4 ms·

Immigrants are basically socially invisible in that sort of context, they have no ability to exert social pressure whatsoever. It would be obvious to anyone act

Immigrants are basically socially invisible in that sort of context, they have no ability to exert social pressure whatsoever. It would be obvious to anyone actually living here that you're simply wrong.

coldtea 8y ago
Tell that to immigrants that followed my friend in a public street at around 10pm and tried to shamed her "why are you wearing this skirt" and such last month. And she was not even that provocatively dressed (way less than the average working class girl -- what english would call a "chav" -- in her late teens going out for a drink on friday/saturday)
- frostburg 8y ago
  Where did this happen? Even if it actually happened, do you seriously feel that this actually works in changing the attitude of a society?
  - TangoTrotFox 8y ago
    Changing behavior and changing attitude are not the same thing. If you would like to go e.g. topless, but have concerns about the behaviors or peoples around you then you haven't changed your attitude - but you have changed your behavior. I'm not nit picking semantics as this is really a very important issue in society today -- you cannot derive how people think from how people act.
  - coldtea 8y ago
    >Even if it actually happened You could not believe me (as a random person on the web), but your phrasing implies that you also consider this somehow beyond the realm of possibility. It happened in Athens, if that matters. >do you seriously feel that this actually works in changing the attitude of a society Yeah, where's the surprise? Changes in demographics, like an increased presence of people with more conservative values in an area, can, and do, change the attitudes of a society, just like immigration can influence cuisine, music, religion, and other cultural aspects.
    - frostburg 8y ago
      It's not beyond the realm of possibility; I recall a convert to Islam (that looked rather out of place with his red hair, etc.) in the UK trying to perform "sharia patrols" in the streets. I contest believing that young people going to beach in France or Italy would give even passing thought to what these people think or want, because it's completly outside the realm of my experience of the people that I've ever known to go to the beach, ever. A vastly more likely consideration is avoiding unwanted attention from people that approve of mostly undressed girls. I don't think that you understand (I don't know, maybe you live here?) how socially -isolated- immigrants are.
      - coldtea 8y ago
        >I contest believing that young people going to beach in France or Italy would give even passing thought to what these people think or want, because it's completly outside the realm of my experience of the people that I've ever known to go to the beach, ever. On the beach, no, but it can be a factor on how people dress to go outside on the city, or to avoid certain streets, and so on.

coldtea 8y ago

Tell that to immigrants that followed my friend in a public street at around 10pm and tried to shamed her "why are you wearing this skirt" and such last month. And she was not even that provocatively dressed (way less than the average working class girl -- what english would call a "chav" -- in her late teens going out for a drink on friday/saturday)

frostburg 8y ago
Where did this happen? Even if it actually happened, do you seriously feel that this actually works in changing the attitude of a society?
- TangoTrotFox 8y ago
  Changing behavior and changing attitude are not the same thing. If you would like to go e.g. topless, but have concerns about the behaviors or peoples around you then you haven't changed your attitude - but you have changed your behavior. I'm not nit picking semantics as this is really a very important issue in society today -- you cannot derive how people think from how people act.
- coldtea 8y ago
  >Even if it actually happened You could not believe me (as a random person on the web), but your phrasing implies that you also consider this somehow beyond the realm of possibility. It happened in Athens, if that matters. >do you seriously feel that this actually works in changing the attitude of a society Yeah, where's the surprise? Changes in demographics, like an increased presence of people with more conservative values in an area, can, and do, change the attitudes of a society, just like immigration can influence cuisine, music, religion, and other cultural aspects.
  - frostburg 8y ago
    It's not beyond the realm of possibility; I recall a convert to Islam (that looked rather out of place with his red hair, etc.) in the UK trying to perform "sharia patrols" in the streets. I contest believing that young people going to beach in France or Italy would give even passing thought to what these people think or want, because it's completly outside the realm of my experience of the people that I've ever known to go to the beach, ever. A vastly more likely consideration is avoiding unwanted attention from people that approve of mostly undressed girls. I don't think that you understand (I don't know, maybe you live here?) how socially -isolated- immigrants are.
    - coldtea 8y ago
      >I contest believing that young people going to beach in France or Italy would give even passing thought to what these people think or want, because it's completly outside the realm of my experience of the people that I've ever known to go to the beach, ever. On the beach, no, but it can be a factor on how people dress to go outside on the city, or to avoid certain streets, and so on.