8 ms·

No need to bring the brain back to life. When memories and the connectome are finally understood, simply scan the brain, even by destroying the original if need

by 1996 8y ago

No need to bring the brain back to life. When memories and the connectome are finally understood, simply scan the brain, even by destroying the original if needed: cut it into slices, scan it, then upload it to a robotic body, or even a simple computer simulation (good enough for me!) I do not want to be "flesh and bones" when we will have better alternatives. I want to see gamma rays, I want to hear X-rays, and I want to smell dark matter. Do you see the absurdity of what we are? I can’t even express these things properly, because I have to conceptualize complex ideas in this stupid, limiting spoken language, but I know I want to reach out with something other than these prehensile paws, and feel the solar wind of a supernova flowing over me.

jacquesm 8y ago
> When memories and the connectome are finally understood IF. > simply scan the brain Simply? > I do not want to be "flesh and bones" when we will have better alternatives. IF. > Do you see the absurdity of what we are? We are no more absurd than your vision of what you wish to become, with the one note that we are what we are and your wishes will very likely remain just that. The whole cryogenics movement is strongly reminiscent of a religion: it costs lots of money, it makes vague promises of an afterlife and 'freethinkers' are relentlessly attacked by the true believers. Show me the proof, until then it's just another scam. > and feel the solar wind of a supernova flowing over me. There is some hot air involved here, but not that one.
- 1996 8y ago
  If, if, if: yes I know, there is no guarantee. There is no proof. I make bets. There is little profit to be found where there is no risk involved. Immortality is just that biggest profit possible, for which many risks must be taken. You know what's worse than my bets: someone not making them. That person sure is never coming back when the body and brain rot and turns to dust. Anyway, if that is what you want, and you made an informed decision, I respect our differences
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - mannykannot 8y ago
    > I make bets. There is little profit to be found where there is no risk involved. Immortality is just that biggest profit possible, for which many risks must be taken. Every day carries the risk that your essential self will be destroyed - through a violent accident (even just a fall), a stroke, a disease... and every day, your mental capacity deteriorates slightly. If you are serious about taking on big risks for the chance of immortality, you should be planning on preserving the state of your brain in the immediate future. Of course, if you don't think the technology for doing the preservation is good enough yet, then bold talk of taking big risks is premature.
    - 1996 8y ago
      That would be irrational. I would say the odds of my bet are 1 in 1000 maybe. If I stop enjoying the certain life I have now, the low probability of the bet are not good enough to compensate for that. I just try to not take too many risks. No MMA!
flatline 8y ago
I mean, okay to the second part, but as to the first part, who is going to pay to run your simulation?
- 1996 8y ago
  Me. On the death of my physical body, my assets will be transferred to a trust fund with 90% going as a bounty to whoever can bring me back to "life", preferably not in flesh and bones (only 50% if I get put in a human body) Part of it fiat, part of it will be crypto with the interdiction to sell 2/3 of it, just in case fiat money has some 1929 like catastrophy. I think greed will be a good enough incentive and motivator, if more people do the same thing, for a company to develop the technology and collect the bounties. And with BIP39 some assets can also be stored in your brain- so as to not be destitute if this scheme works.
plasticchris 8y ago
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhäuser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. Time to die.
felipemnoa 8y ago
>>I want to see gamma rays, I want to hear X-rays, and I want to smell dark matter. Do you see the absurdity of what we are? I can’t even express these things properly, because I have to conceptualize complex ideas in this stupid, limiting spoken language, but I know I want to reach out with something other than these prehensile paws, and feel the solar wind of a supernova flowing over me. << For anybody that does not get the reference this is from Battle Star Galactica. It is a rant by the old Cylon model. His name and model number escape me at the moment.
- 1996 8y ago
  Brother Cavil. I really feel like that - stuck in a body of flesh: limited in its sensory capability, very fragile, almost impossible to repair.
  - throw7 8y ago
    I don't know man, the human body is an incredible machine... I think it's more six of one, half dozen of the other. The one truth you can count on is: there's gonna be tradeoffs.
    - 1996 8y ago
      I want to be the one making the tradeoffs, like I do for a PC or a car
komali2 8y ago
This doesn't the answer the "how does cloned consciousness work" question. For re-vitilization, I don't give a fuck if it's a perfect copy of me walking around. I want it to be me, the current stream of consciousness. To the abyss I say, no thank you.
- kitsunesoba 8y ago
  I agree – if the cloned/copied/othewise renewed consciousness is not that which is currently residing in my head right now, there’s really no point to it, no matter how much philosophically it might be “me”. The only situation I can envision a clone/copy being satisfactory is that in which I had some grand goal larger than myself that I wished to complete and could hand off to the clone.
  - 1996 8y ago
    if it is a copy of me good enough to remember my memories, good enough. Whether my "clone" shares my goal or not is not my problem. If it ends up being a totally different person, so be it. Free determination is more important than my personal survival. I am making a bet, that is better than the alternative of 0 chances. If I did everything I could, why should I be concerned about the actual outcome? A bet is a bet, not a guarantee.
- red75prime 8y ago
  I wonder where this strong intuition about consciousness comes from. Your "the current stream of consciousness" idea requires existence of something beyond all the information you have conscious access to and the procedures your brain performs. Namely, some "marker" which makes this particular realization of your consciousness unique, and which cannot be copied in any circumstances. What do you think this "marker" is?
  - komali2 8y ago
    Well, that's the question. Since theoretically if I can be reconstituted perfectly, I can be copied perfectly, it is more incomprehensible to me to that two identical consciousnesses exist (two Me's with a capital M) than it is that Me is unique somehow, I work from the second assumption. Questions that still need answering include "what about slow cellular replacement with electronic parts?", to which I have no answer. What do you think the marker is?

