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Interesting post and comments, as usual. I wanted to give some pragmatic information related to this. I have a genetic condition that makes my mitochondria to
by fasteo 8y ago
Interesting post and comments, as usual. I wanted to give some pragmatic information related to this.
I have a genetic condition that makes my mitochondria to malfunction. I was diagnosed about 10 years ago. At first, I started taking supplements to increase the production of ATP, but my "vitality" did not improve much. I could workout normally, but my recovery ability was poor, and from time to time I would just crash and burn for 2-3 days.
After much reading, I came to the conclusion that the problem was not a shortage of ATP. Rather, it was the mess created by all the workarounds my body was doing to maintain a level of ATP that could keep me alive. So, I started taking the following pre-bed stack. It is meant to be a clean-up the mess, anti-inflammatory:
- 2g Vitamin C
- 500 mg reduced glutathione
- 500 mg curcumin (I prefer BCM-95)
- 1-5 mg melatonin (depending on activity level)
- 100 mg CoQ10
(I am also considering adding Ashwagandha to the stack)
As of today, I workout 4-5 times per week, with 2 sessions of boxing (like punching in the face, not the aerobic variation), 1 heavy lifting session (usually squats) and 1-2 metabolic circuit sessions.
Sure I feel tired at times, but it is not liked the deep, extreme fatigue I felt before starting this stack.
Hope this helps.
- delbel 8y agoI'm curious. if you occasionally have fatigue in a cycle, consistent with some kind of infection growth life cycle, you should try removing vitamin C and gluthatione for 10 days and see if you feel even better. if you do, you need to go see a doctor to get screened for parasitic infections that cannot be found with just looking at a regular blood test. 99% chance you don't have one, but I am curious.
- fasteo 8y agoInteresting comment. I have thought about this in the past as mitochondria, roughly speaking, is a bacteria. As such, it is in a constant flux of fission and fusion cycles and targeting this cycle is a potential target to treat my disease. For a fascinating experiment, check out Longecity's "Manipulating mitochondrial dynamics" post [1]. Worth reading. Based on this, I am still trying to set up a protocol for my disease, but have not tried that yet. [1] https://www.longecity.org/forum/topic/94224-manipulating-mitochondrial-dynamics https://www.longecity.org/forum/topic/94224-manipulating-mit...
- manmal 8y agoInteresting! Do you take pure ascorbic acid, or a buffered form such as magnesium ascorbate, or a liposomal version? Also, how big do you estimate the impact CoQ10 has? Have you considered ubiquinol? From my own toolbox, I can highly recommend near infrared therapy (easy to setup your own little sauna for about 50 bucks, just buy some lamps and drill the sockets onto a wooden board); also CBD is a great recovery aid, in case you haven’t tried it (up the dose slowly, there IS a Goldilocks dose for everyone).
- fasteo 8y ago>>> Do you take pure ascorbic acid, or a buffered form such as magnesium ascorbate, or a liposomal version? Pure ascorbic acid. >>> how big do you estimate the impact CoQ10 has? I am taking CoQ10 since I was diagnosed and it has been really helpful to improve my vitality. I have changed the dosage over the time (100mg-600mg daily). Right now, 100mg at bedtime is working great for me. >>> Have you considered ubiquinol? Yes, I have tried ubiquinol, but haven't noticed any improvement over plain CoQ10. Note that I take CoQ10 with improved bio-availability (Q-absorb). >>> I can highly recommend near infrared therapy Thanks! I recently bought one [1], but have not used it much. [1] https://redlightman.com/product/infrared-830-device/ https://redlightman.com/product/infrared-830-device/ >>> From my own toolbox Do you also have a mitochondrial dysfunction ?
- manmal 8y agoThank you! I will check out Q-absorb. I have a very similar device from RLM, but the one that produces 4 different wavelengths. I use ordinary heat lamps more often though as I want to provoke sweating. Re mito dysfunction - I don’t know for sure, I have a few MTHFR related „mutations“ (which can affect mitos), but have no diagnosis regarding mito dysfunction yet. I strongly suspect that I do, though.
- fasteo 8y agoDiagnosis has improved a lot lately. Tell your doctor to order a kit at mitoswab dot com. I have not tried them, but they claim that "MITOSWAB has an 84% correlation to the muscle biopsy" and it is simple, non-invasive test. Take care.
- Numberwang 8y agoI'd recommend turmeric instead of curicumin and to not take melatonin but I'm happy you are feeling better, so whatever works for you.
- fasteo 8y agoThanks for the recommendation. Could you elaborate a bit, specially about melatonin ?
- Numberwang 8y agoHere is a video re Melatonin: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2q1ln6vaSE0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2q1ln6vaSE0
- mtgx 8y agoOn the melatonin I would add that studies have shown negligible increase in effectiveness over 0.3mg. Yes, most pharma stores offer only 3mg and above, but that seems to be wrong. Personally I've only taken melatonin when I most needed it, and then gave up on it. You should try giving it up, too, unless you really can't do without it. You should check the vitamin D level, too, whenever you do your next blood test. As for curcumin, the Longvida formula seems to be most effective. I can't say I've noticed any effects from it myself, but I haven't taken it daily, and I've also read that you need to take curcumin for 2+ weeks to see the effects. https://www.turmericforhealth.com/curcumin-benefits-and-dosage/8-popular-curcumin-supplement-types-in-market-today-a-quick-review https://www.turmericforhealth.com/curcumin-benefits-and-dosa...
- fasteo 8y agoOn the melatonin, note that I do not take it to fall asleep, but for its protective effects in the mitochondria. This [1] is a good review. [1] https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1600-079X.2004.00181.x https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1600-079X...
- 8y ago
- reacweb 8y agoWhat were the symtoms? How did you get diagnosed?
- fasteo 8y ago>>> What were the symptoms? It varies greatly, both in number and severity, between patients, but in my case main symptoms are ptosis (droopy eyelids), diplopia (double vision), muscle weakness and general fatigue Other symptoms include exercise intolerance, gut motility problems, cognitive problems, heart problems, etc >> How did you get diagnosed? Diagnose took 2 years. At the end, a muscle biopsy revealed my disease (mitochondrial myopathy [1] due to a large-scale single mtDNA deletion). My phenotype is known a CPEO [2] [1] https://www.mda.org/disease/mitochondrial-myopathies https://www.mda.org/disease/mitochondrial-myopathies [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronic_progressive_external_ophthalmoplegia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronic_progressive_external_o...
- porker 8y agoThanks, this is a really interesting post. Have you ever tried N-Acetylcysteine?
- fasteo 8y ago>>> this is a really interesting post. Glad you liked it ! >>> Have you ever tried N-Acetylcysteine? Yes, before reduced glutathione was available I took NAC from time to time, but I feel that in my case reduced glutathione works way better than NAC. Maybe I have a problem converting NAC to glutathione.
- Axsuul 8y agoWhat brand of reduced glutathione do you use?
- mrfusion 8y agoCould some of your problems come from being punched in the face regularly?
- fasteo 8y agoI wish it would ! Would be an easy fix. I fight with headhear and 16oz gloves, and we do not seek to knock out our partner. It’s boxing, that is, a sport for gentlemen, not for brainless savages.