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You have to be careful being a servant leader. It's often a thankless job. And most of the time other people will be taking credit for your work. It's not noble

You have to be careful being a servant leader. It's often a thankless job. And most of the time other people will be taking credit for your work. It's not noble to suffer like that -- it can be damaging to your health. It's an effective position however and comes with it's own rewards. I personally relish seeing my team grow and the people I help mentor flourish. I recommend getting a good therapist and taking small, frequent vacations. The trade off to being a servant leader is basically an environment that will wear you down. If you have conditions they will be amplified. If you don't take care of yourself you will develop conditions.

drharby 8y ago
You can be a servant leader and still take credit for things. Servant leadership is about enabling success, not sacrificing one's self. Sure there is a notion the time taken to help someone is time taken from helping yourself, but if management doesnt view that as a global optimizing act, you've bigger problems
allochthon 8y ago
I think part of the challenge is fostering a culture in which people are discouraged from taking credit for other people's work; e.g., doing so is seen by most as being tacky and tasteless. That is a different culture from one that prevails in many American companies, where the rewards go the other way. But I think it's one worth striving for.
- draw_down 8y ago
  Someone taking credit for a peer's work is different than someone taking credit for work that their manager helped organize.
- hinkley 8y ago
  Teamwork. The word you’re hunting for is teamwork. Fred Brooks was wrong. We shouldn’t be like surgical teams. A couple of highly trained egotists taking credit for everybody who spends all day cleaning up after their messes. Software is a team sport. Might be worth looking there for inspiration. Except for the PEDs. Maybe we can skip those. Caffeine is the only one I’ll do.
JimboOmega 8y ago
It's all I've ever wanted to do since I first heard about it in Joel in Software many years ago. The people side of Software Engineering is immensely more rewarding for me than the technical one. It's so satisfying to watch new hires in particular grow and get comfortable. Sadly, I don't often get to do it, and am usually pushed into more pure IC roles. It's also really rare among companies I've worked at. Turnover is high and impressing people with flashy technology is key. Writing code that impresses is definitely the path to management. Those who sit back and try to understand the whole picture are viewed as uninterested. I've been consciously trying to get into more technical arguments because it seems to earn respect to have strong opinions rather than seeing both sides of the coin. Management (especially at the first level) is viewed as the person who evaluates other people's code and makes the best technical decisions. The engineering side of that sort of environment burns me out more, especially as I get older. When I was in high school, sure, I loved to code, I loved the new tech, I loved experimenting with linux kernels and assembly and all of it. These days, it's just not nearly as meaningful to me as working with those around me. I know I'll never make better solutions as an individual than I would with a team around me. If I only get acknowledged for coming up with a way to run tests 90% faster or solve the weird rare bug nobody else could understand, my work life just feels incomplete. However, engineering team management is chosen more on who can solve the problems the best, not who is the most interested in helping people. When I have expressed interest in management this is a very consistent message. Do you write the best code on your team? No? Then focus on that. This requires me to focus on the work I find less fulfilling - and be directly competitive with my peers. The exact opposite of what I want to do. Maybe other people are getting credit for implementing the new flashiness in Clojure, but if they appreciate you clearing the obstacles to make it happen, isn't that satisfying? You get acknowledged more from below than above, and that's okay. What I really want to know is, what's the suffering part of it? I've heard so many managers complain of not getting to write code any more - and been jealous and wanted to trade positions with them. You should get acknowledged from below, and honestly, if your next level management is good, they should see what you're doing as well. A lack of acknowledgement will always burn people out, but servant leadership shouldn't automatically mean that.
- zerr 8y ago
  Could you please mention some particular example for which you'd be acknowledged from below?
PeterFBell 8y ago
Maybe I've been lucky, but I've always found these principles to just be an effective way to enjoy life, build a great team and maximize business value. Every day, I get to check in on my team and figure out how I can help them to be happier while also delivering more value to the business. And I find the longer I do it the more great surprises I get and the less I actually need to do to build and manage the org.
davedx 8y ago
When I was a Scrum Master, I found the role itself fine, and I could have done it for a long time despite the thankless nature you mention. Lack of monetary compensation for the job I was doing was what made me move on in the end, same as usual.
undershirt 8y ago
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they are the doormats of life." I heard this on the radio once. You have to be prepared to be walked on when you're the one keeping the peace.

