4 ms·

While there may be negative examples as you are asking for. There are also many positive examples, I think GDPR is an excellent one. I would also ask for people

by QasimK 8y ago

While there may be negative examples as you are asking for. There are also many positive examples, I think GDPR is an excellent one. I would also ask for people to share the positive ones, lest we go to sleep in misery.

arcbyte 8y ago
GDPR as a positive example? Huh?
- jimnotgym 8y ago
  For a person it is a really great law yes. For a data-farming corporation, less so, but that is not what he OP asked
  - paxy 8y ago
    Large data-farming corporations can and will continue operating in Europe, since they are the only ones that have the resources to understand the law, find limits and loopholes, pay fines, make major changes to their systems etc. Smaller companies and startups are the ones who will suffer.
    - gpvos 8y ago
      Only if they want to data farm. And while there are probably loopholes, I'd be interested to hear of any.
  - darawk 8y ago
    As far as I can tell the only impact GDPR has had on my life is that there are a lot more annoying popups for me to mindlessly click 'accept' on.
    - StavrosK 8y ago
      Really? Then you aren't using it at all. The impact it's had on my life is that companies have to tell me what they're doing with my data. If I say no, they have to refrain from using it, they can't just say "well tough luck, we have it now". If I give my email for a contest, they can't keep spamming me with crap. If I tell them to forget I exist, they have to do it. If I want to see what Facebook knows about me, it has to tell me everything. As someone who runs dozens of side-projects with thousands of users, I didn't even have to change anything. All it took was to not be shitty to begin with.
      - darawk 8y ago
        > The impact it's had on my life is that companies have to tell me what they're doing with my data Have you learned anything interesting from that? > If I say no, they have to refrain from using it, they can't just say "well tough luck, we have it now". Have you been doing that? > If I give my email for a contest, they can't keep spamming me with crap. That was already a thing in the US: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAN-SPAM_Act_of_2003 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAN-SPAM_Act_of_2003 > If I tell them to forget I exist, they have to do it. That could be useful, I suppose. Although to be honest, it's likely to be used to erase bad behavior that we'd rather have public much more than any legitimate privacy concern, i'd guess.
        StavrosK 8y ago
        > Have you learned anything interesting from that? No, the few I asked turned out to have as much data as I shared, which is almost nothing. > Have you been doing that? Yep. > That was already a thing in the US: Good to know. > it's likely to be used to erase bad behavior that we'd rather have public much more than any legitimate privacy concern, i'd guess. I'm not sure I agree with that, but I also don't agree that people's bad behaviour should remain public forever.
      - erik_seaberg 8y ago
        The law is not merely a list of bad things you can't do. Many of its 99 sections require new bureaucratic procedures like "hire a data protection officer to write an impact assessment and wait eight to fourteen weeks for an official response" that you almost certainly weren't already doing.
  - Aunche 8y ago
    Does it really help the regular person? I've yet to hear an example of a real world problem that GDPR could have prevented.
    - pluma 8y ago
      Cambridge Analytica would have blatantly violated the GDPR, so there's that.
  - kodablah 8y ago
    All corporations that spent money on compliance, their customers, their employees, etc. It's becoming very annoying to see proponents of the legislation act like it only impacts one type of tech company. That is willful ignorance. Oh, and I understand that some don't realize it, but some of us out here running and working for companies affected by these rulings are people too. I wish everyone would stop pretending who they hoped would be affected and see who actually are so we can move from politics to reality.
  - MistahKoala 8y ago
    Individuals who run their own business are far more vulnerable to the harm form GDPR than well-resourced enterprises are. And as an individual consumer, I'm comfortable in saying that it is a really not great law for me (ie, YMMV). It's impeded some of the content I access and for many sites it's like having cookie notices on steroids. It's a pain in the arse.
- sabarn01 8y ago
  GDPR is a boon to large tech. The more complicated the compliance the bigger the advantage for large firms.
- gpvos 8y ago
  Yes, it's actually pretty sane as laws go, and does a reasonable job protecting people's privacy.
opportune 8y ago
My only problem with GDPR is that you can be fined up to 4% of org revenue for breaches, even if the violation isn’t that bad. This is pretty unfair for very horizontally-large organizations and causes a lot of CYA training/education/compliance. Yes it highly disincentivizes noncompliance but I’ve seen first hand how much work it can create relative to the actual practical effects of a violation. If potential penalties were adjusted better towards the severity of a violation, there would be a lot less wasted man hours
- zaarn 8y ago
  Well, the official guidance for most agencies involved is to not issue 4% worldwide revenue fines unless repeat offenders show little to no signs of changing behavior to prevent further violations. If there was in letter adjustment for the amount depending on violations, orgs would just worm themselves out of the high penalties by exploiting the wording, having it up to the agency's judgement means they can issue high fines if necessary. You also always have recourse against unjust or excessive fines, as per established EU law.
- toomanybeersies 8y ago
  Everyone has latched onto this 4% number, like every breach of GDPR rules will incur a massive fine. It's not "you will be fined 4% for every breach". It's "you can be fined up to 4%", the GDPR actually states that the punishment should be proportional to the damage caused. Here's the specific language form the English language version of the GDPR [1] (I suggest you read the whole page): > Each supervisory authority shall ensure that the imposition of administrative fines pursuant to this Article in respect of infringements of this Regulation referred to in paragraphs 4, 5 and 6 shall in each individual case be effective, proportionate and dissuasive. If you accidentally send customer data to Google Analytics without their permission, and rectify the issue when it's discovered, you're not going to get slapped with a multi-million dollar fine. [1] https://gdpr-info.eu/art-83-gdpr/ https://gdpr-info.eu/art-83-gdpr/
  - beaconstudios 8y ago
    > If you accidentally send customer data to Google Analytics without their permission, and rectify the issue when it's discovered, you're not going to get slapped with a multi-million dollar fine. Hopefully. It seems like the law is completely open to the judge's discretion, so for risk assessment purposes it should be assumed that the full fine will be granted, because you can't bank on a lenient judge - especially if you're one of the earliest cases and they decide to make an example of you.
jolmg 8y ago
> There are also many positive examples Can you list others besides GDPR? I'm ignorant, but interested.
- QasimK 8y ago
  The data roaming law which allows you to use your data allowance in other EU countries, which is great when travelling around Europe. I can’t think of others from the top of my head
betterunix2 8y ago
One of the complaints about GDPR is that it benefited Google and Facebook to the detriment of smaller comeptitors: https://www.wsj.com/articles/eus-strict-new-privacy-law-is-sending-more-ad-money-to-google-1527759001 https://www.wsj.com/articles/eus-strict-new-privacy-law-is-s... Not surprising, expensive regulations reduce competition and benefit the largest players.

