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Sheldon S. Cohen, IRS commissioner who computerized agency, dies at 91
- Animats 8y agoThe "Martinsburg Monster". It was a huge win for the IRS when they could crosscheck the employer's tax info filed for employees with the employee's filing with the IRS.
- coldtea 8y agoIRS? So, morally kind of like the guy who computerized dissident tracking in USSR.
- Retric 8y agoComplaining about the IRS is like complaining about the government’s audacity to build roads. If you don’t like taxes blame congress, the IRS like the police just quietly avoids anarchy.
- patrickaljord 8y agoNot a libertarian myself but I suppose OP is. You do realize that the "roads" argument is probably the worst one you could use against a libertarian? It's basically an in-joke in libertarian circles. It's kind of like quoting the bible as an argument when arguing with an atheist, not very convincing.
- majos 8y agoWhat's so laughable about roads?
- patrickaljord 8y agoNot sure it's a good place to have a debate on this, maybe you should ask in a libertarian forum. First link that comes on google when you search for it is this link https://beinglibertarian.com/no-one-talks-regarding-muh-roads/ https://beinglibertarian.com/no-one-talks-regarding-muh-road...
- rando444 8y agoYou should at least read an article yourself before you share it with others. That article is about how roads are used, not how they are built. In fact that article even argues that it's perfectly fine for the government to be responsible for building roads.
- patrickaljord 8y agoThe libertarian argument is that the government is not the only one that can or should build roads.
- dragonwriter 8y agoSome (but far from all) libertarians believe that government should not build, own, or maintain roads (including directing those things or enabling them through the exercise of compulsory powers like eminent domain), but that private parties should privately acquire land via the market, build roads, and operate them as supported by the market, either for their own direct use or by selling access to other users.
- coldtea 8y agoNot a libertarian exactly, I'm even in favor of social welfare programs etc, but against the gradual enlargement of taxation beyond all control. Even under the worst rulers, for most of history, it has usually been at 10% of income. Used wisely (and without a huge bureaucracy that finds busy work - including military such, and corrupt healthcare pricing) it should be enough to fund basic government, schools, and so on. For roads, there are tolls and vehicle fees and so on. For pensions and healthcare, we have a special percentage held directly from the salary (at least in my parts). For electricity and telecommunication we pay bills (and still give huge subsidies). There are also municipal taxes for city level stuff.
- Retric 8y agoThe US like most countries use a toll system for their roads. You can avoid the toll by getting a dyed version of gas that’s illegal to use on public roads. It’s not perfect, but it’s very cheap to implement and electric cars are going to force the system to do something else. https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employed/fuel-and-road-use-tax-agriculture-tax-tips https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employe...
- stochastic_monk 8y agoFor a small subset of their roads, not all of them.
- nerdponx 8y agoI think they're talking about using aviation gasoline instead of automotive gasoline, which are identical except the latter is taxed federally and the former is dyed blue.
- dmm 8y ago> Used wisely Federal mandatory spending was $2.5 trillion in 2017. Mandatory spending includes social security, medicare, medicaid, unemploy. comp., veterans benefits, EIC, etc. Interest on the debt was $263 billion. Defense spending was $590 billion. Just those categories $2.5 + $.263 + $.590 = $3.353 Trillion Federal revenue in 2017, including payroll and income taxes, was $3.3 Trillion. Just those three categories exceed total revenue and the remaining budget, non-defense discretionary, spending was just $610 billion. Everybody hates taxes and just about everyone thinks the government is too bloated. Politicians love arguing about stupid piddly $10 million programs but real spending changes would be very, very painful. What I'm saying is I don't see a path toward to world you're describing. For example, > For pensions ... percentage held directly from the salary That's great and it can make a lot of sense. But how do we get there? Right now we have social security funded by payroll taxes. Those taxes alone exceed your ideal 10% tax rate for most. We can't remove those payroll taxes because what would fund social security? We can't remove social security because what would happen to the people dependent and soon to be dependent on it?
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- qubax 8y agoMore like complaining about government's audacity to spy on and take from citizens. IRS takes from citizens, it doesn't do anything for citizens. > If you don’t like taxes blame congress, the IRS like the police just quietly avoids anarchy. You can't be serious. For most of our history, we didn't have an IRS. We didn't live in anarchy. Nobody is against taxes. We had taxes before IRS existed. And if the IRS disappears, we'll still have taxes. Not only that, income tax unfairly penalizes the middle class workers while the wealthy are not ( income tax rates are much higher than the capital gain rate ). Income taxes aren't used to build roads. We have gas tax for that. Income tax is used to fund wars and to line the pockets of politicians and bureaucrats.
- coldtea 8y ago>Nobody is against taxes. We had taxes before IRS existed. Yeah, but not for that long: "The United States imposed income taxes briefly during the Civil War and the 1890s. In 1913, the 16th Amendment was ratified, permanently legalizing an income tax."
- qubax 8y agoThere are other forms of taxation beyond income tax. Sales tax, property tax, etc.
- Retric 8y agoIRS handles more than just income taxes.
- mhh__ 8y agoOne mans terrorist is another man's freedom fighter, I suppose.
- sctb 8y agoCould you please work a little harder to stick to substance?
- lowry 8y agoHow can a single guy computerize the whole IRS? It probably just "happened" while he was its head. It would have happened anyway. Because progress.
- iainmerrick 8y agoDo you know what managers do?
- wffurr 8y agoYeah, take credit for other people's work and pay themselves big bonuses for doing it.
- williamdclt 8y agoThis lack of respect shows not only that you're an ass, but also that you're very short-sighted. Being blind to the skills required for people management and the role of it in a company is a huge red flag. Sure there's bad managers, but there's bad apples in every profession (CS/SE is very far from being exempt)
- stochastic_monk 8y agoYou’re not wrong, but there wasn’t a need to name call.
- wffurr 8y agoPardon me while I fail to have respect for the Baron of the manor ahem I mean the mid-level manager. Have fun toeing the line and being tossed scraps from the table.
- dragonwriter 8y ago> Pardon me while I fail to have respect for [...] thed-level manager The manager specifically being discussed was the Commissioner of the Internal Revenue Service, not a “mid-level manager”.
- russfink 8y ago"91?" Beg your pardon, but this computer guy was in his fifties. 0x51 to be precise.
- chx 8y agoThe big question: how do you modernize the Master Files? I know there are proxies in front but as far as I am aware (from a report like two years ago) the original codebase is still humming along.
- nerdponx 8y agoWhat an interesting character. Mr. Cohen admitted in a letter to Long that the extent of wiretapping was far more extensive than initially revealed. By his count, the IRS had made “improper” and “questionable” use of wiretapping 287 times between 1958 and 1966, mostly owing to the “overzealousness on the part of certain personnel engaged in the investigation of the criminal element.” Although his sparring with Long generated negative headlines, Mr. Cohen said it was far from his greatest concern during his four-year tenure. “The most embarrassing thing that happened to me in office was that millions of persons below the poverty line had to pay taxes,” he said in 1969 as he championed a system in which the poorest Americans would not pay income taxes.