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I think I remember reading that the DoD deserves credit for the entire field of plastic surgery, it was originally pioneered to help soldiers who had suffered d

I think I remember reading that the DoD deserves credit for the entire field of plastic surgery, it was originally pioneered to help soldiers who had suffered disfigurement in combat. Only later did it become something for civilian augmentation.

NeedMoreTea 8y ago
Close - an Ally. It was Gilles at the Royal Army Medical Corps in WW1 who pioneered skin grafts and plastic surgery. He'd done thousands of facial reconstructions by war's end. He set up a plastic surgery clinic between the wars. A relative of his, McIndoe, became famous (the better known of the two today) for his work in WW2 for pioneering and inventing many treatments for burn victims. Burns had become a common injury for pilots and aircrew. He formed the Guinea Pig Club for patients and effectively pioneered rehabilitation. He convinced the locals to visit the hospital in Sussex regularly and befriend patients. They organised trips out to the town so they could feel "normal" again (that became so common locals no longer stared), allowing a bar in the hospital, regular clothes or uniforms not PJs and countless other touches. The hospital still specialises in burns and reconstruction. McIndoe ended up with honours from most of the Allied nations if I remember right. Edit: More detail
- rhizome 8y ago
  Relevant story: https://rarehistoricalphotos.com/anna-coleman-ladd-masks-1918/ https://rarehistoricalphotos.com/anna-coleman-ladd-masks-191...
- skookumchuck 8y ago
  The Germans during WW2 had the best plastic surgery for burns.
  - NeedMoreTea 8y ago
    Do you have any citations or history books you'd recommend? That flies in the face of everything I've ever seen or read, and is not mentioned, even briefly, on Wikipedia as far as I can see. McIndoe gets extensive entries both for himself and under plastic surgery. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archibald_McIndoe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archibald_McIndoe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_surgery#Development_of_modern_techniques https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_surgery#Development_of...
    - skookumchuck 8y ago
      My source is family experience with it. Sorry it's anecdotal. I imagine much was lost in the war and its chaotic aftermath.
- gadders 8y ago
  I recently managed to set fire to my legs, and can confirm that the unit founded by McIndoe is still going in Queen Victoria Hospital in East Grinstead [1] Luckily, my wounds weren't severe and I only needed to be treated there as an outpatient. [1] https://www.qvh.nhs.uk/our-services/plastic-surgery-and-burns/burns/ https://www.qvh.nhs.uk/our-services/plastic-surgery-and-burn...
pluma 8y ago
I don't know about the history of plastic surgery in the US, but in Germany apparently a lot of the plastic surgery for veterans was based on experience treating coal miners. Due to the frequent and horrific injuries, some coal mines had extremely good surgical teams and a lot of experience in reconstructive surgery.
- extralego 8y ago
  Well, I’ll forgo the proper words to describe how the US treats it’s coal miners, but one suffering from black lung disease would often have to go through the court system just to get an appointment with a doctor. I think it’s safe to say your experience in Germany does not apply here.
  - hueving 8y ago
    Not really comparable given the delayed effects of black lung as opposed to a burn from a coal dust fire.
    - pluma 8y ago
      To clarify, the injuries were not always related to the coal itself. There were a lot of heavy machinery and unstable tunnels, i.e. amputations, crushing and disfigurement. The area has a history of coal mining that goes back for almost a thousand years. However I'm pretty sure the goal for reconstructive surgery wasn't entirely altruistic: e.g. a disabled worker is a non-worker but with some prosthetics he might still be able to do light work. That said, I'd strongly believe the culture created by a centuries long tradition of coal mining in a single region is very different from that of 20th/21st century mining in the US.
Gustomaximus 8y ago
Not to diminish their contributions to better surgery, it's fair to recognise there is a long history of plastic surgery before DoD. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_surgery#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_surgery#History
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

NeedMoreTea 8y ago

Close - an Ally. It was Gilles at the Royal Army Medical Corps in WW1 who pioneered skin grafts and plastic surgery. He'd done thousands of facial reconstructions by war's end. He set up a plastic surgery clinic between the wars. A relative of his, McIndoe, became famous (the better known of the two today) for his work in WW2 for pioneering and inventing many treatments for burn victims. Burns had become a common injury for pilots and aircrew. He formed the Guinea Pig Club for patients and effectively pioneered rehabilitation. He convinced the locals to visit the hospital in Sussex regularly and befriend patients. They organised trips out to the town so they could feel "normal" again (that became so common locals no longer stared), allowing a bar in the hospital, regular clothes or uniforms not PJs and countless other touches. The hospital still specialises in burns and reconstruction. McIndoe ended up with honours from most of the Allied nations if I remember right. Edit: More detail

rhizome 8y ago
Relevant story: https://rarehistoricalphotos.com/anna-coleman-ladd-masks-1918/ https://rarehistoricalphotos.com/anna-coleman-ladd-masks-191...
skookumchuck 8y ago
The Germans during WW2 had the best plastic surgery for burns.
- NeedMoreTea 8y ago
  Do you have any citations or history books you'd recommend? That flies in the face of everything I've ever seen or read, and is not mentioned, even briefly, on Wikipedia as far as I can see. McIndoe gets extensive entries both for himself and under plastic surgery. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archibald_McIndoe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archibald_McIndoe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_surgery#Development_of_modern_techniques https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_surgery#Development_of...
  - skookumchuck 8y ago
    My source is family experience with it. Sorry it's anecdotal. I imagine much was lost in the war and its chaotic aftermath.
gadders 8y ago
I recently managed to set fire to my legs, and can confirm that the unit founded by McIndoe is still going in Queen Victoria Hospital in East Grinstead [1] Luckily, my wounds weren't severe and I only needed to be treated there as an outpatient. [1] https://www.qvh.nhs.uk/our-services/plastic-surgery-and-burns/burns/ https://www.qvh.nhs.uk/our-services/plastic-surgery-and-burn...

pluma 8y ago

I don't know about the history of plastic surgery in the US, but in Germany apparently a lot of the plastic surgery for veterans was based on experience treating coal miners. Due to the frequent and horrific injuries, some coal mines had extremely good surgical teams and a lot of experience in reconstructive surgery.

extralego 8y ago
Well, I’ll forgo the proper words to describe how the US treats it’s coal miners, but one suffering from black lung disease would often have to go through the court system just to get an appointment with a doctor. I think it’s safe to say your experience in Germany does not apply here.
- hueving 8y ago
  Not really comparable given the delayed effects of black lung as opposed to a burn from a coal dust fire.
  - pluma 8y ago
    To clarify, the injuries were not always related to the coal itself. There were a lot of heavy machinery and unstable tunnels, i.e. amputations, crushing and disfigurement. The area has a history of coal mining that goes back for almost a thousand years. However I'm pretty sure the goal for reconstructive surgery wasn't entirely altruistic: e.g. a disabled worker is a non-worker but with some prosthetics he might still be able to do light work. That said, I'd strongly believe the culture created by a centuries long tradition of coal mining in a single region is very different from that of 20th/21st century mining in the US.

Gustomaximus 8y ago

Not to diminish their contributions to better surgery, it's fair to recognise there is a long history of plastic surgery before DoD. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_surgery#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_surgery#History

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]