by QasimK 8y ago

arcbyte 8y ago

GDPR as a positive example? Huh?

jimnotgym 8y ago
For a person it is a really great law yes. For a data-farming corporation, less so, but that is not what he OP asked
- paxy 8y ago
  Large data-farming corporations can and will continue operating in Europe, since they are the only ones that have the resources to understand the law, find limits and loopholes, pay fines, make major changes to their systems etc. Smaller companies and startups are the ones who will suffer.
  - gpvos 8y ago
    Only if they want to data farm. And while there are probably loopholes, I'd be interested to hear of any.
- darawk 8y ago
  As far as I can tell the only impact GDPR has had on my life is that there are a lot more annoying popups for me to mindlessly click 'accept' on.
  - StavrosK 8y ago
    Really? Then you aren't using it at all. The impact it's had on my life is that companies have to tell me what they're doing with my data. If I say no, they have to refrain from using it, they can't just say "well tough luck, we have it now". If I give my email for a contest, they can't keep spamming me with crap. If I tell them to forget I exist, they have to do it. If I want to see what Facebook knows about me, it has to tell me everything. As someone who runs dozens of side-projects with thousands of users, I didn't even have to change anything. All it took was to not be shitty to begin with.
    - darawk 8y ago
      > The impact it's had on my life is that companies have to tell me what they're doing with my data Have you learned anything interesting from that? > If I say no, they have to refrain from using it, they can't just say "well tough luck, we have it now". Have you been doing that? > If I give my email for a contest, they can't keep spamming me with crap. That was already a thing in the US: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAN-SPAM_Act_of_2003 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAN-SPAM_Act_of_2003 > If I tell them to forget I exist, they have to do it. That could be useful, I suppose. Although to be honest, it's likely to be used to erase bad behavior that we'd rather have public much more than any legitimate privacy concern, i'd guess.
      - StavrosK 8y ago
        > Have you learned anything interesting from that? No, the few I asked turned out to have as much data as I shared, which is almost nothing. > Have you been doing that? Yep. > That was already a thing in the US: Good to know. > it's likely to be used to erase bad behavior that we'd rather have public much more than any legitimate privacy concern, i'd guess. I'm not sure I agree with that, but I also don't agree that people's bad behaviour should remain public forever.
    - erik_seaberg 8y ago
      The law is not merely a list of bad things you can't do. Many of its 99 sections require new bureaucratic procedures like "hire a data protection officer to write an impact assessment and wait eight to fourteen weeks for an official response" that you almost certainly weren't already doing.
- Aunche 8y ago
  Does it really help the regular person? I've yet to hear an example of a real world problem that GDPR could have prevented.
  - pluma 8y ago
    Cambridge Analytica would have blatantly violated the GDPR, so there's that.
- kodablah 8y ago
  All corporations that spent money on compliance, their customers, their employees, etc. It's becoming very annoying to see proponents of the legislation act like it only impacts one type of tech company. That is willful ignorance. Oh, and I understand that some don't realize it, but some of us out here running and working for companies affected by these rulings are people too. I wish everyone would stop pretending who they hoped would be affected and see who actually are so we can move from politics to reality.
- MistahKoala 8y ago
  Individuals who run their own business are far more vulnerable to the harm form GDPR than well-resourced enterprises are. And as an individual consumer, I'm comfortable in saying that it is a really not great law for me (ie, YMMV). It's impeded some of the content I access and for many sites it's like having cookie notices on steroids. It's a pain in the arse.
sabarn01 8y ago
GDPR is a boon to large tech. The more complicated the compliance the bigger the advantage for large firms.
gpvos 8y ago
Yes, it's actually pretty sane as laws go, and does a reasonable job protecting people's privacy.

