7 ms·

The Twenty-Five Year Journey of Magic the Gathering

61 points by wskinner 8y ago

heimdall 8y ago
> In the game, players were fashioned as “planeswalkers,” who cast spells and travel between planes of existence. The spells themselves were the cards, ... I played 1999-2004 and now 2016+, mostly non-tournament casual for this exact idea that most players seem to have forgotten. Decks with an emphasis on flavor feel more in line with the core theme of the game, and it's a very rewarding experience to roleplay a Planeswalker using their library of spells. Many new players (especially tournament-minded) seem to treat the art and flavor as tertiary to the mechanics. One person told me they'd still play the game even if it was black text on plain white cards. Apparently the point was to win, not enjoy the aestetic. Win or lose, I enjoy the fact that my decks have a rock solid roleplay theme and are usually under $40 each.
- mcv 8y ago
  I certainly do like the art. Although over the years, a lot of art has become more generic. The first sets of cards had in my opinion much more iconic art. Look at Llanowar Elves, for example. And some cards are really pure works of art.
  - luckettpat 8y ago
    I feel like there used to be more variety and weirdness in the art style. Something like Plague Spitter https://bit.ly/2PWwvyf https://bit.ly/2PWwvyf or Stasis https://bit.ly/2ovqWdu https://bit.ly/2ovqWdu wouldn't happen anymore. Most of the art these days feels like generic fantasy art that could be painted on the side of a van. I will acknowledge this may be totally unfair, old-timer nostalgia.
    - gpderetta 8y ago
      The Fascist Art Director [1] is a thing. [1] http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=74348 http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiver...
- navbaker 8y ago
  This is how I approach the game and my friends and I have an absolute blast. Card Kingdom makes some EXCELLENT duel decks with great themes (zombie, pirate, eldrazi drone, all legendaries, etc) for 10 bucks a piece and we have fun on lunch breaks playing for bragging rights. Nothing beats winning over your friend’s graveyard recursion deck that he’s won with for two weeks straight after tuning the crap out of a straight dinosaurs deck!
deeponey 8y ago
The article seems to gloss that this is one of the most potent pay to win loot-box hustles of all time, primarily targeting minors. The game is amazing but has this sleazy side. For this reason most grown-ups I know jumped to one of the living card games, Netrunner or Game of thrones.
- ubernostrum 8y ago
  My usual analogy is golf. If you show up to play a round of golf, and your opponent has a nice set of professionally-made clubs while you're using some sticks you carved by hand, you're probably going to lose, badly. But that doesn't make golf "pay to win" -- at the competitive level of golf, everybody has made the investment in that baseline of good equipment, and you're back to practice and skill as the differentiator. Magic is similar. If you show up to a constructed tournament with whatever you could cobble together from a few booster packs, yeah, you're going to get crushed by people with competitive decks. But at the competitive level, everybody has made the baseline investment to have access to the full card pool, at which point you're back to skill (of designing/choosing/playing decks) as the differentiator. Anyway. Top-tier Standard decks are in the couple-hundreds-of-dollars range, and even if you just go out and get the cards for one of those decks and nothing else, there's enough value in the cards that you can trade/sell and get back not 100% of what you paid in, but enough to make switching to a different deck not all that bad.
  - FranzFerdiNaN 8y ago
    That’s a bad analogy. If golf had specific rules about length and material of each golf club that also changed every year, requiring you to buy new clubs to match the rules, you might have a point.
    - jon_richards 8y ago
      Golf companies also don't sell you unknown bags of gear that may either contain something useful or a complete pile of crap.
Areading314 8y ago
I credit Magic: The Gathering for quite a few points on my SAT Verbal for all the arcane vocabulary the cards taught me! The art was/is fantastic too.
- iopuy 8y ago
  Necromancer, tabernacle, exsanguinate, odious... the list goes on.
  - mcv 8y ago
    "Student's spelling leaves a lot to be desired, but is worryingly good on occult subjects."
- aperiodic 8y ago
  I played the heck out of Magic in middle school and ended up with a perfect SAT Verbal.
- r00fus 8y ago
  My sister lost a spelling bee because she misspelled "manna".
dagenix 8y ago
While the game is great, I find the random card dynamic of the card packs pretty troubling. There is no legitimate gameplay reason why you can't just buy the cards you want for a flat rate.
- aperiodic 8y ago
  This is just one of the reasons why Limited (building a 40 card deck from only packs that you and your group open) is clearly the best way to play Magic. Another: even though it seems more variance-prone, it's arguable the most skill-testing format in the game.
  - mcv 8y ago
    Though one of the cool elements of the game is that you can also play a game with a random stranger you just met. That happened a lot back when I was playing a lot in the 1990s. But that game is less likely to be balanced, and it got increasingly less balanced as more cards came out and balance and ideas started shifting around.
bikamonki 8y ago
