6 ms·

In my effort to read some portion of the classics, I really experienced his observation of the difference between reading in school and reading later in life.

by ksdale 8y ago

In my effort to read some portion of the classics, I really experienced his observation of the difference between reading in school and reading later in life. I couldn't believe how much more I was impacted by some of these books just 10 years after reading them in high school. Many of the plights of the protagonists just didn't stir me at all when I was in school, either because I didn't understand the historical context well enough, or because I didn't yet have enough empathy to feel their pain and loss (it's always pain and loss in the classics...) Anyway, I highly recommend reading some of these books again as an adult. Even some of the ones I remember hating in school I ended up being engrossed by.

ChuckMcM 8y ago
I reread the Count of Monte Cristo, there was a penguin edition on a garage sale table for $2. I found it much more enjoyable than I did the first time around. (it also shows you how much of our current storytelling was influenced by the themes in this book)
- lmm 8y ago
  Is The Count of Monte Cristo a "classic"? It's great fun but I always thought of it as more of a pulpy adventure than a respected work of literature.
  - ChuckMcM 8y ago
    I am not sure, it makes a lot of '100 books to read before you die' lists[1]. Perhaps the best evidence to support it as worthy of the 'classic' moniker is perhaps the CSMonitor review [3] which points out that it has held up as a great story over several hundred years. How would you define a "classic" and what books would you put in that definition? [1] exemplar -- https://www.businessinsider.com/100-books-everyone-should-read-amazon-goodreads-2015-3 https://www.businessinsider.com/100-books-everyone-should-re... [2] Quora discussion -- https://www.quora.com/Why-is-The-Count-of-Monte-Cristo-considered-a-classic https://www.quora.com/Why-is-The-Count-of-Monte-Cristo-consi... [3] "Dumas published the book in 1846. It is no exaggeration to say “Monte Cristo” still ranks as one of the most exciting stories imaginable, one every bit as good as anything Steven Spielberg or J.K. Rowling could ever conjure up." -- https://www.csmonitor.com/Books/Book-Reviews/2011/0206/Classic-review-The-Count-of-Monte-Cristo https://www.csmonitor.com/Books/Book-Reviews/2011/0206/Class...
cmplxconjugate 8y ago
I’ve had a similar experience. I think it simply comes down to emotional maturity and more diverse life experiences. It makes it much easier to empathise with characters, as well as critically analyse the subtext. One thing I found quite difficult however is dealing with the different writing styles. Sometimes it could be a real slog to get through books that have a dated or less contemporary style.
- jrumbut 8y ago
  I really recommend audiobooks here, it makes it so much easier to get through the 50 page sections of geneology or all-wrong speculation about the natural world that's included in a lot of classic works. So easy in fact you come to understand what role they play or why they're important. One thing I love about the classics is that they have an entirely different set of euphemisms and implicit assumptions. They don't know what you're supposed to pretend isn't true in the modern world. You end up with, for instance, the ancient Greeks being very explicit that their early rulers were the most effective pirates and cattle rustlers. You learn a lot more about how we got where we are and why some obviously bad structures are so hard to change. Many decision makers from the dawn of writing to the present day relied on these texts as playbooks.
- ianai 8y ago
  The best books can be reread all through life. They have different meanings and lessons for a person during different life stages.
  - StillBored 8y ago
    Maybe, but I can tell you I got nothing from reading "Waiting for Godot" as a sophomore in high school. Age is something that is hard to relate to when your 14-15. Worse philosophy tends to be a luxury when your really poor and have more immediate concerns. I might have been offended by being called "emotionally immature" at that age but i also found Jane Eyre and similar to be pointless rubbish at that age. Although, maybe the point of a "classic" is that it should have broad appeal, but there is a difference between intellectually understanding something and being able to relate to it. I found Grapes of Wrath to be relatable, but tedious in high school, and noticed a correlation a between the amount of hate better off kids in class espoused for it vs the fact that I while I found it immensely depressing, I didn't mind it nearly as much as many of the other assignments.
bena 8y ago
Reading for assignment is a chore, reading for pleasure is a joy. I think you get caught up in the feeling that "this needs to be done" that you don't really get to get into the book.
- abecedarius 8y ago