drharby 8y ago

You can be a servant leader and still take credit for things. Servant leadership is about enabling success, not sacrificing one's self. Sure there is a notion the time taken to help someone is time taken from helping yourself, but if management doesnt view that as a global optimizing act, you've bigger problems

allochthon 8y ago

I think part of the challenge is fostering a culture in which people are discouraged from taking credit for other people's work; e.g., doing so is seen by most as being tacky and tasteless. That is a different culture from one that prevails in many American companies, where the rewards go the other way. But I think it's one worth striving for.

draw_down 8y ago
Someone taking credit for a peer's work is different than someone taking credit for work that their manager helped organize.
hinkley 8y ago
Teamwork. The word you’re hunting for is teamwork. Fred Brooks was wrong. We shouldn’t be like surgical teams. A couple of highly trained egotists taking credit for everybody who spends all day cleaning up after their messes. Software is a team sport. Might be worth looking there for inspiration. Except for the PEDs. Maybe we can skip those. Caffeine is the only one I’ll do.

JimboOmega 8y ago

It's all I've ever wanted to do since I first heard about it in Joel in Software many years ago. The people side of Software Engineering is immensely more rewarding for me than the technical one. It's so satisfying to watch new hires in particular grow and get comfortable. Sadly, I don't often get to do it, and am usually pushed into more pure IC roles. It's also really rare among companies I've worked at. Turnover is high and impressing people with flashy technology is key. Writing code that impresses is definitely the path to management. Those who sit back and try to understand the whole picture are viewed as uninterested. I've been consciously trying to get into more technical arguments because it seems to earn respect to have strong opinions rather than seeing both sides of the coin. Management (especially at the first level) is viewed as the person who evaluates other people's code and makes the best technical decisions. The engineering side of that sort of environment burns me out more, especially as I get older. When I was in high school, sure, I loved to code, I loved the new tech, I loved experimenting with linux kernels and assembly and all of it. These days, it's just not nearly as meaningful to me as working with those around me. I know I'll never make better solutions as an individual than I would with a team around me. If I only get acknowledged for coming up with a way to run tests 90% faster or solve the weird rare bug nobody else could understand, my work life just feels incomplete. However, engineering team management is chosen more on who can solve the problems the best, not who is the most interested in helping people. When I have expressed interest in management this is a very consistent message. Do you write the best code on your team? No? Then focus on that. This requires me to focus on the work I find less fulfilling - and be directly competitive with my peers. The exact opposite of what I want to do. Maybe other people are getting credit for implementing the new flashiness in Clojure, but if they appreciate you clearing the obstacles to make it happen, isn't that satisfying? You get acknowledged more from below than above, and that's okay. What I really want to know is, what's the suffering part of it? I've heard so many managers complain of not getting to write code any more - and been jealous and wanted to trade positions with them. You should get acknowledged from below, and honestly, if your next level management is good, they should see what you're doing as well. A lack of acknowledgement will always burn people out, but servant leadership shouldn't automatically mean that.

zerr 8y ago
Could you please mention some particular example for which you'd be acknowledged from below?

PeterFBell 8y ago

Maybe I've been lucky, but I've always found these principles to just be an effective way to enjoy life, build a great team and maximize business value. Every day, I get to check in on my team and figure out how I can help them to be happier while also delivering more value to the business. And I find the longer I do it the more great surprises I get and the less I actually need to do to build and manage the org.

davedx 8y ago

When I was a Scrum Master, I found the role itself fine, and I could have done it for a long time despite the thankless nature you mention. Lack of monetary compensation for the job I was doing was what made me move on in the end, same as usual.

undershirt 8y ago

"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they are the doormats of life." I heard this on the radio once. You have to be prepared to be walked on when you're the one keeping the peace.