In line with the spirit of the article, WotC needs acknowledge and amend this horrible mistake: http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=1488 http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiver... "Invoke Prejudice" Whenever an opponent casts a creature spell that doesn't share a color with a creature you control, counter that spell unless that player pays X, where X is its converted mana cost. Also note that the multiverse ID is 1488!!! This is no coincidence, not a dumb joke. These are hate symbols that can and should be removed from the game.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- nugga 8y ago
  This game's thematics are about war, demons, magic, killing, slaughtering, enslaving, pestilence etc and a silly card from a decade+ ago is a problem? Don't manufacture outrage please.
  - UncleMeat 8y ago
    While I agree that the card is largely unimportant and mostly seen as weird trivia, the art was created by a white nationalist and contains klan hoods. It is more tied to our real world than just the vague notion of racism.
  - flashman 8y ago
    Is there a name for the logical fallacy of saying in-game murder is no worse than making references to real-world hate groups?
    - nugga 8y ago
      All the other references to seriously heinous and potentially more destructive things don't seem to bother not much anyone or at least can not be used to rile up controversy to the same degree as racist imagery or references. It seems to be ok to glorify killing or at least portray it in totally acceptable or neutral light but any reference to possible prejudice or separation or claims of inferiority of certain groups or species compared to others is a no go? In the light of america's past treatment of minorities starting from natives and then blacks and even discrimination of specific groups of whites it is perhaps understandable people are wary of it but try to see the situation objectively without any historical bias or taking sides and simply the first principles of what is portrayed or stated.
mcv 8y ago
I recently dug up my old cards from the storage. My 11 year old nephew learned to play Magic while on vacation, bought two cheap decks, and taught it (badly) to my 9 year old son. At some point in all that, of course I need to show this old shoebox chock full of old Magic cards. Instead of letting him play with my old cards, I decided that my son needs to have his own cards, so we went to my local game store and bought him a "deck builder's toolkit" that's a much better deal than the old starterdecks in my time, but somehow lacks a copy of the rules. The shopkeeper, who knows me from way back, warned me not to let him play with my old cards, because some of those are now worth quite a bit. He urged me to look up the value of my old multilands in particular. I think I bought them from a friend for about $4 a piece. Turns out they're now $800 a piece. Insane. Also insane: all my old big monsters are obsolete, as new big monsters are way more powerful than the old ones. But new spells are weaker than the old ones. That's 25 years of balance tweaking, I guess.
- hajile 8y ago
  The official rules are 250+ pages of legalese. For reference since you've been gone a while, the best casual format (by far) is Commander (EDH). Buy him a couple cheap duel decks to learn the basics (phases, stack, etc). Then buy one of the prebuilt Commander decks (the 4 color ones would be best) to get started All that together is around $60 ($100 if you want a second Commander deck to play with him). Not a bad deal for the tabletop experience. Commander is a Singleton format (only one of any card that isn't a basic land), so buying the occasional pack can mix things up a little. Cards that are unplayable in constructed are often great in Commander (and only having one isn't a disadvantage). A 4 color deck (if you have just one) or having all five colors across both decks increases the chances of being able to use whatever you open. Note: if you're going for raw power, buy singles from a dealer instead of packs, but packs are great for casual (or drafting of course). Edit: I didn't think about 9 year old hands, but you can play 60-70 card Commander so he can shuffle easier.
  - mcv 8y ago
    An official format that allows only one of every card is a great idea. Back in university, some people also got tired of all the highly tuned decks with dozens of very similar cards, and decided to play with that rule, calling it "Highlander decks" (there can be only one!). I believe my son or nephew also insisted I shouldn't have more than one of each card in my deck, so maybe the guy who taught my nephew only played Commander. Although googling for it, it seems Commander comes with a lot of extra rules. I'm not sure that's what I'm looking for.
yazr 8y ago
How do you play MtG online ? Surely there are (illegal? grey?) clones where the big ticket items are free ? How do these clones maintain a game play balance ? Non player. Curious.
- automoton1 8y ago
  Cockatrice is what I've used in the past. https://medium.com/@mrdeprey/how-to-connect-to-cockatrice-and-play-magic-d430f80caa7b https://medium.com/@mrdeprey/how-to-connect-to-cockatrice-an...
- thiagoharry 8y ago
  There's an official software to play online, where you also need to buy packs with random virtual cards to play. But there's also non-official softwares where you can use any card. How to maintain the balance? This is the core game's responsibility. To create cards and mechanics which aren't just pay to win.

