8 ms·

I got to live in Iowa in the summer of 2007 for an engineering internship at Rockwell Collins. One bonus of that was getting to go to all the rallies. I went to

I got to live in Iowa in the summer of 2007 for an engineering internship at Rockwell Collins. One bonus of that was getting to go to all the rallies. I went to a McCain rally and an Obama rally. I remember the energy of the room when Obama came in. The crowd was young and loud. Obama got up and gave his usual stump speech and then went around to shake hands. I shook his hand and got a word or two in but I could tell he wasn't really interested in talking to me and moved on. I went to a McCain rally a couple weeks later. A much older crowd and a little more subdued. This was around the time MoveOn was criticizing General Petraeus over his surge in Iraq policy. McCain was upset about this so the mood at the venue, which was a VFW, was a little more bitter. McCain gave a speech which was different than Obama's, a little more off-the-cuff and a little more angry. I remember him talking with the audience rather than to the audience like Obama. Afterwards, he shook hands with everyone and paused for a conversation. I remember talking to him about STEM programs and the importance of producing more engineers here in the U.S. He looked me in the eyes the whole time, was genuinely curious about my background, and wished me good luck at the end [0]. I ended up voting and working for Obama but I'll never forget that day and how genuine and down-to-earth McCain was with me. [0] - https://twitter.com/manishsinhaha/status/1033516157343387648 https://twitter.com/manishsinhaha/status/1033516157343387648

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gbacon 8y ago
McCain might have beaten Hillary, but when Obama locked up the drawn out Democratic nomination, the race was over for the reasons you described.
- secfirstmd 8y ago
  Also making the ridiculous decision (which says a lot about his judgement) to run with Sarah Palin as his VP.
  - darkerside 8y ago
    Interestingly, when you look at the last election, maybe he was just ahead of his time
  - aaron695 8y ago
    > Also making the ridiculous decision Movies are movies, but check out Game Change. https://www.imdb.com/title/tt01848902/ https://www.imdb.com/title/tt01848902/ (Also laugh how when it was made Palin was a crazy idea, but now it's not as cut and dry)
  - EpicEng 8y ago
    This is complete conjecture, so grain of salt and all that, but I'm not so sure it says what you think it does about his judgement. He had run before. Honest campaigns, little to no mud slinging, not what you typically see from politicians. He lost. He gave in to the RNC advisors and others around him that time around. Palin obviously turned out to be awful (maybe not strong enough a word) and he didn't care for her very much either, but I imagine he just wanted to get into office so that he could institute what he felt were good policies. I think he was fundamentally a good person and would have been a good leader, though of course we can debate the merits of his policies. Everything being equal, I'll vote for the person I believe has the interests of the populace at heart.
    - gbacon 8y ago
      I remember reading that McCain picked Palin over his handlers’ strong objections. Was it the other way around?
      - EpicEng 8y ago
        As far as I'm aware, he wanted Lieberman and caved to more conservative members of his party. Wikipedia seems to agree[1]. It does also say that he selected Palin because she appeared to be someone who would bolster his "maverick" image. He later regretted the choice. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vice_presidential_candidacy_of_Sarah_Palin#Selection https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vice_presidential_candidacy_of...
majos 8y ago
David Foster Wallace had a similar reaction to McCain when he covered him in the 2000 election [1]. [1] https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/david-foster-wallace-on-john-mccain-the-weasel-twelve-monkeys-and-the-shrub-194272/ https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/davi...
- abcdcba 8y ago
  This might be a dumb question but how does a prisoner refuse to leave? Can't they just kick him out?
  - danek 8y ago
    He was given the option to “skip the line” since his dad was an admiral. I think the way it worked is the POW who had been there longest would be first to leave when there was an exchange opportunity. McCain saw it as unfair for him to take someone else’s spot just because of who his dad was.
    - emptysea 8y ago
      It is also against the military code of conduct to accept parole or favors from the enemy. [0] [0]: http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/readings/code_of_conduct.htm http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/readings/code_of_conduct...
      - mortdeus 8y ago
        I think this is one of the circumstances where if he took the opportunity, it wouldn't be consider favoritism but rather of a strategic necessity considering how John Mccain's admiral father's decision making could be compromised by any risks such decisions could have towards his son's welfare. Of course there are way more variable involved, but I think his refusal was mostly on the basis of maintaining solidarity with the other POWs. In that situation, I could imagine that one of the few things that would keep me going was knowing that the thing i was fighting for back home wasn't just a delusion. If the other POWs saw Mccain released for on political reasons, then who is to say that the POWs loyalty to their nation wouldn't have been compromised?
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empath75 8y ago
I’m a dyed in the wool liberal who voted for obama every chance I got, but it was a positive vote for obama, not a vote against McCain or really even Romney who both seemed like decent people who happened to support policies I disagree with. Unlike 2016 which was a complete horror show all around.
- curun1r 8y ago
  I always felt that this country would have been in such a better position if McCain had beaten Bush in the 2000 Republican primary. When he ran in 2000, I felt McCain was extremely principled, even if I didn't agree with some of those principles. He even had a little momentum until the smear campaign in South Carolina, but once that happened, it derailed his campaign. When he ran again in 2008, it felt like he compromised on some of his principles because he felt he needed to "play the game" to have a chance of winning. Given how much of a disaster Bush's 8 years were (and we shouldn't let the colossal disaster we're currently experiencing shift our perception of those years), it's a real shame that McCain didn't get his chance then instead of Bush.
vortico 8y ago
It's interesting hearing stories like this. One thing to remember is that for the same time you got to experience his presence while shaking hands, you were also a part of his life experience too. It sounds like you certainly remember him, but he likely remembered those experiences too (as is the case with other celebrities thought as "too important to care about those moments").
LanceH 8y ago
I maintain this was a major reason for Bush defeating Kerry. I saw news stories on both of them one night and they were both in jeans. Kerry looked like they were purchased so he could dress down as the people do. The jeans looked like they had never been worn, maybe a dress shirt tucked in. Bush on the other hand was at Camp David casually talking to the press outdoors while his dog happily circled him. It's not really how we should be deciding the presidency, but Kerry put off a strong vibe that he's not one of "us". The democrats need to embrace the actual people in their popularity.
- arcticbull 8y ago
  This is a genuine question, I'm not leading here. Do you think this has to do with anti-intellectualism, jealousy or is there more at play here? I wouldn't want an average joe to run the country, I want someone truly extraordinary. Better suited to the role, more experienced, smarter, better dressed and showing it. I don't want the stereotypical truck stop waiter/waitress, you know? It's not fair as they may be just as qualified of course. What is so wrong with being an 'elite' in the political sphere? How do you think an average middle-of-the-road person would feel if an 'average joe' was promoted to be their boss? I'd guess probably not great...
  - duncanawoods 8y ago
    I think its about trust. We believe like individuals will have aligned interests. Elites will serve elites but regular Joe knows what its like for us. 9/10 times the Joe becomes elite and serves himself...
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - mortdeus 8y ago
    The reason politicians try to dress down is that they want to give off the impression that they can relate to the experiences of most Americans. The general idea being, "How could this person ever promote policy that benefits me, if they don't understand what it's like to be me?" The irony is that most successful people in the world were rarely ever born with a silver spoon in their mouth. Kerry was actually one of those few candidates that I wished got their shot because his war record wasn't anything less but admirable. John Mccain's war record was far and beyond even his considering his many years being a POW. They sacrificed so much for this country and yet the people only resonate with the candidates that seem hip nowadays.
Nitramp 8y ago
> I got to live in Iowa in the summer of 2007 [...] One bonus of that was getting to go to all the rallies. Unrelated to Mr McCain, but living in California during the Clinton/Trump election, this struck me as extremely odd. With California being essentially pre-decided due to the majority vote system, I saw zero campaign ads. Except for the news papers, the election simply didn't happen in California. What a weird system, where huge parts of the population get no representation.

