6 ms·

Not to be pedantic but... I thought Toyota got the ball rolling with the Prius and Tesla stoked the fire? (never mind, you said ignite competition) Either way,

by neom 8y ago

Not to be pedantic but... I thought Toyota got the ball rolling with the Prius and Tesla stoked the fire? (never mind, you said ignite competition) Either way, you're totally right, we all win. :)

tonyedgecombe 8y ago
Nissan/Renault deserve some recognition as well.
faitswulff 8y ago
Did Toyota release a full-electric Prius? If so, I wasn't aware of it. The other thing Tesla did was make it a status symbol to have an EV, so there's that.
- wilsonnb3 8y ago
  They've got a plug in hybrid version called the Prius Prime. It's only got 50 miles or so of all electric range if I'm remembering correctly.
rch 8y ago
Introducing the Prius (or Leaf) on the economy side of the market didn't put much pressure on anyone. I don't believe the incumbents started making serious strategic adjustments until Tesla started taking sales on the high-margin side. Maybe only the timeline shifted, but that's still substantive, IMO.
- stcredzero 8y ago
  If Nissan would license battery cooling technology from Tesla, the current Leaf would almost be in the same class as the Tesla Model 3. It's less stylish, slower, more "econobox," but seems only to lack the ability to rapid charge more than once a trip, due to thermal issues. (Also probably results in poorer battery longevity.)
  - codeulike 8y ago
    There's a longer range, water cooled Leaf coming next year. They're talking 250 miles. Not sure of the price, or whether it will be available in large numbers. I'm very interested.
- samfisher83 8y ago
  Toyota sold more priuses last than cars Tesla has made in its entire history.
  - rch 8y ago
    > With a fully charged battery, Prius Prime has an EPA-estimated 25 miles of EV -- https://www.toyota.com/priusprime/ https://www.toyota.com/priusprime/ That's not even in the same league, performance wise; the Model 3's range is ~300 miles.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
- VintageCool 8y ago
  My understanding is that the European investment in electric vehicles has really been driven by the VW Emissions scandal. That has shifted expectations of the future away from diesel and toward electrification. Additionally, several cities are now pushing diesel bans and eventually banning internal combustion engines altogether.
craftyguy 8y ago
Hybrid != fully electric.
mtgx 8y ago
Toyota kept the Prius and the RAV4 virtually unchanged for more than a decade. They were in no hurry to "kickstart the EV market." None of the carmakers were, and they still aren't: https://electrek.co/2018/09/03/automakers-not-advertising-electric-vehicles-study/ https://electrek.co/2018/09/03/automakers-not-advertising-el...
r00fus 8y ago
Hybrids are by no means full EVs (experience owning both). Hybrids are what all petroleum-based cars should evolve into... if carmakers had the pressure to do that. Consumers just get a nicer experience, but no/little change to habits. EVs have a lot of other things going - never having to visit a gas station, SMOG test, or an oil change is paradigm-shifting. If EVs go mainstream, we can really think about autonomous driving becoming a possibility.

by neom 8y ago

Not to be pedantic but... I thought Toyota got the ball rolling with the Prius and Tesla stoked the fire? (never mind, you said ignite competition) Either way, you're totally right, we all win. :)

tonyedgecombe 8y ago

Nissan/Renault deserve some recognition as well.

faitswulff 8y ago

Did Toyota release a full-electric Prius? If so, I wasn't aware of it. The other thing Tesla did was make it a status symbol to have an EV, so there's that.

wilsonnb3 8y ago
They've got a plug in hybrid version called the Prius Prime. It's only got 50 miles or so of all electric range if I'm remembering correctly.

rch 8y ago

Introducing the Prius (or Leaf) on the economy side of the market didn't put much pressure on anyone. I don't believe the incumbents started making serious strategic adjustments until Tesla started taking sales on the high-margin side. Maybe only the timeline shifted, but that's still substantive, IMO.

stcredzero 8y ago
If Nissan would license battery cooling technology from Tesla, the current Leaf would almost be in the same class as the Tesla Model 3. It's less stylish, slower, more "econobox," but seems only to lack the ability to rapid charge more than once a trip, due to thermal issues. (Also probably results in poorer battery longevity.)
- codeulike 8y ago
  There's a longer range, water cooled Leaf coming next year. They're talking 250 miles. Not sure of the price, or whether it will be available in large numbers. I'm very interested.
samfisher83 8y ago
Toyota sold more priuses last than cars Tesla has made in its entire history.
- rch 8y ago
  > With a fully charged battery, Prius Prime has an EPA-estimated 25 miles of EV -- https://www.toyota.com/priusprime/ https://www.toyota.com/priusprime/ That's not even in the same league, performance wise; the Model 3's range is ~300 miles.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
VintageCool 8y ago
My understanding is that the European investment in electric vehicles has really been driven by the VW Emissions scandal. That has shifted expectations of the future away from diesel and toward electrification. Additionally, several cities are now pushing diesel bans and eventually banning internal combustion engines altogether.

craftyguy 8y ago

Hybrid != fully electric.

mtgx 8y ago

Toyota kept the Prius and the RAV4 virtually unchanged for more than a decade. They were in no hurry to "kickstart the EV market." None of the carmakers were, and they still aren't: https://electrek.co/2018/09/03/automakers-not-advertising-electric-vehicles-study/ https://electrek.co/2018/09/03/automakers-not-advertising-el...

r00fus 8y ago

Hybrids are by no means full EVs (experience owning both). Hybrids are what all petroleum-based cars should evolve into... if carmakers had the pressure to do that. Consumers just get a nicer experience, but no/little change to habits. EVs have a lot of other things going - never having to visit a gas station, SMOG test, or an oil change is paradigm-shifting. If EVs go mainstream, we can really think about autonomous driving becoming a possibility.