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I wonder what would be the failsafe on these systems? Are there redundant cameras? I would guess there will be dual fiber paths, but other than that? Or is the

by m-app 8y ago

I wonder what would be the failsafe on these systems? Are there redundant cameras? I would guess there will be dual fiber paths, but other than that? Or is the visual aspect just a relic and can most remote operation be done using radar/telemetry anyway?

goodcanadian 8y ago
Well, what happens when it is too foggy for controllers to see out of a traditional tower? What happens when radar or other systems go down? There will be procedures and fallbacks culminating in closing the airport if they have to.
- base698 8y ago
  Instrument Flight Rules (IFR) apply for when it's too foggy: Less than 3 miles visibility and a ceiling of 1000 ft above ground. When you are on an IFR flight plan and comms fail you stick to your flight plan if still in the clouds and arrive at various point at the time you are expected. Priority during comms failure is landing in good weather if able. Radar failures happen and there are times when you need to do position reports.
- sparrish 8y ago
  I imagine Northern Colorado doesn't get a lot of fog.
joshvm 8y ago
The failsafe is pilots talk to each other in the air. There are lots of totally unmanned airports and airports have established procedures to follow if you don't have radio contact. Not sure about this airport, but in some (most?) places with a tower, there is a very low tech contingency where the airport can operate from a hut on the ground. Everything could be done visually plus a handheld radio and would obviously be slower, but it's there in case the tower had to be evacuated, or similar. See, for example (there's a picture comment on the question) https://aviation.stackexchange.com/questions/13438/can-planes-still-land-during-a-regionally-diverse-atc-malfunction https://aviation.stackexchange.com/questions/13438/can-plane...
- m-app 8y ago
  > The failsafe is pilots talk to each other in the air. There are lots of totally unmanned airports and airports have established procedures to follow if you don't have radio contact. This makes sense, of course there will be contingency plans, up to and including shutting down the airport and rerouting flights like your sibling mentioned. > Not sure about this airport, but in some (most?) places with a tower, there is a very low tech contingency where the airport can operate from a hut on the ground. Everything could be done visually plus a handheld radio and would obviously be slower, but it's there in case the tower had to be evacuated, or similar. I think this highlights my point, since the airport itself is now "unmanned" in the sense that there is no one there to do the "legacy" way of visual controlling. This means that the analog fallback scenario is not an option anymore, which could be of small importance if it was not used a lot anyway before actually falling further back to other options.
- cmurf 8y ago
  Light signals. All control towers can issue clearances by light signal. Pilots still have to learn about it, although practice opportunities are hard to come by.
toomanybeersies 8y ago
I assume they send somebody out with binoculars? In all seriousness though, ATC can function without vision. Visual checks are a failsafe to their other systems.

by m-app 8y ago

goodcanadian 8y ago

Well, what happens when it is too foggy for controllers to see out of a traditional tower? What happens when radar or other systems go down? There will be procedures and fallbacks culminating in closing the airport if they have to.

base698 8y ago
Instrument Flight Rules (IFR) apply for when it's too foggy: Less than 3 miles visibility and a ceiling of 1000 ft above ground. When you are on an IFR flight plan and comms fail you stick to your flight plan if still in the clouds and arrive at various point at the time you are expected. Priority during comms failure is landing in good weather if able. Radar failures happen and there are times when you need to do position reports.
sparrish 8y ago
I imagine Northern Colorado doesn't get a lot of fog.

joshvm 8y ago

The failsafe is pilots talk to each other in the air. There are lots of totally unmanned airports and airports have established procedures to follow if you don't have radio contact. Not sure about this airport, but in some (most?) places with a tower, there is a very low tech contingency where the airport can operate from a hut on the ground. Everything could be done visually plus a handheld radio and would obviously be slower, but it's there in case the tower had to be evacuated, or similar. See, for example (there's a picture comment on the question) https://aviation.stackexchange.com/questions/13438/can-planes-still-land-during-a-regionally-diverse-atc-malfunction https://aviation.stackexchange.com/questions/13438/can-plane...

m-app 8y ago
> The failsafe is pilots talk to each other in the air. There are lots of totally unmanned airports and airports have established procedures to follow if you don't have radio contact. This makes sense, of course there will be contingency plans, up to and including shutting down the airport and rerouting flights like your sibling mentioned. > Not sure about this airport, but in some (most?) places with a tower, there is a very low tech contingency where the airport can operate from a hut on the ground. Everything could be done visually plus a handheld radio and would obviously be slower, but it's there in case the tower had to be evacuated, or similar. I think this highlights my point, since the airport itself is now "unmanned" in the sense that there is no one there to do the "legacy" way of visual controlling. This means that the analog fallback scenario is not an option anymore, which could be of small importance if it was not used a lot anyway before actually falling further back to other options.
cmurf 8y ago
Light signals. All control towers can issue clearances by light signal. Pilots still have to learn about it, although practice opportunities are hard to come by.

toomanybeersies 8y ago

I assume they send somebody out with binoculars? In all seriousness though, ATC can function without vision. Visual checks are a failsafe to their other systems.