by 1996 8y ago

jacquesm 8y ago

> When memories and the connectome are finally understood IF. > simply scan the brain Simply? > I do not want to be "flesh and bones" when we will have better alternatives. IF. > Do you see the absurdity of what we are? We are no more absurd than your vision of what you wish to become, with the one note that we are what we are and your wishes will very likely remain just that. The whole cryogenics movement is strongly reminiscent of a religion: it costs lots of money, it makes vague promises of an afterlife and 'freethinkers' are relentlessly attacked by the true believers. Show me the proof, until then it's just another scam. > and feel the solar wind of a supernova flowing over me. There is some hot air involved here, but not that one.

1996 8y ago
If, if, if: yes I know, there is no guarantee. There is no proof. I make bets. There is little profit to be found where there is no risk involved. Immortality is just that biggest profit possible, for which many risks must be taken. You know what's worse than my bets: someone not making them. That person sure is never coming back when the body and brain rot and turns to dust. Anyway, if that is what you want, and you made an informed decision, I respect our differences
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- mannykannot 8y ago
  > I make bets. There is little profit to be found where there is no risk involved. Immortality is just that biggest profit possible, for which many risks must be taken. Every day carries the risk that your essential self will be destroyed - through a violent accident (even just a fall), a stroke, a disease... and every day, your mental capacity deteriorates slightly. If you are serious about taking on big risks for the chance of immortality, you should be planning on preserving the state of your brain in the immediate future. Of course, if you don't think the technology for doing the preservation is good enough yet, then bold talk of taking big risks is premature.
  - 1996 8y ago
    That would be irrational. I would say the odds of my bet are 1 in 1000 maybe. If I stop enjoying the certain life I have now, the low probability of the bet are not good enough to compensate for that. I just try to not take too many risks. No MMA!

flatline 8y ago

I mean, okay to the second part, but as to the first part, who is going to pay to run your simulation?

1996 8y ago
Me. On the death of my physical body, my assets will be transferred to a trust fund with 90% going as a bounty to whoever can bring me back to "life", preferably not in flesh and bones (only 50% if I get put in a human body) Part of it fiat, part of it will be crypto with the interdiction to sell 2/3 of it, just in case fiat money has some 1929 like catastrophy. I think greed will be a good enough incentive and motivator, if more people do the same thing, for a company to develop the technology and collect the bounties. And with BIP39 some assets can also be stored in your brain- so as to not be destitute if this scheme works.

plasticchris 8y ago

I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhäuser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. Time to die.

felipemnoa 8y ago

>>I want to see gamma rays, I want to hear X-rays, and I want to smell dark matter. Do you see the absurdity of what we are? I can’t even express these things properly, because I have to conceptualize complex ideas in this stupid, limiting spoken language, but I know I want to reach out with something other than these prehensile paws, and feel the solar wind of a supernova flowing over me. << For anybody that does not get the reference this is from Battle Star Galactica. It is a rant by the old Cylon model. His name and model number escape me at the moment.

1996 8y ago
Brother Cavil. I really feel like that - stuck in a body of flesh: limited in its sensory capability, very fragile, almost impossible to repair.
- throw7 8y ago
  I don't know man, the human body is an incredible machine... I think it's more six of one, half dozen of the other. The one truth you can count on is: there's gonna be tradeoffs.
  - 1996 8y ago
    I want to be the one making the tradeoffs, like I do for a PC or a car

komali2 8y ago

This doesn't the answer the "how does cloned consciousness work" question. For re-vitilization, I don't give a fuck if it's a perfect copy of me walking around. I want it to be me, the current stream of consciousness. To the abyss I say, no thank you.

kitsunesoba 8y ago
I agree – if the cloned/copied/othewise renewed consciousness is not that which is currently residing in my head right now, there’s really no point to it, no matter how much philosophically it might be “me”. The only situation I can envision a clone/copy being satisfactory is that in which I had some grand goal larger than myself that I wished to complete and could hand off to the clone.
- 1996 8y ago
  if it is a copy of me good enough to remember my memories, good enough. Whether my "clone" shares my goal or not is not my problem. If it ends up being a totally different person, so be it. Free determination is more important than my personal survival. I am making a bet, that is better than the alternative of 0 chances. If I did everything I could, why should I be concerned about the actual outcome? A bet is a bet, not a guarantee.
red75prime 8y ago
I wonder where this strong intuition about consciousness comes from. Your "the current stream of consciousness" idea requires existence of something beyond all the information you have conscious access to and the procedures your brain performs. Namely, some "marker" which makes this particular realization of your consciousness unique, and which cannot be copied in any circumstances. What do you think this "marker" is?
- komali2 8y ago
  Well, that's the question. Since theoretically if I can be reconstituted perfectly, I can be copied perfectly, it is more incomprehensible to me to that two identical consciousnesses exist (two Me's with a capital M) than it is that Me is unique somehow, I work from the second assumption. Questions that still need answering include "what about slow cellular replacement with electronic parts?", to which I have no answer. What do you think the marker is?