deleted 8y ago

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gbacon 8y ago

McCain might have beaten Hillary, but when Obama locked up the drawn out Democratic nomination, the race was over for the reasons you described.

secfirstmd 8y ago
Also making the ridiculous decision (which says a lot about his judgement) to run with Sarah Palin as his VP.
- darkerside 8y ago
  Interestingly, when you look at the last election, maybe he was just ahead of his time
- aaron695 8y ago
  > Also making the ridiculous decision Movies are movies, but check out Game Change. https://www.imdb.com/title/tt01848902/ https://www.imdb.com/title/tt01848902/ (Also laugh how when it was made Palin was a crazy idea, but now it's not as cut and dry)
- EpicEng 8y ago
  This is complete conjecture, so grain of salt and all that, but I'm not so sure it says what you think it does about his judgement. He had run before. Honest campaigns, little to no mud slinging, not what you typically see from politicians. He lost. He gave in to the RNC advisors and others around him that time around. Palin obviously turned out to be awful (maybe not strong enough a word) and he didn't care for her very much either, but I imagine he just wanted to get into office so that he could institute what he felt were good policies. I think he was fundamentally a good person and would have been a good leader, though of course we can debate the merits of his policies. Everything being equal, I'll vote for the person I believe has the interests of the populace at heart.
  - gbacon 8y ago
    I remember reading that McCain picked Palin over his handlers’ strong objections. Was it the other way around?
    - EpicEng 8y ago
      As far as I'm aware, he wanted Lieberman and caved to more conservative members of his party. Wikipedia seems to agree[1]. It does also say that he selected Palin because she appeared to be someone who would bolster his "maverick" image. He later regretted the choice. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vice_presidential_candidacy_of_Sarah_Palin#Selection https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vice_presidential_candidacy_of...

