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> discrimination in housing transactions "Advertising housing" is NOT "housing transaction". Transaction happens when landlord and renter signing renting agree

> discrimination in housing transactions "Advertising housing" is NOT "housing transaction". Transaction happens when landlord and renter signing renting agreement.

zapita 8y ago
I haven't expressed an opinion either way - I'm just quoting what the linked article says.
astura 8y ago
The FHA clearly regulates housing advertising. >>(c) To make, print, or publish, or cause to be made, printed, or published any notice, statement, or advertisement, with respect to the sale or rental of a dwelling that indicates any preference, limitation, or discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex, handicap, familial status, or national origin, or an intention to make any such preference, limitation, or discrimination.
- bonzini 8y ago
  There is no indication of preference/limitation/discrimination in the content that reaches the end user of Facebook.
  - azernik 8y ago
    But there is selective use of advertising to target specific markets, which is an issue about which the Code of Federal Regulations, section 109.25 (https://www.hud.gov/sites/documents/DOC_7781.PDF https://www.hud.gov/sites/documents/DOC_7781.PDF) is completely clear: > § 109.25 Selective use of advertising media or content. > The selective use of advertising media or content when particular combinations thereof are used exclusively with respect to various housing developments or sites can lead to discriminatory results and may indicate a violation of the Fair Housing Act. For example, the use of English language media alone or the exclusive use of media catering to the majority population in an area, when, in such area, there are also available non-English language or other minority media, may have discriminatory impact. Similarly, the selective use of human models in advertisements may have discriminatory impact. The following are examples of the selective use of advertisements which may be discriminatory: > (a) Selective geographic advertisements. Such selective use may involve the strategic placement of billboards; brochure advertisements distributed within a limited geographic area by hand or in the mail; advertising in particular geographic coverage editions of major metropolitan newspapers or in newspapers of limited circulation which are mainly advertising vehicles for reaching a particular segment of the community; or displays or announcements available only in selected sales offices. > (b) Selective use of equal opportunity slogan or logo. When placing advertisements, such selective use may involve placing the equal housing opportunity slogan or logo in advertising reaching some geographic areas, but not others, or with respect to some properties but not others. > (c) Selective use of human models when conducting an advertising campaign. Selective advertising may involve an advertising campaign using human models primarily in media that cater to one racial or national origin segment of the population without a complementary advertising campaign that is directed at other groups. Another example may involve use of racially mixed models by a developer to advertise one development and not others. Similar care must be exercised in advertising in publications or other media directed at one particular sex, or at persons without children. Such selective advertising may involve the use of human models of members of only one sex, or of adults only, in displays, photographs or drawings to indicate preferences for one sex or the other, or for adults to the exclusion of children. Targeted advertising was already a thing when these regulations were written decades ago; internet advertising is just a difference in scale and cost.
  - pests 8y ago
    The lengths at which you are going to rationalize racism just astounds me. Answer me this. How on Facebook you would expect an excluded person to be able to know about the sale? They wouldn't. The housing listing doesn't exist for them. How do you see this as fair?! I am blown away by all the casual racism all throughout this thread.
    - astura 8y ago
      I am convinced half these commenters are just being disingenuous just for the sake of it. These sorts of cases are settled and straightforward, we have a half century of case law plus multiple publications from HUD that directly address this issue. Craigslist actually does an excellent job of summarizing the laws and giving specific examples of illegal advertisements. https://www.craigslist.org/about/FHA https://www.craigslist.org/about/FHA
      - pests 8y ago
        It may be easier to believe they are being disingenuous but the real answer is probably that they are in fact racist. Its a hard truth to swallow. The rest of this isn't directed just at you astura. If this was some random Facebook or 4chan comment would you be so quick to come to that rationalization? I feel we like to think the individuals we associate with on HN are like minded. To admit they aren't is almost a personal affront. To keep the disillusion going we must rationalize and make up excuses for them or how they behave. But sometimes a duck is a duck.
        vsl 8y ago
        Give me a break. Not everybody that disagrees with you is a racist. Landlord that prefer to not have couples with children aren’t racist. I too am confused how targeting may be illegal under a law that forbids discrimination and discriminating content of ads - I am not familiar with the law. Lack of knowledge/understanding doesn’t make me “racist”. Some other comments in this inflammatory thread helped me get the point, but your attacks on everybody as racists-by-defaul are deeply bigoted and insulting.

