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Recycling is a way to profit off of virtue signaling. Why should I separate my trash to make some recycling company more profitable? If they pay me enough, I mi

Recycling is a way to profit off of virtue signaling. Why should I separate my trash to make some recycling company more profitable? If they pay me enough, I might do it. Otherwise, it's all going into the landfill. Even aluminum. If some aluminum company wants it bad enough -- and if it's worth enough -- they can go dig it up. I dislike companies making profits on forced labor. Too many virtue-signaling municipalities mandate recycling (and sometimes even charges you for pickup) just so some recycling company can increase its bottom line. Nonsense. Bury everything. It's cheap.

maxerickson 8y ago
What's the pejorative term for when you brag that you just don't give a fuck?
Mediterraneo10 8y ago
> If some aluminum company wants it bad enough -- and if it's worth enough -- they can go dig it up. The point of recycling aluminium is that is avoids the enormous energy expenditures and carbon of processing raw ore. So, recycling is a sensible step towards environmental protection. It might “make a company some money”, but your failing to do it still has environmental consequences. And if a company had to go “dig it up”, there would probably still be more carbon generated than if you just sorted your rubbish.
- PeterisP 8y ago
  I'm reading the parent post's argument as less against recycling as such but rather against trash sorting by the general population. I.e. if recycling aluminium saves more resources than it cost in labor/effort, then it should be economically profitable to do so with the recycling company doing the sorting of that aluminium out of trash or even digging it up from the landfill instead of processing raw ore. If recycling something is profitable only if subsidized by free sorting labor from the general population, then it seems like a signal that it's not actually worth it to spend that labor on it, if reusing that material is so worthless compared to the effort it takes to sort it; so (depending on local economics) it may be that it's good to recycle scrap metal and aluminium and worthless to recycle paper or some types of plastic.
  - maxerickson 8y ago
    The idea that separating trash into 2 or 3 streams comes at a big personal cost is kind of ridiculous though. It doesn't involve a lot of time or space or whatever.
  - ubercow13 8y ago
    The effort it takes to sort it out from the rest of your trash once it's mixed in with your diapers and whatever else probably isn't equivalent to the effort of you sorting it in the first place, though
  - lurquer 8y ago
    Well said.
- lurquer 8y ago
  What's it worth to you? I'll gladly separate out my aluminum if you send me a check each month. How much are you willing to pay? You see, this isn't about virtue, or saving the planet, or any warm-fuzzy feelings. It's amount metal. It's my aluminum. I bought it. I have already paid my portion of the "enormous energy expenditures". If you want MY aluminum sent to some reprocessing facility, cut me a check each month and I'll sell you MY aluminum. All this talk of carbon and the environment... did you not read the article?! This is a multi-billion dollar business! This stuff is getting shipped all over the world. Until you -- or someone -- offers me hard cold cash for my aluminum, I'll do with it what I want.
  - Mediterraneo10 8y ago
    > I have already paid my portion of the 'enormous energy expenditures'. Unless your country has a truly effective carbon-offset plan, then the price you paid for that aluminium likely does not take into account the environmental externalities of producing it. Furthermore, the pure energy costs of producing aluminium – environmental externalities aside – are actually state-subsidized in a few places, so what one pays may not entirely cover the production. > This is a multi-billion dollar business! This stuff is getting shipped all over the world. As I said, the market and legislation being what it is, it is entirely possible for companies to make money from recycling, while at the same time an individual’s decision not to aid that recycling has an environmental toll. It may indeed be desirable to enact laws that redirect some of those recycling profits back to consumers, but in the meantime, simply refusing outright to sort your rubbish is still a jerk thing to do.
    - UncleEntity 8y ago
      > ...simply refusing outright to sort your rubbish is still a jerk thing to do. Don't really have any other option where I live since there's just a couple of shared dumpsters for the apartment complex and the neighbors across the street would probably get upset if us apartment dwellers filled up their recycling bin on a regular basis. Though, now that I'm thinking about it, my collection of years worth of fast food bags I have sitting in a cupboard might just end up in one of those bins next garbage day...
maxerickson 8y ago
Some trash haulers do process their garbage stream for metals and such. A lot of times municipal dumps are pushing recycling because it's cheaper than managing the material in the landfill for decades to come.
UncleEntity 8y ago
I just leave the aluminum cans in a bag next to the dumpster and they get magically recycled with no effort on my part by the folks who dumpster dive for recyclables around here. Saves them the hassle of digging them out and I get the satisfaction of knowing I'm doing my part for Mother Nature -- win/win in my book.

maxerickson 8y ago

What's the pejorative term for when you brag that you just don't give a fuck?

