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Denmark and Germany are not socialist.

arcticbull 8y ago
Denmark is actually, literally, in the Merriam-Webster definition of Social Democracy / Democratic Socialism. [1] Your one-word denials are unhelpful and uninteresting. Cite some sources and make a case. [1] https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/social%20democracy https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/social%20democrac...
- antidesitter 8y ago
  You are confusing democratic socialism with social democracy. This is a common mistake, but you should understand the difference.
  - TheCoelacanth 8y ago
    So should literally every single person every commenting on US politics ever, because pretty much no person in recent history who has ever come close to holding any federal elected office in the US has ever advocated for actual socialism, even the people who self-identify as socialists like Bernie Sanders or Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez. If you use the real definition of socialism, you might as well say "the US should not adopt Nazism" as "the US should not adopt socialism" because both are equally likely to actually be adopted (i.e. not very likely at all). No mainstream politician in the US is suggesting that the state should take over ownership of most private businesses.
  - arcticbull 8y ago
    These are actually considered equivalent in modern political discourse, hit that Merriam-Webster link in the parent.
    - antidesitter 8y ago
      > These are actually considered equivalent in modern political discourse Not true. Especially not in Europe. > hit that Merriam-Webster link in the parent Unfortunately, Merriam-Webster has it wrong in this case. Social democracy is not a synonym for democratic socialism. The two are very different ideologies with very different goals. As stated in the Wikipedia article for social democracy (with accompanying references): "Social democracy is a political, social and economic ideology that supports economic and social interventions to promote social justice within the framework of a liberal democratic polity and capitalist economy... Social democracy became associated with Keynesian economics, state interventionism and the welfare state, while abandoning the prior goal of replacing the capitalist system (factor markets, private property and wage labor) with a qualitatively different socialist economic system... By the post-World War II period, most social democrats in Europe had abandoned their ideological connection to Marxism and shifted their emphasis toward social policy reform in place of transition from capitalism to socialism." [emphasis added] Contrast this with the article for democratic socialism: "Democratic socialism is further distinguished from social democracy on the basis that democratic socialists are committed to systemic transformation of the economy from capitalism to socialism, whereas social democracy is supportive of reforms to capitalism... As socialists, democratic socialists believe that the systemic issues of capitalism can only be solved by replacing the capitalist system with a socialist system—i.e. by replacing private ownership with social ownership of the means of production." In summary, social democracy grew out of a movement that advocated transitioning from capitalism to socialism, but ultimately rejected such a transition in favor of working within a capitalist economy. Democratic socialism, on the other hand, advocates for the abolition of capitalism and private property. It does not reflect the present policies of Denmark and Germany, given that neither intends to abolish private property and transition to a socialist economy.
      - deleted 8y ago
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- curtisblaine 8y ago
  Social democracy is not socialism. Social democracy is always expressed within a capitalist and liberal framework, while socialism negates capitalism altogether. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy

Denmark is actually, literally, in the Merriam-Webster definition of Social Democracy / Democratic Socialism. [1] Your one-word denials are unhelpful and uninteresting. Cite some sources and make a case. [1] https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/social%20democracy https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/social%20democrac...

antidesitter 8y ago
You are confusing democratic socialism with social democracy. This is a common mistake, but you should understand the difference.
- TheCoelacanth 8y ago
  So should literally every single person every commenting on US politics ever, because pretty much no person in recent history who has ever come close to holding any federal elected office in the US has ever advocated for actual socialism, even the people who self-identify as socialists like Bernie Sanders or Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez. If you use the real definition of socialism, you might as well say "the US should not adopt Nazism" as "the US should not adopt socialism" because both are equally likely to actually be adopted (i.e. not very likely at all). No mainstream politician in the US is suggesting that the state should take over ownership of most private businesses.
- arcticbull 8y ago
  These are actually considered equivalent in modern political discourse, hit that Merriam-Webster link in the parent.
  - antidesitter 8y ago
    > These are actually considered equivalent in modern political discourse Not true. Especially not in Europe. > hit that Merriam-Webster link in the parent Unfortunately, Merriam-Webster has it wrong in this case. Social democracy is not a synonym for democratic socialism. The two are very different ideologies with very different goals. As stated in the Wikipedia article for social democracy (with accompanying references): "Social democracy is a political, social and economic ideology that supports economic and social interventions to promote social justice within the framework of a liberal democratic polity and capitalist economy... Social democracy became associated with Keynesian economics, state interventionism and the welfare state, while abandoning the prior goal of replacing the capitalist system (factor markets, private property and wage labor) with a qualitatively different socialist economic system... By the post-World War II period, most social democrats in Europe had abandoned their ideological connection to Marxism and shifted their emphasis toward social policy reform in place of transition from capitalism to socialism." [emphasis added] Contrast this with the article for democratic socialism: "Democratic socialism is further distinguished from social democracy on the basis that democratic socialists are committed to systemic transformation of the economy from capitalism to socialism, whereas social democracy is supportive of reforms to capitalism... As socialists, democratic socialists believe that the systemic issues of capitalism can only be solved by replacing the capitalist system with a socialist system—i.e. by replacing private ownership with social ownership of the means of production." In summary, social democracy grew out of a movement that advocated transitioning from capitalism to socialism, but ultimately rejected such a transition in favor of working within a capitalist economy. Democratic socialism, on the other hand, advocates for the abolition of capitalism and private property. It does not reflect the present policies of Denmark and Germany, given that neither intends to abolish private property and transition to a socialist economy.
    - deleted 8y ago
      [deleted]
curtisblaine 8y ago
Social democracy is not socialism. Social democracy is always expressed within a capitalist and liberal framework, while socialism negates capitalism altogether. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy