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If you're ethnically Asian but don't speak Japanese, Japan will not be welcoming at all. If you don't look ethnically Asian, Japanese people will give you allo

If you're ethnically Asian but don't speak Japanese, Japan will not be welcoming at all. If you don't look ethnically Asian, Japanese people will give you allowances and defer to you. However, if you're Asian and not Japanese, they look down on you. Read about ethnic Koreans in Japan and how they're oppressed[0]. They speak fluent Japanese and their families have lived 3 generations in Japan. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koreans_in_Japan#Integration_into_Japanese_society https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koreans_in_Japan#Integration_i...

Karishmra1234 8y ago
Let us not generalise and make racially charged accusations against another culture please. If it personal experience you had faced it could be anecdotal.
mikekchar 8y ago
My student who was of Korean decent but was the most popular person in high school and went to a good university would disagree with you. As would my friend who was born in Korea, married a Japanese woman and moved to Japan. There is discrimination in Japan, but it's frustrating to see this trotted out time and time again as if you'll be systemically discriminated against no matter where you are. It's just not true. But if you don't speak Japanese, it doesn't matter if you are Asian looking or not, you won't fit in here. There are lots of other ways you won't fit in here too. Not speaking Japanese well is an absolute deal breaker, though. Edit: I should point out that there is nothing wrong with the Wikipedia page. As far as I understand what it states is absolutely correct. It's simply that Japan does not have dual citizenship at all. So if you want Japanese citizenship you can have it -- you just have to give up your other citizenship. Japan also does not give citizenship automatically if you are born here. You have to have at least 1 parent who is a citizen. However, you can apply for citizenship and you will get it -- as long as you give up any other citizenship. Otherwise you will essentially have permanent resident status. The latter point is admittedly crazy and it is very unfortunate that many Koreans are born into this situation, but they can fix it by naturalising. They don't want to. BTW, the student of a friend of mine was American and had exactly the same issue. It's not an issue of racism.
- jimmywanger 8y ago
  The plural of anecdote is not data. And Korean people have been oppressed in the past, and no attempt to rectify the situation has been made by the government. That's why a lot of Korean people born in Japan gravitate towards less savoury activities. Plus, Japanese took Chinese and Korean women and forced them to become whores or "comfort women" for the Japanese soldiers stationed in the mainland. As recently as 2014 the Prime Minister of Japan said there was no evidence that the Japanese government took "slaves". And the second point, which you don't touch upon, is if you look even vaguely Japanese at all, you are expected to follow all the social norms. If you don't, they give you a pass.
  - sofon 8y ago
    "The plural of anecdote is not data." Then present some data other than a wikipedia article which doesn't appear to support your case.
    - jimmywanger 8y ago
      The wikipedia article indicates that as recently as 2007, the Prime Minister of Japan did not believe that the Japanese government seized the comfort women by force[0]. When we riot over Confederate statues, and yet we're ok with their government officials visiting shrines which celebrate war criminals[1]? Of course the United States is not blameless. We gave amnesty to the leaders of Camp 731 in exchange for experimental knowledge and the Tuskegee experiments are of course unforgivable. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comfort_women#History_of_the_issue https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comfort_women#History_of_the_i... [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yasukuni_Shrine#Post-war_issues_and_controversies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yasukuni_Shrine#Post-war_issue...
      - sofon 8y ago
        You're talking about the Japanese PM, and it's possible to make a case that current and past PMs have been racist. That's not the same as saying that the population in general are racist and Asians are oppressed i.e.: "if you're Asian and not Japanese, they look down on you. Read about ethnic Koreans in Japan and how they're oppressed" So... data that shows that non-Japanese Asians are oppressed in Japan? On top of that, is there data that shows that racism in Japan is quantitatively worse than other countries?
dbjh 8y ago
To name Koreans as an example is disingenuous. If you read the Wikipedia article you will also see that the problems come from both sides. The Koreans the Wikipedia article talks about do not want to fully integrate - they insist on their Korean nationality and demand rights of both Korean and Japanese nationals. At this point in time they have managed to obtain a special status that is the opposite of being oppressed and is actually a source of irritation among Japanese I know. As anectodal evidence to counter your claim, in the Japanese company I work for (in Japan), my direct superior is Taiwanese, one colleague Korean and another Malay and they are all treated like any other.
- lifthrasiir 8y ago
  It might be disingenuous but not entirely false. The integration you describe is not mandatory to be accepted as a member of many societies, and the seeming inability to integrate was historically used as a legitimate reason to discriminate them even after considerable efforts. There are so many ongoing discriminations specific to Japan [1], including aforementioned pre-1945 Korean immigrants (and by extension their descendants or all Koreans), Ainu peoples, Ryukyuan peoples and Burakumin. Sometimes they result in criminal or problematic acts; for example, Korean immigrants are a major force behind the notorious pachinko industry. Still such phenomena do not mask the underlying problem. > At this point in time they have managed to obtain a special status that is the opposite of being oppressed and is actually a source of irritation among Japanese I know. They have managed to obtain a special status because they have been oppressed! You are swapping the cause and the effect. Also you can't use irritation among Japanese as a rationale or whatever because they are naturally biased---it's just that, they feel so and there might or might not be a good reason. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_issues_in_Japan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_issues_in_Japan
  - dbjh 8y ago
    I wasn't swapping anything. I was arguing against the claim that Koreans are being oppressed. They're not. In an attempt by the Japanese government to make amends they have been given privileges that other foreigners don't enjoy. Some Japanese see that as unfair, because why would they enjoy special privileges if they have not been subject to unfair treatment as their ancestors were? That's where the irritation comes from.

