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Intel can’t supply 14nm Xeons, HPE recommends AMD Epyc
- craftyguy 8y ago> The page is marked, “Confidential | HPE Internal & Authorized Partner Use Only” but it is quite open and does not require a login. (Note: We are not linking it because of all the sites that steal our stories, rip us off, and don’t credit) Oh please.
- brink 8y agoIt does seem petty. But I think I'd also be irritated if I found the story, and did the research, only to be undercut by the copy/paste "journalists" that took my credit/traffic.
- joombaga 8y agoThey're lying anyway. It was an email.
- MaryPoppinsYall 8y agoThis advisory came in the form of an email and a webpage.
- TheForumTroll 8y agoI don't think you are aware how much background other writers grab from them and no one credits them, ever. They have a reputation of knowing lots of insider stuff and there's a reason that they can survive with a paywall while hardly anyone else can (I can't think of a singe site writing about hardware that is subscription based?).
- nottorp 8y agoAnd what a paywall! I was reading semiaccurate for the entertainment factor when it was free, now you can't even think of subscribing unless their info actually means money to you.
- DeepYogurt 8y agoCan anyone explain the shortage of 14nm chips? This article simply mentions that most readers are aware of this fact and I am unable to find supporting articles.
- yuhong 8y agoIt is already hitting the news now. The 10nm delays don't help here.
- th0ma5 8y agohttps://www.tomshardware.com/news/14nm-processor-intel-shortage-9000-series,37746.html https://www.tomshardware.com/news/14nm-processor-intel-short...
- tristanj 8y agohttps://www.tomshardware.com/news/14nm-processor-intel-shortage-9000-series,37746.html https://www.tomshardware.com/news/14nm-processor-intel-short... Because Intel's 10nm process is delayed, their 14nm fab is overbooked leading to a chip shortage.
- dman 8y agoBut isnt the positive spin on that they are selling every chip they could make?
- agumonkey 8y agoit is as a first layer analysis, but it's a fault for such a large company not to have fallback buffers to avoid short supply
- hajile 8y agoNo. Two fabs output more chips than one fab. Intel has deals with other companies for both 10nm and 14nm production and some of those deals are undoubtedly based on Intel moving their own chips to 10nm. At capacity and unable to increase as expected means customers move to other companies that make compatible, competitive products. Once those companies move, they may not come back. This is quite a bad position to be in.
- LinuxBender 8y agoHow many server models have HP and Dell switched to using Epyc?
- JohannFlobuster 8y agoHPE Solution Architect here -- HPE has 4 lines, 3 public / 1 private. DL385 and DL325 are rack based servers aka traditional pizza box. DL385 is your workhorse platform. DL325 is a 1P design based for heavy PCIe connected (read: NVMe) devices. The CL3150 is a cloudline server and will likely be more consumed in the service provider space, in my opinion. The Apollo 35 is available to top 200 volume accounts (which has been annouced publicly, but is not available to your everyday customer.) This type [of information leak] is my worst nightmare as someone who works with resellers, letting these types of documents in the wrong hands or somehow access is breached like this. Edit 2: I am a server SA, MASE. I configure servers all the time. If customer demand shows the swap, you could see the proc move over to other lines, such as blades and the HPC markets.
- spilk 8y agoI'm not super familiar with HPE's product lines but I'm just kind of surprised they are still using the Apollo name. Maybe we'll see some Silicon Graphics branded HP gear too?
- JohannFlobuster 8y agoSGI stuff is already rebranded to the apollo name and Superdome Flex (UV300 I think it was before) Depending on your SGI server, the name may have gone into the appropriate HPE family name. If you need help with our new decoder ring, I'd be happy to point you in the right direction. I expect HPC workloads to take advantage of AMD chips, but I do expect many of the mathematical improvements that the Skylake instruction set provides to amplify desire in the computational HPC/numerical computation/ non-GPU stuff.
- LinuxBender 8y agoVery nice. I will make sure our server teams know they can get Epyc. Hopefully we are already testing the Spectre impact on Xeon vx. Epyc.
- peterwwillis 8y agoI didn't know HPE was hiring male models to be cage monkeys: https://www.semiaccurate.com/assets/uploads/2018/09/HPE_Xeon_supply_page_1.jpg https://www.semiaccurate.com/assets/uploads/2018/09/HPE_Xeon... I guess it's as good a side gig as any.