> discrimination in housing transactions "Advertising housing" is NOT "housing transaction". Transaction happens when landlord and renter signing renting agreement.

zapita 8y ago

I haven't expressed an opinion either way - I'm just quoting what the linked article says.

astura 8y ago

The FHA clearly regulates housing advertising. >>(c) To make, print, or publish, or cause to be made, printed, or published any notice, statement, or advertisement, with respect to the sale or rental of a dwelling that indicates any preference, limitation, or discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex, handicap, familial status, or national origin, or an intention to make any such preference, limitation, or discrimination.

bonzini 8y ago
There is no indication of preference/limitation/discrimination in the content that reaches the end user of Facebook.
- azernik 8y ago
  But there is selective use of advertising to target specific markets, which is an issue about which the Code of Federal Regulations, section 109.25 (https://www.hud.gov/sites/documents/DOC_7781.PDF https://www.hud.gov/sites/documents/DOC_7781.PDF) is completely clear: > § 109.25 Selective use of advertising media or content. > The selective use of advertising media or content when particular combinations thereof are used exclusively with respect to various housing developments or sites can lead to discriminatory results and may indicate a violation of the Fair Housing Act. For example, the use of English language media alone or the exclusive use of media catering to the majority population in an area, when, in such area, there are also available non-English language or other minority media, may have discriminatory impact. Similarly, the selective use of human models in advertisements may have discriminatory impact. The following are examples of the selective use of advertisements which may be discriminatory: > (a) Selective geographic advertisements. Such selective use may involve the strategic placement of billboards; brochure advertisements distributed within a limited geographic area by hand or in the mail; advertising in particular geographic coverage editions of major metropolitan newspapers or in newspapers of limited circulation which are mainly advertising vehicles for reaching a particular segment of the community; or displays or announcements available only in selected sales offices. > (b) Selective use of equal opportunity slogan or logo. When placing advertisements, such selective use may involve placing the equal housing opportunity slogan or logo in advertising reaching some geographic areas, but not others, or with respect to some properties but not others. > (c) Selective use of human models when conducting an advertising campaign. Selective advertising may involve an advertising campaign using human models primarily in media that cater to one racial or national origin segment of the population without a complementary advertising campaign that is directed at other groups. Another example may involve use of racially mixed models by a developer to advertise one development and not others. Similar care must be exercised in advertising in publications or other media directed at one particular sex, or at persons without children. Such selective advertising may involve the use of human models of members of only one sex, or of adults only, in displays, photographs or drawings to indicate preferences for one sex or the other, or for adults to the exclusion of children. Targeted advertising was already a thing when these regulations were written decades ago; internet advertising is just a difference in scale and cost.
- pests 8y ago
  The lengths at which you are going to rationalize racism just astounds me. Answer me this. How on Facebook you would expect an excluded person to be able to know about the sale? They wouldn't. The housing listing doesn't exist for them. How do you see this as fair?! I am blown away by all the casual racism all throughout this thread.
  - astura 8y ago
    I am convinced half these commenters are just being disingenuous just for the sake of it. These sorts of cases are settled and straightforward, we have a half century of case law plus multiple publications from HUD that directly address this issue. Craigslist actually does an excellent job of summarizing the laws and giving specific examples of illegal advertisements. https://www.craigslist.org/about/FHA https://www.craigslist.org/about/FHA
    - pests 8y ago
      It may be easier to believe they are being disingenuous but the real answer is probably that they are in fact racist. Its a hard truth to swallow. The rest of this isn't directed just at you astura. If this was some random Facebook or 4chan comment would you be so quick to come to that rationalization? I feel we like to think the individuals we associate with on HN are like minded. To admit they aren't is almost a personal affront. To keep the disillusion going we must rationalize and make up excuses for them or how they behave. But sometimes a duck is a duck.
      - vsl 8y ago
        Give me a break. Not everybody that disagrees with you is a racist. Landlord that prefer to not have couples with children aren’t racist. I too am confused how targeting may be illegal under a law that forbids discrimination and discriminating content of ads - I am not familiar with the law. Lack of knowledge/understanding doesn’t make me “racist”. Some other comments in this inflammatory thread helped me get the point, but your attacks on everybody as racists-by-defaul are deeply bigoted and insulting.