Karishmra1234 8y ago

Let us not generalise and make racially charged accusations against another culture please. If it personal experience you had faced it could be anecdotal.

mikekchar 8y ago

My student who was of Korean decent but was the most popular person in high school and went to a good university would disagree with you. As would my friend who was born in Korea, married a Japanese woman and moved to Japan. There is discrimination in Japan, but it's frustrating to see this trotted out time and time again as if you'll be systemically discriminated against no matter where you are. It's just not true. But if you don't speak Japanese, it doesn't matter if you are Asian looking or not, you won't fit in here. There are lots of other ways you won't fit in here too. Not speaking Japanese well is an absolute deal breaker, though. Edit: I should point out that there is nothing wrong with the Wikipedia page. As far as I understand what it states is absolutely correct. It's simply that Japan does not have dual citizenship at all. So if you want Japanese citizenship you can have it -- you just have to give up your other citizenship. Japan also does not give citizenship automatically if you are born here. You have to have at least 1 parent who is a citizen. However, you can apply for citizenship and you will get it -- as long as you give up any other citizenship. Otherwise you will essentially have permanent resident status. The latter point is admittedly crazy and it is very unfortunate that many Koreans are born into this situation, but they can fix it by naturalising. They don't want to. BTW, the student of a friend of mine was American and had exactly the same issue. It's not an issue of racism.

jimmywanger 8y ago
The plural of anecdote is not data. And Korean people have been oppressed in the past, and no attempt to rectify the situation has been made by the government. That's why a lot of Korean people born in Japan gravitate towards less savoury activities. Plus, Japanese took Chinese and Korean women and forced them to become whores or "comfort women" for the Japanese soldiers stationed in the mainland. As recently as 2014 the Prime Minister of Japan said there was no evidence that the Japanese government took "slaves". And the second point, which you don't touch upon, is if you look even vaguely Japanese at all, you are expected to follow all the social norms. If you don't, they give you a pass.
- sofon 8y ago
  "The plural of anecdote is not data." Then present some data other than a wikipedia article which doesn't appear to support your case.
  - jimmywanger 8y ago
    The wikipedia article indicates that as recently as 2007, the Prime Minister of Japan did not believe that the Japanese government seized the comfort women by force[0]. When we riot over Confederate statues, and yet we're ok with their government officials visiting shrines which celebrate war criminals[1]? Of course the United States is not blameless. We gave amnesty to the leaders of Camp 731 in exchange for experimental knowledge and the Tuskegee experiments are of course unforgivable. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comfort_women#History_of_the_issue https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comfort_women#History_of_the_i... [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yasukuni_Shrine#Post-war_issues_and_controversies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yasukuni_Shrine#Post-war_issue...
    - sofon 8y ago
      You're talking about the Japanese PM, and it's possible to make a case that current and past PMs have been racist. That's not the same as saying that the population in general are racist and Asians are oppressed i.e.: "if you're Asian and not Japanese, they look down on you. Read about ethnic Koreans in Japan and how they're oppressed" So... data that shows that non-Japanese Asians are oppressed in Japan? On top of that, is there data that shows that racism in Japan is quantitatively worse than other countries?

dbjh 8y ago

To name Koreans as an example is disingenuous. If you read the Wikipedia article you will also see that the problems come from both sides. The Koreans the Wikipedia article talks about do not want to fully integrate - they insist on their Korean nationality and demand rights of both Korean and Japanese nationals. At this point in time they have managed to obtain a special status that is the opposite of being oppressed and is actually a source of irritation among Japanese I know. As anectodal evidence to counter your claim, in the Japanese company I work for (in Japan), my direct superior is Taiwanese, one colleague Korean and another Malay and they are all treated like any other.

lifthrasiir 8y ago
It might be disingenuous but not entirely false. The integration you describe is not mandatory to be accepted as a member of many societies, and the seeming inability to integrate was historically used as a legitimate reason to discriminate them even after considerable efforts. There are so many ongoing discriminations specific to Japan [1], including aforementioned pre-1945 Korean immigrants (and by extension their descendants or all Koreans), Ainu peoples, Ryukyuan peoples and Burakumin. Sometimes they result in criminal or problematic acts; for example, Korean immigrants are a major force behind the notorious pachinko industry. Still such phenomena do not mask the underlying problem. > At this point in time they have managed to obtain a special status that is the opposite of being oppressed and is actually a source of irritation among Japanese I know. They have managed to obtain a special status because they have been oppressed! You are swapping the cause and the effect. Also you can't use irritation among Japanese as a rationale or whatever because they are naturally biased---it's just that, they feel so and there might or might not be a good reason. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_issues_in_Japan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_issues_in_Japan
- dbjh 8y ago
  I wasn't swapping anything. I was arguing against the claim that Koreans are being oppressed. They're not. In an attempt by the Japanese government to make amends they have been given privileges that other foreigners don't enjoy. Some Japanese see that as unfair, because why would they enjoy special privileges if they have not been subject to unfair treatment as their ancestors were? That's where the irritation comes from.