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> cannot allow downloads of free software from your website (like Oracle JRE) The Oracle JRE contains strong cryptography which is illegal to export to certain

> cannot allow downloads of free software from your website (like Oracle JRE) The Oracle JRE contains strong cryptography which is illegal to export to certain sanctioned countries. It being free doesn't change anything about that. That one is actually legitimate.

smnrchrds 8y ago
It's not just JRE. You cannot download any software from Oracle, period. Plus, is it really illegal to export cryptography software? If that is the case, why are Java downloads the only ones restricted? Shouldn't, for example, Visual Studio and .Net also be blocked? I don't think it is for any valid legal reason. Just that they cannot make money from these countries, so they can't be bothered to let them access their download servers.
- freeone3000 8y ago
  Yes[1], export is controlled. Oracle Java contains an implementation of cryptographic primitives, similar in scope and purpose to OpenSSL. Microsoft does not sell products to any sanctioned countries[2]. Note that [1] has a giant loophole for open source software, which requires notice but not permission - so builds of .NET Core, OpenJDK, OpenSSL itself, and so on, can be exported no problem. Also, programs built WITH the primitives are "mass market", so are exemptable that way. [1]: https://www.bis.doc.gov/index.php/policy-guidance/encryption https://www.bis.doc.gov/index.php/policy-guidance/encryption [2]: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/exporting/faq.aspx https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/exporting/faq.aspx
vbezhenar 8y ago
Last time I checked, you couldn't even use strong cryptography in Java without tiny additional download. So forbidding JRE downloading seems a bit excessive.
- freeone3000 8y ago
  As of 8, they integrated that portion into main tree because it was ridiculous and a bit of a pain for the 98% of the world who wasn't under US sanction to have to do that. It's "legitimate" again - so all the Iranians that want Java have to download it from the source tree.

smnrchrds 8y ago

It's not just JRE. You cannot download any software from Oracle, period. Plus, is it really illegal to export cryptography software? If that is the case, why are Java downloads the only ones restricted? Shouldn't, for example, Visual Studio and .Net also be blocked? I don't think it is for any valid legal reason. Just that they cannot make money from these countries, so they can't be bothered to let them access their download servers.

freeone3000 8y ago
Yes[1], export is controlled. Oracle Java contains an implementation of cryptographic primitives, similar in scope and purpose to OpenSSL. Microsoft does not sell products to any sanctioned countries[2]. Note that [1] has a giant loophole for open source software, which requires notice but not permission - so builds of .NET Core, OpenJDK, OpenSSL itself, and so on, can be exported no problem. Also, programs built WITH the primitives are "mass market", so are exemptable that way. [1]: https://www.bis.doc.gov/index.php/policy-guidance/encryption https://www.bis.doc.gov/index.php/policy-guidance/encryption [2]: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/exporting/faq.aspx https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/exporting/faq.aspx

vbezhenar 8y ago

Last time I checked, you couldn't even use strong cryptography in Java without tiny additional download. So forbidding JRE downloading seems a bit excessive.

freeone3000 8y ago
As of 8, they integrated that portion into main tree because it was ridiculous and a bit of a pain for the 98% of the world who wasn't under US sanction to have to do that. It's "legitimate" again - so all the Iranians that want Java have to download it from the source tree.