  Yep. A couple times in high school I refused to read an assigned book that I didn't want to ruin for myself. (Pride and Prejudice and Moby-Dick. Came back to them years later and still think I scheduled them correctly.) I guess the difference from some others which I actually enjoyed reading for school (Othello, Alice in Wonderland) was the ratio of effort to pulpish I-want-to-read-the-next-page quality.
a_wild_dandan 8y ago
Nothing sterilizes a book's emotional or intellectual impact quite like being forced to read it. It's like cultivating a person's appreciation of sushi by physically shoving it down her throat. What's worse is that I can only unhelpfully lament the current state of literature in education -- I have no idea how we may improve the system...
- vixen99 8y ago
  Not necessarily. Depends on circumstances. Putting a book on a school or college curriculum is a form of enforced reading dictated however by people whose opinions you presumably respect.
- DubiousPusher 8y ago
  That depends probably on whether you were a lit major or not. I can understand how someone forced into a lit class under general studies would be irritated by texts that seem uninteresting or irrelevant but if you're a literature student that's exactly what you're there for. Half the use of the classes was getting a syllabus someone had gone to great lengths to organize around an expert knowledge of some area or string of thought. I usually found a good deal of value, even when the author or work was not to my specific taste. My classical literature class had a cycle exclusively on Antigone. I was and am not as enamored by that play as was my instructor and the critic George Steiner who we were asked to read. But to loathe the requirement and not focus on deriving the best possible value from that assignment would've been a waste of money.
  - ksdale 8y ago
    Years after college, I still really enjoy walking through a university bookstore and looking at the books in the curriculum for each major. Pretty much everything that's not a textbook is regarded as a really important book by the experts in the field, and a lot of them are quite readable for nonfiction which I assume is a result of professors wanting to keep students interested.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
StillBored 8y ago
Besides (as others have pointed out) some of the classics aren't that great. Then, there is the problem that it seems frequently the books chosen for a high school reader are chosen based on some perceived quality of the book rather than what is going to be enjoyable, relatable and readable by someone who effectively doesn't have any adult life behind them. Worse they seem to be chosen without regard to length or readability. I had to read Grapes of Wrath over 3 weeks in HS (with everything else going on, and I know most students shared a cliff notes and prayed for a reasonable grade), but there are plenty of worse examples and the The Count of Monte Cristo in its 1000+ page unabridged addition was assigned my niece last year. I tend to be able to read pulp novels at 100 pages an hour, but older novels, Shakespeare plays etc, can easy bring it down to 30 pages an hour or less. Which for a 600 page book is a 20+ hour long drag if the novel isn't enjoyable. Surely the instructors can find shorter novels which are easier for the kids to read and relate to. I remember reading Cannery Row a few years ago and wondering why instead of Grapes of Wrath it wasn't assigned, or for that matter I read "This Side of Paradise" and am to this day 100% convinced that any teacher that assigns The Great Gatsby to a teenage student over it should seriously be examined (actually IIRC when I read it, it seemed the sexual content in this side of paradise probably makes it hard to assign, but that is another discussion, along with the fact that Gatsby was initially a failure with mixed reviews, the reasons should be understood but apparently aren't. I hated the Gatsby assignment, but suspect that I would have found it more enjoyable in my 20's when I read Paradise, which is likely one of those books that is less meaningful to people in their 50's). The bottom line, is that there are plenty of "classic" novels that are relatable to a wide audience (male & female, differing economic backgrounds, etc) and are short enough that a normal teenager can struggle through them even if they aren't enjoyable. The fact that it accepted to assign some of these book because everyone else is doing it is just a sign of bad instruction.
- billfruit 8y ago
  The unabridged Count of Monte Cristo is a blockbuster that puts Hollywood to shame in its scale. Even has a chapter on a bloodbath, that looked to me as something that could have inspired some one like Tarantino. Pirates, murders, poisoning mystery, Prison escapades, Roman banditi, political intrigue, it has all of it and more.
pjmlp 8y ago
Similar experience with the Portuguese classics, I only got to enjoy the ones I have read before reaching the school level where they were compulsory.

