2 ms·

The worst that can happen to the rich person is they go broke. The worst that can happen with the government is they turn the country into Venezuela, or devolve

The worst that can happen to the rich person is they go broke. The worst that can happen with the government is they turn the country into Venezuela, or devolve into mass killings like Mao’s China and the Soviet Union. The sad thing about today’s society is that all the lessons of last century are being forgotten.

Apocryphon 8y ago
Tell that to the victims of Henry Ford's security forces. We have forgotten history, indeed.
- aetherson 8y ago
  I mean, one takes the point that companies can very much harm people, often in subtle long-term ways, more rarely with direct, brutal violence. But if you stack up the victims of Ford's security forces next to the victims of various horrifying governments, you literally can't see the Ford victims.
  - Apocryphon 8y ago
    Sure, but the point is that the original post claims that rich people are completely innocuous, which is just blatantly false. Anyway form of power, whether through private capital or public political, is worthy of critique and skepticism.
    - aetherson 8y ago
      I think that you took an informal, slightly hyperbolic claim, and parsed it as a formal one.
      - Apocryphon 8y ago
        Sure, but fallacious oversimplistic political rhetoric should still be called out. This is a board of reason.
ebbv 8y ago
Your lack of understanding of even recent American history is breathtaking. Do a little more reading on the gilded age.
- dang 8y ago
  Personal attacks will get you banned on HN, regardless of how wrong or ignorant another commenter may be. Since you've frequently broken the site guidelines and ignored our requests to stop, I've banned this account. If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
arcticbull 8y ago
Yes, the worst that can happen to a rich person is they go broke, that doesn't mean they can't harm others along the way with little to no oversight. Union Carbide [1], Coca Cola killing union organizers [2], Nestle's use of child slaves [3] and of course, that time the Chiquita banana company started a 30 year long civil war in Guatemala [4] - then their CEO walked out of his 40th floor window in New York which almost seems worse than going broke ;) These are just recent. Speaking of lessons we haven't learned, there's the British and Dutch East India Companies, deputized by their governments to run their own territories - and the slave trade. [5] And boy did the VOC do it well, returning a 20% annual dividend for over 200 years, the single most valuable company in the history of the world ($7T in todays money). And that's just some flagship examples. Both are people or groups of people; companies don't have checks and balances - good government does. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhopal_disaster https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhopal_disaster [2] https://www.theguardian.com/media/2003/jul/24/marketingandpr.colombia https://www.theguardian.com/media/2003/jul/24/marketingandpr... [3] https://www.confectionerynews.com/Article/2018/02/13/Nestle-sued-again-over-child-labor-in-cocoa-supply-chain https://www.confectionerynews.com/Article/2018/02/13/Nestle-... [4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1954_Guatemalan_coup_d%27état https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1954_Guatemalan_coup_d%27état [5] http://theconversation.com/taboo-the-east-india-company-and-the-true-horrors-of-empire-73616 http://theconversation.com/taboo-the-east-india-company-and-...
- bassman9000 8y ago
  All of those examples pale in comparison to the atrocities by socialist governments, brought by, I assume, the best intentions. OP point stands IMHO.
- seibelj 8y ago
  Mass killings under communist regimes - best estimates are 65 to 165 million people in 100 years https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_killings_under_communist_regimes https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_killings_under_communis...

Apocryphon 8y ago

Tell that to the victims of Henry Ford's security forces. We have forgotten history, indeed.

aetherson 8y ago
I mean, one takes the point that companies can very much harm people, often in subtle long-term ways, more rarely with direct, brutal violence. But if you stack up the victims of Ford's security forces next to the victims of various horrifying governments, you literally can't see the Ford victims.
- Apocryphon 8y ago
  Sure, but the point is that the original post claims that rich people are completely innocuous, which is just blatantly false. Anyway form of power, whether through private capital or public political, is worthy of critique and skepticism.
  - aetherson 8y ago
    I think that you took an informal, slightly hyperbolic claim, and parsed it as a formal one.
    - Apocryphon 8y ago
      Sure, but fallacious oversimplistic political rhetoric should still be called out. This is a board of reason.

ebbv 8y ago

Your lack of understanding of even recent American history is breathtaking. Do a little more reading on the gilded age.

dang 8y ago
Personal attacks will get you banned on HN, regardless of how wrong or ignorant another commenter may be. Since you've frequently broken the site guidelines and ignored our requests to stop, I've banned this account. If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

arcticbull 8y ago

Yes, the worst that can happen to a rich person is they go broke, that doesn't mean they can't harm others along the way with little to no oversight. Union Carbide [1], Coca Cola killing union organizers [2], Nestle's use of child slaves [3] and of course, that time the Chiquita banana company started a 30 year long civil war in Guatemala [4] - then their CEO walked out of his 40th floor window in New York which almost seems worse than going broke ;) These are just recent. Speaking of lessons we haven't learned, there's the British and Dutch East India Companies, deputized by their governments to run their own territories - and the slave trade. [5] And boy did the VOC do it well, returning a 20% annual dividend for over 200 years, the single most valuable company in the history of the world ($7T in todays money). And that's just some flagship examples. Both are people or groups of people; companies don't have checks and balances - good government does. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhopal_disaster https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhopal_disaster [2] https://www.theguardian.com/media/2003/jul/24/marketingandpr.colombia https://www.theguardian.com/media/2003/jul/24/marketingandpr... [3] https://www.confectionerynews.com/Article/2018/02/13/Nestle-sued-again-over-child-labor-in-cocoa-supply-chain https://www.confectionerynews.com/Article/2018/02/13/Nestle-... [4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1954_Guatemalan_coup_d%27état https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1954_Guatemalan_coup_d%27état [5] http://theconversation.com/taboo-the-east-india-company-and-the-true-horrors-of-empire-73616 http://theconversation.com/taboo-the-east-india-company-and-...

bassman9000 8y ago
All of those examples pale in comparison to the atrocities by socialist governments, brought by, I assume, the best intentions. OP point stands IMHO.
seibelj 8y ago
Mass killings under communist regimes - best estimates are 65 to 165 million people in 100 years https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_killings_under_communist_regimes https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_killings_under_communis...