5 ms·

I don't see why they are charging the customer, instead of the dealer. It's like I'm paying you to get the privilege to shell out 30 grand. At the very least,

by vaksel 16y ago

I don't see why they are charging the customer, instead of the dealer. It's like I'm paying you to get the privilege to shell out 30 grand. At the very least, I should get a list of all dealers currently in the program. The problem I see, is that if you only sell 250 cars per month, then the dealers have no actual need to compete. 250 cars / 1 car per model(25 brands * ~10 cars), in the entire country. Most dealers won't compete for the privilege to sell the one Honda Civic in the entire country. + it seems like all they do is email the dealers saying "So and so is looking to buy this car...what's your best price?" And then follow it up with "So and so got the best offer of X...can you beat it?". With email, I can do the same thing....and I can email all 20 dealers in my area with the car, instead of having you limit my choice. + there is no indication of what kind of deal someone gets. You need to show your actual results "Linda R from X, bought a 2010 Honda Civic EX for $14,950". For all I know the best deal I get on the service is $100 less than MSRP.

mrkurt 16y ago
Charging the buyer gets the incentives right. The whole story is that "CarWoo is working for you, not the dealer like those lead generation sites".
- vaksel 16y ago
  charging me up front, tells me the story that they already got their cut and that they have no actual incentive to give me a good service.
  - tommy_mcclung 16y ago
    http://carwoo.com/guarantee http://carwoo.com/guarantee We give people their money back for any reason if they aren't happy.
    - redorb 16y ago
      that is one of the best "happiness guarantee" pages I've ever seen :) good job! I love the idea.
  - erik_landerholm 16y ago
    We have given people their money back for losing their down payment in a poker game. Charging buyers means we are 100% committed to the consumer and not beholden to dealers unlike every site on the internet.
  - mrkurt 16y ago
    Really? That's what paying money for something signals to you? My guess is that happy customers will tell their friends and use the service again when they buy another car. Those are both powerful incentives. What incentive do they have to do a good job for you when they're just turning your contact information over for lead generation money?
    - vaksel 16y ago
      it does when the service relies on the human element to get completed. You pay up front for websites/apps, because you get access/product right away. But any interaction where the human is involved(plumbers, tree service, mechanics, body shops etc)...you pay only after the job is finished. The reason is that when you pay someone they have no real incentive to give you their best service...since they already got paid. And yes word of mouth might work, but I'm not seeing awesome deals on there. The venture beat article shows they got someone an Accord for $32K. Carsdirect has that same top of the line trim for $28K. And carsdirect has the same incentive, give good service to get word of mouth so they can get more leads....the only difference is that you get to save a bunch of money too.
      - ajju 16y ago
        Since we are focusing on incentives, if they charge the dealer - they are working for the dealer. Who do you think they will be motivated to help better? If the dealer pays them, they have to help the dealer maximize his profit and the customer loses. Carsdirect is a broker of used cars. They solve the problem of letting sellers find buyers and vice versa, not the same as making the process of buying a new car painless and shorter. Most importantly though, their offer to refund your money for any reason makes this entire argument pointless. If they didn't think they could make you happier by saving you at least more than their fee, do you think they would make that promise?
        vaksel 16y ago
        they charge the dealer by providing sales, so yes they are working for the dealer...but the only way they can provide sales is by getting the customer a good price. So they are working for the customer. and carsidrect is for new cars, I think you are confusing them with cars.com actually your point that they have a refund policy led me to go look at that page...and my opinion is now even worse. Apparently that money only gets you one car. So you can't cross shop the best deal on a Civic and a Corolla to see which is the best option, without paying even more money.
- ryanhuff 16y ago
  I have used a car buying service (broker) that also charged the buyer up-front. The broker was somebody who I knew indirectly, and had some knowledge of his previous, happy customers. Even so, going into the purchase process, I was still hesitant that maybe I could still get a better deal on my own. The result was that going through the broker resulted in a very slightly better deal over what I could have received through Costco's buying service. With Costco, though, there is no fee. That's huge, because once I pay money, I feel locked in. That's not a comforting feeling. What the broker provided that the Costco service did not was searching for the exact vehicle, which 40 miles from my home, and delivering the purchased car to my door. No need to visit a car dealer. Overall, it was a positive experience, but I still prefer not locking myself to the broker by paying an up-front fee. Figure out a way to push the fee to the back-end (only with purchase) and I think you'd improve your chances.
tommy_mcclung 16y ago
We're going to get a list of all the dealers we're working with up ASAP. We spent the last year building up the dealer network, thanks for pointing out we forgot to show which dealers are participating. One thing to note, is we rarely have a situation where we don't have dealer coverage. Even in areas where we don't have dealers, we have a group of "Dealer Happiness Reps" that reach out and recruit dealers and we get them on as a dealer. There's no charge to dealers so it's very simple for them to signup and participate.