61 points by wskinner 8y ago

> In the game, players were fashioned as “planeswalkers,” who cast spells and travel between planes of existence. The spells themselves were the cards, ... I played 1999-2004 and now 2016+, mostly non-tournament casual for this exact idea that most players seem to have forgotten. Decks with an emphasis on flavor feel more in line with the core theme of the game, and it's a very rewarding experience to roleplay a Planeswalker using their library of spells. Many new players (especially tournament-minded) seem to treat the art and flavor as tertiary to the mechanics. One person told me they'd still play the game even if it was black text on plain white cards. Apparently the point was to win, not enjoy the aestetic. Win or lose, I enjoy the fact that my decks have a rock solid roleplay theme and are usually under $40 each.

mcv 8y ago
I certainly do like the art. Although over the years, a lot of art has become more generic. The first sets of cards had in my opinion much more iconic art. Look at Llanowar Elves, for example. And some cards are really pure works of art.
- luckettpat 8y ago
  I feel like there used to be more variety and weirdness in the art style. Something like Plague Spitter https://bit.ly/2PWwvyf https://bit.ly/2PWwvyf or Stasis https://bit.ly/2ovqWdu https://bit.ly/2ovqWdu wouldn't happen anymore. Most of the art these days feels like generic fantasy art that could be painted on the side of a van. I will acknowledge this may be totally unfair, old-timer nostalgia.
  - gpderetta 8y ago
    The Fascist Art Director [1] is a thing. [1] http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=74348 http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiver...
navbaker 8y ago
This is how I approach the game and my friends and I have an absolute blast. Card Kingdom makes some EXCELLENT duel decks with great themes (zombie, pirate, eldrazi drone, all legendaries, etc) for 10 bucks a piece and we have fun on lunch breaks playing for bragging rights. Nothing beats winning over your friend’s graveyard recursion deck that he’s won with for two weeks straight after tuning the crap out of a straight dinosaurs deck!

deeponey 8y ago

The article seems to gloss that this is one of the most potent pay to win loot-box hustles of all time, primarily targeting minors. The game is amazing but has this sleazy side. For this reason most grown-ups I know jumped to one of the living card games, Netrunner or Game of thrones.

ubernostrum 8y ago
My usual analogy is golf. If you show up to play a round of golf, and your opponent has a nice set of professionally-made clubs while you're using some sticks you carved by hand, you're probably going to lose, badly. But that doesn't make golf "pay to win" -- at the competitive level of golf, everybody has made the investment in that baseline of good equipment, and you're back to practice and skill as the differentiator. Magic is similar. If you show up to a constructed tournament with whatever you could cobble together from a few booster packs, yeah, you're going to get crushed by people with competitive decks. But at the competitive level, everybody has made the baseline investment to have access to the full card pool, at which point you're back to skill (of designing/choosing/playing decks) as the differentiator. Anyway. Top-tier Standard decks are in the couple-hundreds-of-dollars range, and even if you just go out and get the cards for one of those decks and nothing else, there's enough value in the cards that you can trade/sell and get back not 100% of what you paid in, but enough to make switching to a different deck not all that bad.
- FranzFerdiNaN 8y ago
  That’s a bad analogy. If golf had specific rules about length and material of each golf club that also changed every year, requiring you to buy new clubs to match the rules, you might have a point.
  - jon_richards 8y ago
    Golf companies also don't sell you unknown bags of gear that may either contain something useful or a complete pile of crap.

Areading314 8y ago

I credit Magic: The Gathering for quite a few points on my SAT Verbal for all the arcane vocabulary the cards taught me! The art was/is fantastic too.

iopuy 8y ago
Necromancer, tabernacle, exsanguinate, odious... the list goes on.
- mcv 8y ago
  "Student's spelling leaves a lot to be desired, but is worryingly good on occult subjects."
aperiodic 8y ago
I played the heck out of Magic in middle school and ended up with a perfect SAT Verbal.
r00fus 8y ago
My sister lost a spelling bee because she misspelled "manna".

dagenix 8y ago

While the game is great, I find the random card dynamic of the card packs pretty troubling. There is no legitimate gameplay reason why you can't just buy the cards you want for a flat rate.

aperiodic 8y ago
This is just one of the reasons why Limited (building a 40 card deck from only packs that you and your group open) is clearly the best way to play Magic. Another: even though it seems more variance-prone, it's arguable the most skill-testing format in the game.
- mcv 8y ago
  Though one of the cool elements of the game is that you can also play a game with a random stranger you just met. That happened a lot back when I was playing a lot in the 1990s. But that game is less likely to be balanced, and it got increasingly less balanced as more cards came out and balance and ideas started shifting around.

