long to find a "cure". Everyone invovled is incentivized to never actually get to a point where "cancer" is a solved problem. Of course, that is beside the point. One of the most effective treatments remains a series of prolonged dry or water fasts. ~10 and ~40 days respectively. But because no one can patent it or make $3M a year in kickbacks, I doubt it will ever be known to the mainstream in my lifetime.

saagarjha 8y ago
There is no one “cure” to cancer. Each cancer requires its own set of treatments.
- aviv 8y ago
  No. Absolutely not true. There are no 100 types of cancer. This is just the medical world concept of selling you on the equivalent to 100 types of morning cereal. There are of course different locations in the body where these damaged cells are located, but that's all there is to it. We turned a very very simple concept of damaged cells that the body cannot repair using the lymphatic system and flush out of the kidneys due to constant state of acidosis into a trillion dollar boogieman.
  - saagarjha 8y ago
    I am not a medical expert, but as far as I am aware there are different treatments for different cancers, all tailored to be the most effective for that particular type.
araker 8y ago
Could you provide some sources to back this claim?
jeswin 8y ago
> One of the most effective treatments remains a prolonged dry or water fast. What are the best sources you have seen to support this? I have seen articles via Google, but I'd like to see more sources. (Writing this comment sitting next to a cancer fighter on a 48-hr chemo session.)

Gatsky 8y ago

(I work in this field and have met the subject of the article.) There isn't much to say except he couldn't be bothered. The article tries to find some kind of angle to make this more interesting, but fails. It's sloppy for someone in such a high position, but that's about it. If he had disclosed all his conflicts, the same research would have been published in the same places with the same people. Nothing would have changed. At conferences academic oncologists get up and flash a slide with many conflicts of interest at the start of their talk. Nobody really cares or pays much attention. When it comes to clinical trials, there are many checks and balances that prevent a 'rogue' conflicted investigator from influencing the results. Not the least of these are the other investigators on the study which put their name on the paper, who are free thinking individuals. The data is also collected and analysed by an independent data monitoring committee, who will for example stop the study early if it is looking futile, whatever the drug company thinks should happen. Independent clinical trial staff will also send out teams to hospitals running the trial and inspect the data and talk to the staff. For trials going for regulatory approval of the drug, there is often a formal independent audit which goes even deeper, to the point of interviewing staff in a confidential setting and asking them if they have been coerced for example.

sixstringbudha 8y ago
>If he had disclosed all his conflicts, the same research would have been published in the same places with the same people. Nothing would have changed. Speculation. > Nobody really cares or pays much attention. Maybe they should. >When it comes to clinical trials, there are many checks and balances that prevent a 'rogue' conflicted investigator from influencing the results. And you think these checks and balances work good enough, most of the time?
- rrock 8y ago
  He has to declare his conflicts annually to his institution, and has to provide updates with any new conflicts within 90 days. They would almost certainly have a conflict management plan in place for this situation
TangoTrotFox 8y ago

danso 8y ago

More than 10 years ago, the NYT [0] and a Mt. Sinai researcher [1] published exposes of doctors being paid heavily by drug companies, after examining the paper records that companies were required to file in the state of Minnesota. That helped spur the creation of the federal Open Payments database (https://www.cms.gov/openpayments/ https://www.cms.gov/openpayments/), which, for a government web-facing database, is actually pretty good. That prominent doctors are still comfortable with flouting the disclosure rules is a nice example of how availability of data and records is still toothless without people (including journalists) being vigilant. [0] https://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/03/health/03docs.html https://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/03/health/03docs.html [1] https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/206127 https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/206127