by ksdale 8y ago

ChuckMcM 8y ago

I reread the Count of Monte Cristo, there was a penguin edition on a garage sale table for $2. I found it much more enjoyable than I did the first time around. (it also shows you how much of our current storytelling was influenced by the themes in this book)

lmm 8y ago
Is The Count of Monte Cristo a "classic"? It's great fun but I always thought of it as more of a pulpy adventure than a respected work of literature.
- ChuckMcM 8y ago
  I am not sure, it makes a lot of '100 books to read before you die' lists[1]. Perhaps the best evidence to support it as worthy of the 'classic' moniker is perhaps the CSMonitor review [3] which points out that it has held up as a great story over several hundred years. How would you define a "classic" and what books would you put in that definition? [1] exemplar -- https://www.businessinsider.com/100-books-everyone-should-read-amazon-goodreads-2015-3 https://www.businessinsider.com/100-books-everyone-should-re... [2] Quora discussion -- https://www.quora.com/Why-is-The-Count-of-Monte-Cristo-considered-a-classic https://www.quora.com/Why-is-The-Count-of-Monte-Cristo-consi... [3] "Dumas published the book in 1846. It is no exaggeration to say “Monte Cristo” still ranks as one of the most exciting stories imaginable, one every bit as good as anything Steven Spielberg or J.K. Rowling could ever conjure up." -- https://www.csmonitor.com/Books/Book-Reviews/2011/0206/Classic-review-The-Count-of-Monte-Cristo https://www.csmonitor.com/Books/Book-Reviews/2011/0206/Class...

cmplxconjugate 8y ago

I’ve had a similar experience. I think it simply comes down to emotional maturity and more diverse life experiences. It makes it much easier to empathise with characters, as well as critically analyse the subtext. One thing I found quite difficult however is dealing with the different writing styles. Sometimes it could be a real slog to get through books that have a dated or less contemporary style.

jrumbut 8y ago
I really recommend audiobooks here, it makes it so much easier to get through the 50 page sections of geneology or all-wrong speculation about the natural world that's included in a lot of classic works. So easy in fact you come to understand what role they play or why they're important. One thing I love about the classics is that they have an entirely different set of euphemisms and implicit assumptions. They don't know what you're supposed to pretend isn't true in the modern world. You end up with, for instance, the ancient Greeks being very explicit that their early rulers were the most effective pirates and cattle rustlers. You learn a lot more about how we got where we are and why some obviously bad structures are so hard to change. Many decision makers from the dawn of writing to the present day relied on these texts as playbooks.
ianai 8y ago
The best books can be reread all through life. They have different meanings and lessons for a person during different life stages.
- StillBored 8y ago
  Maybe, but I can tell you I got nothing from reading "Waiting for Godot" as a sophomore in high school. Age is something that is hard to relate to when your 14-15. Worse philosophy tends to be a luxury when your really poor and have more immediate concerns. I might have been offended by being called "emotionally immature" at that age but i also found Jane Eyre and similar to be pointless rubbish at that age. Although, maybe the point of a "classic" is that it should have broad appeal, but there is a difference between intellectually understanding something and being able to relate to it. I found Grapes of Wrath to be relatable, but tedious in high school, and noticed a correlation a between the amount of hate better off kids in class espoused for it vs the fact that I while I found it immensely depressing, I didn't mind it nearly as much as many of the other assignments.

bena 8y ago

Reading for assignment is a chore, reading for pleasure is a joy. I think you get caught up in the feeling that "this needs to be done" that you don't really get to get into the book.