bikamonki 8y ago

In line with the spirit of the article, WotC needs acknowledge and amend this horrible mistake: http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=1488 http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiver... "Invoke Prejudice" Whenever an opponent casts a creature spell that doesn't share a color with a creature you control, counter that spell unless that player pays X, where X is its converted mana cost. Also note that the multiverse ID is 1488!!! This is no coincidence, not a dumb joke. These are hate symbols that can and should be removed from the game.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
nugga 8y ago
This game's thematics are about war, demons, magic, killing, slaughtering, enslaving, pestilence etc and a silly card from a decade+ ago is a problem? Don't manufacture outrage please.
- UncleMeat 8y ago
  While I agree that the card is largely unimportant and mostly seen as weird trivia, the art was created by a white nationalist and contains klan hoods. It is more tied to our real world than just the vague notion of racism.
- flashman 8y ago
  Is there a name for the logical fallacy of saying in-game murder is no worse than making references to real-world hate groups?
  - nugga 8y ago
    All the other references to seriously heinous and potentially more destructive things don't seem to bother not much anyone or at least can not be used to rile up controversy to the same degree as racist imagery or references. It seems to be ok to glorify killing or at least portray it in totally acceptable or neutral light but any reference to possible prejudice or separation or claims of inferiority of certain groups or species compared to others is a no go? In the light of america's past treatment of minorities starting from natives and then blacks and even discrimination of specific groups of whites it is perhaps understandable people are wary of it but try to see the situation objectively without any historical bias or taking sides and simply the first principles of what is portrayed or stated.

mcv 8y ago

I recently dug up my old cards from the storage. My 11 year old nephew learned to play Magic while on vacation, bought two cheap decks, and taught it (badly) to my 9 year old son. At some point in all that, of course I need to show this old shoebox chock full of old Magic cards. Instead of letting him play with my old cards, I decided that my son needs to have his own cards, so we went to my local game store and bought him a "deck builder's toolkit" that's a much better deal than the old starterdecks in my time, but somehow lacks a copy of the rules. The shopkeeper, who knows me from way back, warned me not to let him play with my old cards, because some of those are now worth quite a bit. He urged me to look up the value of my old multilands in particular. I think I bought them from a friend for about $4 a piece. Turns out they're now $800 a piece. Insane. Also insane: all my old big monsters are obsolete, as new big monsters are way more powerful than the old ones. But new spells are weaker than the old ones. That's 25 years of balance tweaking, I guess.

hajile 8y ago
The official rules are 250+ pages of legalese. For reference since you've been gone a while, the best casual format (by far) is Commander (EDH). Buy him a couple cheap duel decks to learn the basics (phases, stack, etc). Then buy one of the prebuilt Commander decks (the 4 color ones would be best) to get started All that together is around $60 ($100 if you want a second Commander deck to play with him). Not a bad deal for the tabletop experience. Commander is a Singleton format (only one of any card that isn't a basic land), so buying the occasional pack can mix things up a little. Cards that are unplayable in constructed are often great in Commander (and only having one isn't a disadvantage). A 4 color deck (if you have just one) or having all five colors across both decks increases the chances of being able to use whatever you open. Note: if you're going for raw power, buy singles from a dealer instead of packs, but packs are great for casual (or drafting of course). Edit: I didn't think about 9 year old hands, but you can play 60-70 card Commander so he can shuffle easier.
- mcv 8y ago
  An official format that allows only one of every card is a great idea. Back in university, some people also got tired of all the highly tuned decks with dozens of very similar cards, and decided to play with that rule, calling it "Highlander decks" (there can be only one!). I believe my son or nephew also insisted I shouldn't have more than one of each card in my deck, so maybe the guy who taught my nephew only played Commander. Although googling for it, it seems Commander comes with a lot of extra rules. I'm not sure that's what I'm looking for.

yazr 8y ago

How do you play MtG online ? Surely there are (illegal? grey?) clones where the big ticket items are free ? How do these clones maintain a game play balance ? Non player. Curious.

automoton1 8y ago
Cockatrice is what I've used in the past. https://medium.com/@mrdeprey/how-to-connect-to-cockatrice-and-play-magic-d430f80caa7b https://medium.com/@mrdeprey/how-to-connect-to-cockatrice-an...
thiagoharry 8y ago
There's an official software to play online, where you also need to buy packs with random virtual cards to play. But there's also non-official softwares where you can use any card. How to maintain the balance? This is the core game's responsibility. To create cards and mechanics which aren't just pay to win.