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Lack of highrise developments is what makes those areas attractive in the first place. Berlin has plenty highrise residential, yet Google and the like are decid

by usrusr 8y ago

Lack of highrise developments is what makes those areas attractive in the first place. Berlin has plenty highrise residential, yet Google and the like are decidedly avoiding those areas. Converting more of the cityscape into the kind of area where neither Google nor the protestors would want to be would make the situation worse, not better. Also, it's quite possible that you widely underestimate the existing density, this is no single family sprawl we are talking about.

Xylakant 8y ago
One of the problems in Berlin is that dense residential areas cluster at the edges of the town and office space tends to cluster at the center. So now, if you want to have an office in Berlin and are a company that has more than a handful of employees, people will come from all sides of town, so you'd preferably want office space in the center - which gradually eats up all space that could have been used for housing in the center. Old buildings that could have been refurbished into flats are turned into offices since that's currently more profitable. There's little really high-density living space in central Berlin.
- usrusr 8y ago
  Berlin has a center? Last time I checked (Sunday), it was still more like an eye of the storm kind of void. But that's perfectly consistent with your finer point, if you could somehow restrict your employees to roughly one quadrant, many things would be much easier. That will never happen of course.
  - Xylakant 8y ago
    Well, Berlin has a geographic center. It doesn’t have a center in any kind of sense that the social life happens around there, you’re right in hat regard. There’s also the mystic “Innerhalb des S-Bahn-Rings”.
checkyoursudo 8y ago
> Lack of highrise developments is what makes those areas attractive in the first place. Why? Aesthetics? Google-type people don't want to live in high-rises? I don't think I've ever heard anyone say they aren't willing even to live near high-rises. That's a new one to me.
- brewdad 8y ago
  In the neighborhoods of Portland, residents are absolutely flipping out over mid-rise developments. In many areas, single family homes on corner lots are being torn down and replaced by 3-4 story apartment buildings. Neighborhood associations are very much up in arms against these developments that alter the "character of the neighborhood". Often these new buildings are shorter than the trees around them, but still they are considered "out of place".
  - checkyoursudo 8y ago
    And I would assume those people wouldn't want a multistory office building being built in their neighborhoods as well? What I don't understand is, as the parent comment seems to suggest, that a company like Google wouldn't locate near a locale with existing high-rises? I realize I may be misunderstanding. I fully understand that there are plenty of people who don't want development in their neighborhoods. I've just never heard the idea that some critical mass of employees would not want to live in or even work near already existing high rises such that a company would deem locating in such a place to be unacceptable. Does that make sense? Like, would a lot of potential Google engineers not take high-pay, high-prestige jobs at a Google site that is located in the middle of a bunch of high-rise apartments in a boring city? Or are all Google engineers just really super cool and fun and adventurous while also only tolerating low-slung buildings? I'm really curious--not at all being sarcastic.
TulliusCicero 8y ago
If people want it to be illegal for Google and similar companies to move in there or redevelop it, that's possible. I'm not sure that's such a good idea, but it can be done. Getting mad at Google for doing something that's a good idea for their business, is entirely within the law, and is generally ethical behavior (unless you think opening new offices or redeveloping urban areas is generally unethical somehow) is silly. Like, the government has the power to change how something is zoned, do they not? And the government is elected by the people. And it's not like anyone thinks that no new buildings should ever go up in cities, so the clear solution here is for people to vote/apply political pressure to protect this particular area. That's the government's job.

by usrusr 8y ago

Xylakant 8y ago

One of the problems in Berlin is that dense residential areas cluster at the edges of the town and office space tends to cluster at the center. So now, if you want to have an office in Berlin and are a company that has more than a handful of employees, people will come from all sides of town, so you'd preferably want office space in the center - which gradually eats up all space that could have been used for housing in the center. Old buildings that could have been refurbished into flats are turned into offices since that's currently more profitable. There's little really high-density living space in central Berlin.

usrusr 8y ago
Berlin has a center? Last time I checked (Sunday), it was still more like an eye of the storm kind of void. But that's perfectly consistent with your finer point, if you could somehow restrict your employees to roughly one quadrant, many things would be much easier. That will never happen of course.
- Xylakant 8y ago
  Well, Berlin has a geographic center. It doesn’t have a center in any kind of sense that the social life happens around there, you’re right in hat regard. There’s also the mystic “Innerhalb des S-Bahn-Rings”.

checkyoursudo 8y ago

> Lack of highrise developments is what makes those areas attractive in the first place. Why? Aesthetics? Google-type people don't want to live in high-rises? I don't think I've ever heard anyone say they aren't willing even to live near high-rises. That's a new one to me.

brewdad 8y ago
In the neighborhoods of Portland, residents are absolutely flipping out over mid-rise developments. In many areas, single family homes on corner lots are being torn down and replaced by 3-4 story apartment buildings. Neighborhood associations are very much up in arms against these developments that alter the "character of the neighborhood". Often these new buildings are shorter than the trees around them, but still they are considered "out of place".
- checkyoursudo 8y ago
  And I would assume those people wouldn't want a multistory office building being built in their neighborhoods as well? What I don't understand is, as the parent comment seems to suggest, that a company like Google wouldn't locate near a locale with existing high-rises? I realize I may be misunderstanding. I fully understand that there are plenty of people who don't want development in their neighborhoods. I've just never heard the idea that some critical mass of employees would not want to live in or even work near already existing high rises such that a company would deem locating in such a place to be unacceptable. Does that make sense? Like, would a lot of potential Google engineers not take high-pay, high-prestige jobs at a Google site that is located in the middle of a bunch of high-rise apartments in a boring city? Or are all Google engineers just really super cool and fun and adventurous while also only tolerating low-slung buildings? I'm really curious--not at all being sarcastic.

TulliusCicero 8y ago

If people want it to be illegal for Google and similar companies to move in there or redevelop it, that's possible. I'm not sure that's such a good idea, but it can be done. Getting mad at Google for doing something that's a good idea for their business, is entirely within the law, and is generally ethical behavior (unless you think opening new offices or redeveloping urban areas is generally unethical somehow) is silly. Like, the government has the power to change how something is zoned, do they not? And the government is elected by the people. And it's not like anyone thinks that no new buildings should ever go up in cities, so the clear solution here is for people to vote/apply political pressure to protect this particular area. That's the government's job.