by vaksel 16y ago

mrkurt 16y ago

Charging the buyer gets the incentives right. The whole story is that "CarWoo is working for you, not the dealer like those lead generation sites".

vaksel 16y ago
charging me up front, tells me the story that they already got their cut and that they have no actual incentive to give me a good service.
- tommy_mcclung 16y ago
  http://carwoo.com/guarantee http://carwoo.com/guarantee We give people their money back for any reason if they aren't happy.
  - redorb 16y ago
    that is one of the best "happiness guarantee" pages I've ever seen :) good job! I love the idea.
- erik_landerholm 16y ago
  We have given people their money back for losing their down payment in a poker game. Charging buyers means we are 100% committed to the consumer and not beholden to dealers unlike every site on the internet.
- mrkurt 16y ago
  Really? That's what paying money for something signals to you? My guess is that happy customers will tell their friends and use the service again when they buy another car. Those are both powerful incentives. What incentive do they have to do a good job for you when they're just turning your contact information over for lead generation money?
  - vaksel 16y ago
    it does when the service relies on the human element to get completed. You pay up front for websites/apps, because you get access/product right away. But any interaction where the human is involved(plumbers, tree service, mechanics, body shops etc)...you pay only after the job is finished. The reason is that when you pay someone they have no real incentive to give you their best service...since they already got paid. And yes word of mouth might work, but I'm not seeing awesome deals on there. The venture beat article shows they got someone an Accord for $32K. Carsdirect has that same top of the line trim for $28K. And carsdirect has the same incentive, give good service to get word of mouth so they can get more leads....the only difference is that you get to save a bunch of money too.
    - ajju 16y ago
      Since we are focusing on incentives, if they charge the dealer - they are working for the dealer. Who do you think they will be motivated to help better? If the dealer pays them, they have to help the dealer maximize his profit and the customer loses. Carsdirect is a broker of used cars. They solve the problem of letting sellers find buyers and vice versa, not the same as making the process of buying a new car painless and shorter. Most importantly though, their offer to refund your money for any reason makes this entire argument pointless. If they didn't think they could make you happier by saving you at least more than their fee, do you think they would make that promise?
      - vaksel 16y ago
        they charge the dealer by providing sales, so yes they are working for the dealer...but the only way they can provide sales is by getting the customer a good price. So they are working for the customer. and carsidrect is for new cars, I think you are confusing them with cars.com actually your point that they have a refund policy led me to go look at that page...and my opinion is now even worse. Apparently that money only gets you one car. So you can't cross shop the best deal on a Civic and a Corolla to see which is the best option, without paying even more money.
ryanhuff 16y ago
I have used a car buying service (broker) that also charged the buyer up-front. The broker was somebody who I knew indirectly, and had some knowledge of his previous, happy customers. Even so, going into the purchase process, I was still hesitant that maybe I could still get a better deal on my own. The result was that going through the broker resulted in a very slightly better deal over what I could have received through Costco's buying service. With Costco, though, there is no fee. That's huge, because once I pay money, I feel locked in. That's not a comforting feeling. What the broker provided that the Costco service did not was searching for the exact vehicle, which 40 miles from my home, and delivering the purchased car to my door. No need to visit a car dealer. Overall, it was a positive experience, but I still prefer not locking myself to the broker by paying an up-front fee. Figure out a way to push the fee to the back-end (only with purchase) and I think you'd improve your chances.

tommy_mcclung 16y ago

We're going to get a list of all the dealers we're working with up ASAP. We spent the last year building up the dealer network, thanks for pointing out we forgot to show which dealers are participating. One thing to note, is we rarely have a situation where we don't have dealer coverage. Even in areas where we don't have dealers, we have a group of "Dealer Happiness Reps" that reach out and recruit dealers and we get them on as a dealer. There's no charge to dealers so it's very simple for them to signup and participate.