- Twirrim 8y agoThat's an interesting assumption you're making. If you're good looking, you can't possibly be working in tech as your full time gig.
- kbenson 8y agoWell, I know if I was that good looking and had my same intelligence, I think I could do a lot better...
- gboudrias 8y agoMaybe they... Like working there?
- Twirrim 8y agoAhh of course, because if you're good looking, you can't possibly enjoy working with tech, want a career in that field, or perish the thought, not actually like modelling.
- kbenson 8y agoYou're making a lot of assumptions. 1. That working in tech is the only way to enjoy the tech community. 2. That the "cage-monkey" job described at the top of thread is as good as it gets, and that aspiring to do something else means something non-tech. 3. That good looks and some other job necessarily means modeling. Look. I was clear to indicate it was what I would do, and also to indicate that I would have the same intelligence. What I was trying to imply is that based on inherent cultural (and likely neurological) bias towards good looking people and symmetrical faces, I would prefer to leverage that natural benefit into a better position, or something I liked doing better. Because I've been a cage-monkey before. It's better than a lot of things, but it sucks in a lot of ways too. Spending large amounts of time in a very loud and very cold room using crappy crash-kart setups to do emergency maintenance on systems sucks. Racking equipment and running cables is actually the fun part. So, I understand you were probably conditioned to assume the worst given the thread and how your initial response, but please, it isn't warranted.
- faragon 8y agoIntel previous technology to 14nm is 22nm (2011 [1]) [1] https://en.wikichip.org/wiki/intel/process https://en.wikichip.org/wiki/intel/process
- trhway 8y agoback in 2002 it was a struggle for AMD to sign up any big one to offer servers with Opteron chips. This time it looks different.
- cestith 8y agoDell's had some PowerEdge models available for a while now.
- micv 8y agoOpteron servers were the absolute business for a few years in the mid/late 2000s. They were a preferred supplier for a few years while Intel wallowed. 2002 was before my time, but that was the era of SPARC in the business I work in.
- zachruss92 8y agoHonestly, this seems like another instance of Intel dropping the ball, and AMD is more than happy to pick up the slack. AMD is already testing their 7nm Epyc chips with OEMs to be released Q1'19. My takeaway from this is that server manufacturers are starting to recommend Epyc is a solution which will increase AMD's market share. This will just create more competition between Red and Blue which will give consumers faster innovation and better prices.
- martin1975 8y agoFeels a bit like Apple's resurrection from the dead when Jobs came back to take the helm after having been 'fired'... now AMD is eating Intel's pie left right and center.
- xattt 8y agoAre there specific people that are back at AMD that had not been there during the last decade?
- pgeorgi 8y agoJim Keller had a stint there. Just like with AMD K8, he flew in, saved the day with Zen, then moved to greener pastures. Just that this time, these pastures are at Intel, so who knows what'll happen?
- martin1975 8y agothe new CEO, her name eludes me, a Chinese lady, she's very much responsible for AMD's recent success and capitalizing on Intel's mistakes
- ericpauley 8y agoLisa Su!
- dragontamer 8y agoWikipedia says Lisa Su is Taiwanese-American. Rumor is that she's somehow related to NVidia's chief. Like 2nd cousins or 3rd niece / something-something removed or something of that nature. Just for some delicious irony. EDIT: Found it. Jen-Hsun Huang is apparently her Uncle. https://babeltechreviews.com/nvidias-ceo-is-the-uncle-of-amds-ceo/ https://babeltechreviews.com/nvidias-ceo-is-the-uncle-of-amd... > Technically, Lisa Su’s grandfather is Jen-Hsun Huang’s uncle. They are not exactly niece and uncle, but close relatives.
- ksec 8y ago
- gumby 8y agoI really think Intel lost its way back in the Barrett era and never managed to find it (and I think AMD is really significantly exceeding its historical trend line right now) but despite all that I am dubious about semiaccurate. Looking back at other submissions from that site ( https://news.ycombinator.com/from?site=semiaccurate.com https://news.ycombinator.com/from?site=semiaccurate.com ) it appears many HN readers are too. Based (only) on the submissions, it looks a bit like an AMD fan site.
- dnomad 8y agoSemiaccurrate is a well-known anti-Intel propaganda mill. Don't just look at the HN posts, google the endless stream of anti-Intel stories it publishes. ([1] is a recent favorite.) The stories get voted up HN and reddit because they tell people what they want to hear. [1] https://semiaccurate.com/2018/08/07/intel-has-no-chance-in-servers-and-they-know-it/ https://semiaccurate.com/2018/08/07/intel-has-no-chance-in-s...