opportune 8y ago

My only problem with GDPR is that you can be fined up to 4% of org revenue for breaches, even if the violation isn’t that bad. This is pretty unfair for very horizontally-large organizations and causes a lot of CYA training/education/compliance. Yes it highly disincentivizes noncompliance but I’ve seen first hand how much work it can create relative to the actual practical effects of a violation. If potential penalties were adjusted better towards the severity of a violation, there would be a lot less wasted man hours

zaarn 8y ago
Well, the official guidance for most agencies involved is to not issue 4% worldwide revenue fines unless repeat offenders show little to no signs of changing behavior to prevent further violations. If there was in letter adjustment for the amount depending on violations, orgs would just worm themselves out of the high penalties by exploiting the wording, having it up to the agency's judgement means they can issue high fines if necessary. You also always have recourse against unjust or excessive fines, as per established EU law.
toomanybeersies 8y ago
Everyone has latched onto this 4% number, like every breach of GDPR rules will incur a massive fine. It's not "you will be fined 4% for every breach". It's "you can be fined up to 4%", the GDPR actually states that the punishment should be proportional to the damage caused. Here's the specific language form the English language version of the GDPR [1] (I suggest you read the whole page): > Each supervisory authority shall ensure that the imposition of administrative fines pursuant to this Article in respect of infringements of this Regulation referred to in paragraphs 4, 5 and 6 shall in each individual case be effective, proportionate and dissuasive. If you accidentally send customer data to Google Analytics without their permission, and rectify the issue when it's discovered, you're not going to get slapped with a multi-million dollar fine. [1] https://gdpr-info.eu/art-83-gdpr/ https://gdpr-info.eu/art-83-gdpr/
- beaconstudios 8y ago
  > If you accidentally send customer data to Google Analytics without their permission, and rectify the issue when it's discovered, you're not going to get slapped with a multi-million dollar fine. Hopefully. It seems like the law is completely open to the judge's discretion, so for risk assessment purposes it should be assumed that the full fine will be granted, because you can't bank on a lenient judge - especially if you're one of the earliest cases and they decide to make an example of you.

jolmg 8y ago

> There are also many positive examples Can you list others besides GDPR? I'm ignorant, but interested.

QasimK 8y ago
The data roaming law which allows you to use your data allowance in other EU countries, which is great when travelling around Europe. I can’t think of others from the top of my head

betterunix2 8y ago

One of the complaints about GDPR is that it benefited Google and Facebook to the detriment of smaller comeptitors: https://www.wsj.com/articles/eus-strict-new-privacy-law-is-sending-more-ad-money-to-google-1527759001 https://www.wsj.com/articles/eus-strict-new-privacy-law-is-s... Not surprising, expensive regulations reduce competition and benefit the largest players.