Mediterraneo10 8y ago

> If some aluminum company wants it bad enough -- and if it's worth enough -- they can go dig it up. The point of recycling aluminium is that is avoids the enormous energy expenditures and carbon of processing raw ore. So, recycling is a sensible step towards environmental protection. It might “make a company some money”, but your failing to do it still has environmental consequences. And if a company had to go “dig it up”, there would probably still be more carbon generated than if you just sorted your rubbish.

PeterisP 8y ago
I'm reading the parent post's argument as less against recycling as such but rather against trash sorting by the general population. I.e. if recycling aluminium saves more resources than it cost in labor/effort, then it should be economically profitable to do so with the recycling company doing the sorting of that aluminium out of trash or even digging it up from the landfill instead of processing raw ore. If recycling something is profitable only if subsidized by free sorting labor from the general population, then it seems like a signal that it's not actually worth it to spend that labor on it, if reusing that material is so worthless compared to the effort it takes to sort it; so (depending on local economics) it may be that it's good to recycle scrap metal and aluminium and worthless to recycle paper or some types of plastic.
- maxerickson 8y ago
  The idea that separating trash into 2 or 3 streams comes at a big personal cost is kind of ridiculous though. It doesn't involve a lot of time or space or whatever.
- ubercow13 8y ago
  The effort it takes to sort it out from the rest of your trash once it's mixed in with your diapers and whatever else probably isn't equivalent to the effort of you sorting it in the first place, though
- lurquer 8y ago
  Well said.
lurquer 8y ago
What's it worth to you? I'll gladly separate out my aluminum if you send me a check each month. How much are you willing to pay? You see, this isn't about virtue, or saving the planet, or any warm-fuzzy feelings. It's amount metal. It's my aluminum. I bought it. I have already paid my portion of the "enormous energy expenditures". If you want MY aluminum sent to some reprocessing facility, cut me a check each month and I'll sell you MY aluminum. All this talk of carbon and the environment... did you not read the article?! This is a multi-billion dollar business! This stuff is getting shipped all over the world. Until you -- or someone -- offers me hard cold cash for my aluminum, I'll do with it what I want.
- Mediterraneo10 8y ago
  > I have already paid my portion of the 'enormous energy expenditures'. Unless your country has a truly effective carbon-offset plan, then the price you paid for that aluminium likely does not take into account the environmental externalities of producing it. Furthermore, the pure energy costs of producing aluminium – environmental externalities aside – are actually state-subsidized in a few places, so what one pays may not entirely cover the production. > This is a multi-billion dollar business! This stuff is getting shipped all over the world. As I said, the market and legislation being what it is, it is entirely possible for companies to make money from recycling, while at the same time an individual’s decision not to aid that recycling has an environmental toll. It may indeed be desirable to enact laws that redirect some of those recycling profits back to consumers, but in the meantime, simply refusing outright to sort your rubbish is still a jerk thing to do.
  - UncleEntity 8y ago
    > ...simply refusing outright to sort your rubbish is still a jerk thing to do. Don't really have any other option where I live since there's just a couple of shared dumpsters for the apartment complex and the neighbors across the street would probably get upset if us apartment dwellers filled up their recycling bin on a regular basis. Though, now that I'm thinking about it, my collection of years worth of fast food bags I have sitting in a cupboard might just end up in one of those bins next garbage day...

maxerickson 8y ago

Some trash haulers do process their garbage stream for metals and such. A lot of times municipal dumps are pushing recycling because it's cheaper than managing the material in the landfill for decades to come.

UncleEntity 8y ago

I just leave the aluminum cans in a bag next to the dumpster and they get magically recycled with no effort on my part by the folks who dumpster dive for recyclables around here. Saves them the hassle of digging them out and I get the satisfaction of knowing I'm doing my part for Mother Nature -- win/win in my book.