- throwaway2048 8y agoSemi accurate most definitely has a big bias against Intel, but they are pretty open with it. They have a ton of insider information that nobody else does, there is a reason they have an insanely expensive paywall, and people gladly pay it.
- dnomad 8y agoIf you compare the years and years of antt-Intel articles against an objective measure (say Intel's revenue or its price action) a reasonable person would not conclude anything but that the site has an extreme anti-Intel bias and peddles conspiracy theories that have zero predictive power and nobody would read it. (See also Infowars, all tabloid journalism.) The reason this never happens is because the people who read this stuff aren't actually concerned with reality or the actual prospects of Intel. It's an interesting kind of market "failure" where people are demanding a broken product and that's exactly what they get.
- unethical_ban 8y ago
- acd 8y agoArm chips will most likely replace Intel even for servers. I think we may se massive core count with lower clocked frequency chips as die shrink will be come too expensive. “Rock's law or Moore's second law, named for Arthur Rock or Gordon Moore, says that the cost of a semiconductor chip fabrication plant doubles every four years“ https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moore%27s_second_law https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moore%27s_second_law
- cbHXBY1D 8y agoThat's the idea behind Esperanto's 4096 core RISC-V CPU. It's run by Dave Ditzel and the creator of BOOM CPU.
- vardump 8y agoCPU side channel attacks, speculative execution leaks, throttling and cache effects, might eventually benefit the ARM server camp. Maybe instead of virtual machines we'll end up running (some) workloads on cheap, low power and isolated ARM CPUs, directly on bare metal without potentially leaky virtualization. Something like 4-16 GB of ECC RAM over 1-2 channels, quad core Cortex A73, A76 or similar. (Some ARMv8 designs are actually not that far behind of x86 chips in scalar performance anymore. SIMD (vector integer/floating point) is another matter, but I guess it's not impossible to slap a few 256 or 512 bits wide SIMD units in ARM designs.)
- chasil 8y agoI see this as unlikely. ARM was very late to the game with a 64-bit isa. With a completely free competitor in risc-v, and not much market penetration, what is the motivation for a customer to pay the licensing fees?
- lmz 8y agoVery nice of them not to blur out the email recipient's address at the bottom of the email :)
- exikyut 8y agoNo, I can't imagine that not being a major goof. SA may have just lost a source, or at least some goodwill. It's entirely possible this was deliberate but I call it unlikely.
- tanilama 8y agoWhat is wrong with Intel...Haven't seen this level of inaction from a major firm for a while.
- 0xcde4c3db 8y agoAs far as I've heard it's not really inaction, but that their 10nm process has been plagued with issues, being "ready next year" for about 3 years (with no terribly convincing signs that 2019 will be the actual year, either). This has presumably played hell with their product development and fab capacity plans.
- beerlord 8y agoLike what happens at any big monopoly... sales and marketing are prioritised over product development. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1rXqD6M614 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1rXqD6M614
- pome 8y ago++.
- leadingthenet 8y agoI knew what it was before I clicked, but I still watched it to the end. He was a really smart guy.
- mtgx 8y agoThey don't even have a CEO now. But the troubles started years before. They got fat, lazy, and greedy, basically. And then they started messing up the technical stuff, too, as we're seeing now with their 10nm node.
- Symmetry 8y agoSemiaccurate had a pretty in-depth article on the recent management a while back but the site is down and I think it was paywalled anyways.
- aidenn0 8y agoIs it me, or did SA leave Aaron Weston's e-mail address in the image?
- ItsTotallyOn 8y agoIntel used to keep less important products, like chipsets, on trailing nodes (right now, that's 22nm). Now the company is fabbing the chipsets on 14nm, too. That's mainly because of the late move to 10nm. Intel's processors SHOULD be on 10nm, but they aren't, so chipsets are eating into 14nm production capacity. Intel has to create one chipset for each processor produced (in most cases), so this adds up to a lot of chips.
- lolc 8y agoThis reads like a hit-piece. What are the relative volumes of Xeon versu Epyc? that would be kinda important to know. Maybe I just didn't see them mentioned in the article.
- chx 8y agoThe actual newsletter is on this page https://h41360.www4.hpe.com/partner-news/cat-enterprise.php https://h41360.www4.hpe.com/partner-news/cat-enterprise.php