abecedarius 8y ago
Yep. A couple times in high school I refused to read an assigned book that I didn't want to ruin for myself. (Pride and Prejudice and Moby-Dick. Came back to them years later and still think I scheduled them correctly.) I guess the difference from some others which I actually enjoyed reading for school (Othello, Alice in Wonderland) was the ratio of effort to pulpish I-want-to-read-the-next-page quality.

a_wild_dandan 8y ago

Nothing sterilizes a book's emotional or intellectual impact quite like being forced to read it. It's like cultivating a person's appreciation of sushi by physically shoving it down her throat. What's worse is that I can only unhelpfully lament the current state of literature in education -- I have no idea how we may improve the system...

vixen99 8y ago
Not necessarily. Depends on circumstances. Putting a book on a school or college curriculum is a form of enforced reading dictated however by people whose opinions you presumably respect.
DubiousPusher 8y ago
That depends probably on whether you were a lit major or not. I can understand how someone forced into a lit class under general studies would be irritated by texts that seem uninteresting or irrelevant but if you're a literature student that's exactly what you're there for. Half the use of the classes was getting a syllabus someone had gone to great lengths to organize around an expert knowledge of some area or string of thought. I usually found a good deal of value, even when the author or work was not to my specific taste. My classical literature class had a cycle exclusively on Antigone. I was and am not as enamored by that play as was my instructor and the critic George Steiner who we were asked to read. But to loathe the requirement and not focus on deriving the best possible value from that assignment would've been a waste of money.
- ksdale 8y ago
  Years after college, I still really enjoy walking through a university bookstore and looking at the books in the curriculum for each major. Pretty much everything that's not a textbook is regarded as a really important book by the experts in the field, and a lot of them are quite readable for nonfiction which I assume is a result of professors wanting to keep students interested.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

StillBored 8y ago

Besides (as others have pointed out) some of the classics aren't that great. Then, there is the problem that it seems frequently the books chosen for a high school reader are chosen based on some perceived quality of the book rather than what is going to be enjoyable, relatable and readable by someone who effectively doesn't have any adult life behind them. Worse they seem to be chosen without regard to length or readability. I had to read Grapes of Wrath over 3 weeks in HS (with everything else going on, and I know most students shared a cliff notes and prayed for a reasonable grade), but there are plenty of worse examples and the The Count of Monte Cristo in its 1000+ page unabridged addition was assigned my niece last year. I tend to be able to read pulp novels at 100 pages an hour, but older novels, Shakespeare plays etc, can easy bring it down to 30 pages an hour or less. Which for a 600 page book is a 20+ hour long drag if the novel isn't enjoyable. Surely the instructors can find shorter novels which are easier for the kids to read and relate to. I remember reading Cannery Row a few years ago and wondering why instead of Grapes of Wrath it wasn't assigned, or for that matter I read "This Side of Paradise" and am to this day 100% convinced that any teacher that assigns The Great Gatsby to a teenage student over it should seriously be examined (actually IIRC when I read it, it seemed the sexual content in this side of paradise probably makes it hard to assign, but that is another discussion, along with the fact that Gatsby was initially a failure with mixed reviews, the reasons should be understood but apparently aren't. I hated the Gatsby assignment, but suspect that I would have found it more enjoyable in my 20's when I read Paradise, which is likely one of those books that is less meaningful to people in their 50's). The bottom line, is that there are plenty of "classic" novels that are relatable to a wide audience (male & female, differing economic backgrounds, etc) and are short enough that a normal teenager can struggle through them even if they aren't enjoyable. The fact that it accepted to assign some of these book because everyone else is doing it is just a sign of bad instruction.

billfruit 8y ago
The unabridged Count of Monte Cristo is a blockbuster that puts Hollywood to shame in its scale. Even has a chapter on a bloodbath, that looked to me as something that could have inspired some one like Tarantino. Pirates, murders, poisoning mystery, Prison escapades, Roman banditi, political intrigue, it has all of it and more.

pjmlp 8y ago

Similar experience with the Portuguese classics, I only got to enjoy the ones I have read before reaching the school level where they were compulsory.