majos 8y ago

David Foster Wallace had a similar reaction to McCain when he covered him in the 2000 election [1]. [1] https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/david-foster-wallace-on-john-mccain-the-weasel-twelve-monkeys-and-the-shrub-194272/ https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/davi...

abcdcba 8y ago
This might be a dumb question but how does a prisoner refuse to leave? Can't they just kick him out?
- danek 8y ago
  He was given the option to “skip the line” since his dad was an admiral. I think the way it worked is the POW who had been there longest would be first to leave when there was an exchange opportunity. McCain saw it as unfair for him to take someone else’s spot just because of who his dad was.
  - emptysea 8y ago
    It is also against the military code of conduct to accept parole or favors from the enemy. [0] [0]: http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/readings/code_of_conduct.htm http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/readings/code_of_conduct...
    - mortdeus 8y ago
      I think this is one of the circumstances where if he took the opportunity, it wouldn't be consider favoritism but rather of a strategic necessity considering how John Mccain's admiral father's decision making could be compromised by any risks such decisions could have towards his son's welfare. Of course there are way more variable involved, but I think his refusal was mostly on the basis of maintaining solidarity with the other POWs. In that situation, I could imagine that one of the few things that would keep me going was knowing that the thing i was fighting for back home wasn't just a delusion. If the other POWs saw Mccain released for on political reasons, then who is to say that the POWs loyalty to their nation wouldn't have been compromised?

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

empath75 8y ago

I’m a dyed in the wool liberal who voted for obama every chance I got, but it was a positive vote for obama, not a vote against McCain or really even Romney who both seemed like decent people who happened to support policies I disagree with. Unlike 2016 which was a complete horror show all around.

curun1r 8y ago
I always felt that this country would have been in such a better position if McCain had beaten Bush in the 2000 Republican primary. When he ran in 2000, I felt McCain was extremely principled, even if I didn't agree with some of those principles. He even had a little momentum until the smear campaign in South Carolina, but once that happened, it derailed his campaign. When he ran again in 2008, it felt like he compromised on some of his principles because he felt he needed to "play the game" to have a chance of winning. Given how much of a disaster Bush's 8 years were (and we shouldn't let the colossal disaster we're currently experiencing shift our perception of those years), it's a real shame that McCain didn't get his chance then instead of Bush.

vortico 8y ago

It's interesting hearing stories like this. One thing to remember is that for the same time you got to experience his presence while shaking hands, you were also a part of his life experience too. It sounds like you certainly remember him, but he likely remembered those experiences too (as is the case with other celebrities thought as "too important to care about those moments").

LanceH 8y ago

I maintain this was a major reason for Bush defeating Kerry. I saw news stories on both of them one night and they were both in jeans. Kerry looked like they were purchased so he could dress down as the people do. The jeans looked like they had never been worn, maybe a dress shirt tucked in. Bush on the other hand was at Camp David casually talking to the press outdoors while his dog happily circled him. It's not really how we should be deciding the presidency, but Kerry put off a strong vibe that he's not one of "us". The democrats need to embrace the actual people in their popularity.

arcticbull 8y ago
This is a genuine question, I'm not leading here. Do you think this has to do with anti-intellectualism, jealousy or is there more at play here? I wouldn't want an average joe to run the country, I want someone truly extraordinary. Better suited to the role, more experienced, smarter, better dressed and showing it. I don't want the stereotypical truck stop waiter/waitress, you know? It's not fair as they may be just as qualified of course. What is so wrong with being an 'elite' in the political sphere? How do you think an average middle-of-the-road person would feel if an 'average joe' was promoted to be their boss? I'd guess probably not great...
- duncanawoods 8y ago
  I think its about trust. We believe like individuals will have aligned interests. Elites will serve elites but regular Joe knows what its like for us. 9/10 times the Joe becomes elite and serves himself...
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- mortdeus 8y ago
  The reason politicians try to dress down is that they want to give off the impression that they can relate to the experiences of most Americans. The general idea being, "How could this person ever promote policy that benefits me, if they don't understand what it's like to be me?" The irony is that most successful people in the world were rarely ever born with a silver spoon in their mouth. Kerry was actually one of those few candidates that I wished got their shot because his war record wasn't anything less but admirable. John Mccain's war record was far and beyond even his considering his many years being a POW. They sacrificed so much for this country and yet the people only resonate with the candidates that seem hip nowadays.

Nitramp 8y ago

> I got to live in Iowa in the summer of 2007 [...] One bonus of that was getting to go to all the rallies. Unrelated to Mr McCain, but living in California during the Clinton/Trump election, this struck me as extremely odd. With California being essentially pre-decided due to the majority vote system, I saw zero campaign ads. Except for the news papers, the election simply didn't happen in California. What a weird system, where huge parts of the population get no representation.