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There are a lot of dark patterns Google could use to track you if it wanted to. Does it? Who can say besides those on the inside. If you think they're using thi

There are a lot of dark patterns Google could use to track you if it wanted to. Does it? Who can say besides those on the inside. If you think they're using this, then there are probably half a dozen other methods you also think they are using, so this shouldn't bother you (at least, not any more than you are already bothered). If you don't think they're using any of those half a dozen other methods, you probably shouldn't worry about this one too much either.

auslander 8y ago
> ... if it wanted to Made me smile. Google needs to track you, its their core business model. Defeat is not an option, all methods should be found and blocked. Thankfully Chrome is not the only usable browser, and network requests are detectable.
- stubish 8y ago
  Google does not need to track anyone. Google needs to sell ads, and Google needs to be perceived as the best place to spend your advertising budged. What business case is there for Google to work hard at tracking people, defeating anti-tracking measures? There is a cost to doing that, and I don't see a financial incentive for doing it. There are certainly business cases for Google to not defeat anti-tracking measures, as collecting that sort of data is a liability. However, per previous lawsuits like the mapping cars sniffing WIFI data, perhaps they are still just trying to collect everything they can without thought to if it is a benefit, waste, or liability.
  - auslander 8y ago
    Keyword is targeted ads, it revolutionised the market and made FB and Google rich. The only way to sell an ad placement to white males, with >100k income, in this zip code, with specific health problem is to track those people, and Google tracks them all. FB gets data from your posts and messages, Google gets it from your emails, files, searches, location. Both get data from your browsing history (Like buttons, G-Analytics scripts), as do all the rest of third party trackers (cookies).
    - deleted 8y ago
      [deleted]
    - cromwellian 8y ago
      Google makes most of their money from AdWords which is keyword targeted advertising buy and large. People way overestimate the helpfulness of profile targeted advertising vs search term targeted ads.
      - auslander 8y ago
        Without real numbers, like AdWords vs Profile Ads, one has to rely on common sense, in my sense, profiling is a gold mine. Below is a random quote I Googled up :) In practice, this means that Google can now, if it wanted to, build up even richer profiles of named individuals’ online activity. It also means that the DoubleClick ads that follow people on the web could be personalized based on the keywords that individuals use in Gmail. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/oct/21/how-to-disable-google-ad-tracking-gmail-youtube-browser-history https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/oct/21/how-to-di... What about Adwords Customer Match, identity-based targeting ? (updated in 2018, by Erin Sagin is the Global SMB Solutions Go To Market Lead at Google) https://www.wordstream.com/blog/ws/2015/11/02/adwords-customer-match-setup https://www.wordstream.com/blog/ws/2015/11/02/adwords-custom...
  - auslander 8y ago
    All of them use your IP address as major identifier (4). UnGoogling Guide, v0.1 :) 1. Switch everything to Apple, hardware company. iPhone, Mac OS 2. Use myname@icloud.com email, create few email aliases. Forward your gmail to it, and finally delete gmail accounts. 3. Don't use any of Googles software, like Chrome. Install adbocker extention/app and use Private Browsing windows by default 4. Buy a VPN subscription and set up your phone and Mac to always use it (on-demand).
    - auslander 8y ago
      (4) Gmail and Facebook will complain that you're logging in from 'unknown device', meaning not from IP they recorded on you. Set up MFA to get around it, like FreeOTP mobile app to generate codes.
rayvy 8y ago
> There are a lot of dark patterns Google could use to track you if it wanted to Could you elaborate here? I'm primarily only aware of cookies and javascript/pixels, but I'm sure there are much more elaborate ways.
- chrismorgan 8y ago
  Here’s one way: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTTP_ETag#Tracking_using_ETags https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTTP_ETag#Tracking_using_ETags
- auslander 8y ago
  blog.mozilla.org/security/2018/01/31/preventing-data-leaks-by-stripping-path-information-in-http-referrers/
- asdfasgasdgasdg 8y ago
  There are a variety of them. Cookies are obvious, but even if you block those, there are a variety of techniques to enable server-side super cookies, where you are taking a fingerprint of the browser and storing the information on the server (e.g. https://amiunique.org/fp https://amiunique.org/fp). And that's not even counting stuff you can do with no cooperation from the user-agent at all. You can do a lot of deanonymization using IP blocks, time of day, and behavior analysis. I'm not an expert. There's a lot of stuff here that you can read about if you dig in to it. Personally, I don't believe that Google is doing much if any of this stuff, because I think they rightly believe that if it were discovered that they are, it would go poorly for them in the public sphere.

auslander 8y ago

> ... if it wanted to Made me smile. Google needs to track you, its their core business model. Defeat is not an option, all methods should be found and blocked. Thankfully Chrome is not the only usable browser, and network requests are detectable.

stubish 8y ago
Google does not need to track anyone. Google needs to sell ads, and Google needs to be perceived as the best place to spend your advertising budged. What business case is there for Google to work hard at tracking people, defeating anti-tracking measures? There is a cost to doing that, and I don't see a financial incentive for doing it. There are certainly business cases for Google to not defeat anti-tracking measures, as collecting that sort of data is a liability. However, per previous lawsuits like the mapping cars sniffing WIFI data, perhaps they are still just trying to collect everything they can without thought to if it is a benefit, waste, or liability.
- auslander 8y ago
  Keyword is targeted ads, it revolutionised the market and made FB and Google rich. The only way to sell an ad placement to white males, with >100k income, in this zip code, with specific health problem is to track those people, and Google tracks them all. FB gets data from your posts and messages, Google gets it from your emails, files, searches, location. Both get data from your browsing history (Like buttons, G-Analytics scripts), as do all the rest of third party trackers (cookies).
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - cromwellian 8y ago
    Google makes most of their money from AdWords which is keyword targeted advertising buy and large. People way overestimate the helpfulness of profile targeted advertising vs search term targeted ads.
    - auslander 8y ago
      Without real numbers, like AdWords vs Profile Ads, one has to rely on common sense, in my sense, profiling is a gold mine. Below is a random quote I Googled up :) In practice, this means that Google can now, if it wanted to, build up even richer profiles of named individuals’ online activity. It also means that the DoubleClick ads that follow people on the web could be personalized based on the keywords that individuals use in Gmail. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/oct/21/how-to-disable-google-ad-tracking-gmail-youtube-browser-history https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/oct/21/how-to-di... What about Adwords Customer Match, identity-based targeting ? (updated in 2018, by Erin Sagin is the Global SMB Solutions Go To Market Lead at Google) https://www.wordstream.com/blog/ws/2015/11/02/adwords-customer-match-setup https://www.wordstream.com/blog/ws/2015/11/02/adwords-custom...
- auslander 8y ago
  All of them use your IP address as major identifier (4). UnGoogling Guide, v0.1 :) 1. Switch everything to Apple, hardware company. iPhone, Mac OS 2. Use myname@icloud.com email, create few email aliases. Forward your gmail to it, and finally delete gmail accounts. 3. Don't use any of Googles software, like Chrome. Install adbocker extention/app and use Private Browsing windows by default 4. Buy a VPN subscription and set up your phone and Mac to always use it (on-demand).
  - auslander 8y ago
    (4) Gmail and Facebook will complain that you're logging in from 'unknown device', meaning not from IP they recorded on you. Set up MFA to get around it, like FreeOTP mobile app to generate codes.

rayvy 8y ago

> There are a lot of dark patterns Google could use to track you if it wanted to Could you elaborate here? I'm primarily only aware of cookies and javascript/pixels, but I'm sure there are much more elaborate ways.

chrismorgan 8y ago
Here’s one way: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTTP_ETag#Tracking_using_ETags https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTTP_ETag#Tracking_using_ETags
auslander 8y ago
blog.mozilla.org/security/2018/01/31/preventing-data-leaks-by-stripping-path-information-in-http-referrers/
asdfasgasdgasdg 8y ago
There are a variety of them. Cookies are obvious, but even if you block those, there are a variety of techniques to enable server-side super cookies, where you are taking a fingerprint of the browser and storing the information on the server (e.g. https://amiunique.org/fp https://amiunique.org/fp). And that's not even counting stuff you can do with no cooperation from the user-agent at all. You can do a lot of deanonymization using IP blocks, time of day, and behavior analysis. I'm not an expert. There's a lot of stuff here that you can read about if you dig in to it. Personally, I don't believe that Google is doing much if any of this stuff, because I think they rightly believe that if it were discovered that they are, it would go poorly for them in the public sphere.