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uhhhh .. I think the majority of the people don't know what version of android is on their phone, don't know why it matters, and don't care. The branding for th

uhhhh .. I think the majority of the people don't know what version of android is on their phone, don't know why it matters, and don't care. The branding for the various android phones so far is tied to the carrier and the phone manufacturer, not the phone. There is no AndroidPhone. There is the HTC EVO, Samsung Galaxy, Motorola Droid. People just want a phone that's fun and easy to use. If they don't like the phone they have, they will buy a new one when the contract is up, which likely will have a new version (the number of which they won't know or care about) and will work better. Fragmentation is a big pain for developers and so on, but users don't care and shouldn't need to care.

deleted 16y ago
[deleted]
endlessvoid94 16y ago
Agreed. This is similar to the iPhone antenna problem: bloggers and developers making a shitstorm out of something almost nobody feels the effects of.
wvenable 16y ago
As a user, I care about what OS version I have because that determines the features my phone has, its performance, its compatibility, and its stability. What you describe is the ideal for the manufacturers and the carriers -- they want to keep people in the dark about the software. But the reality is that everyone knows, every phone review includes it, and it's critically important to the end user. Every Android user I've talked to knows exactly what version their phone runs. Many are patiently waiting for upgrades. Every single phone review tells me exactly what OS version the HTC EVO, Samsung Galaxy, Motorola Droid run and I doubt anyone here wouldn't consider that piece of information extremely important in their purchasing decision.
- daten 16y ago
  Plenty of users buy phones without knowing what Android is or even what an "operating system" is. All thee know is compared to their old phone with a random proprietary OS, this phone has a much more polished interface and apps similar to their friends iPhone. I'm sure most of the people that read HN care about the details you listed, but I wouldn't assume your average mall-shopper that walks into a cell phone store not knowing the difference between any two phones knows or cares about version numbers or compatibility. Most non-technical people I've talked to about it have been so confused about the marketing of a phone named "droid" that they think any reference to "android" means that phone.
  - wvenable 16y ago
    I disagree with your top statement. Every user knows what an operating system is -- they've been educated on that fact for decades. And any user of a "smartphone" knows they're really getting a little computer. The iPhone probably has the broadest market of non-technical users and even they periodically get OS upgrades -- you think their users don't know what that is? The problem with this conversation is lumping together mobile phones and smartphones. There are very few Android phones marketed to "non-technical people". But they will come, they will be cheap, and nobody will care what OS they run. But the top of line phones, the expensive phones, and the profitable phones will be sold to semi-technical people who know what they're getting.
    - daten 16y ago
      I still think your perspective on general knowledge is off. I think plenty of people with phones still don't know what an operating system is, especially people over the age of 30 who didn't grow up with the internet and ubiquitous computers in school. But I could be wrong. If it's true that only technical users are buying Android phones because it's still exclusive to the smart-phone market, what your saying makes sense. I wouldn't be suprised if non-technical users with money to burn buy smart phones they don't understand just for the sake of vanity though.
    - semanticist 16y ago
      I worked as Nokia's UK and Ireland technical support, both tier 1 and 2, and you are entirely wrong. Almost no users, including people buying smartphones, have any idea what a phone operating system is. Most users, including people buying smartphones, struggle to tell you what their computer operating system is. Phones, including smartphones, are not sold like computers. Lots of people buy smartphones because they have the best cameras, or because they're the 'top end' phone, or because 'they want a blackberry' and can't tell a Nokia E61 from a BlackBerry device. Also, at least in the UK, there's a lot of smartphones - including Android devices - being marketed at the general consumer market. There's not really any phones sold to 'technical' people - the distinction you want to make is 'consumer' versus 'business'. Windows Mobile and BlackBerry are 'business' (traditionally). The iPhone is 'consumer', albeit high-end. Android phones tend to be consumer-focussed, competing against the iPhone. There's a few Android phones that are priced to the mid- and low-end of the market, and there's a lot of Nokia S60 smartphones in this range. (A lot more than Android or iOS, actually. Nokia are still the #1 smartphone manufacturer.) Most people buying these devices are 'non-technical' and if they understand the difference between 'Android 1.5' and 'Android 2.1', they just don't care.
- usaar333 16y ago
  It's a good thing then that you are on Hacker News. As a tech person who wants the latest software, you can spend a few minutes rooting your phone and installing a custom ROM with the latest Android version.
  - borisk 16y ago
    A few minutes if someone (who hasn't wasted his time on HN :D ) already compiled the latest version for your device. Otherwise one can spent months trying to get the poorly documented and sometimes incomplete code to work.
    - usaar333 16y ago
      Good point. Definitely don't buy a device that isn't already popular with the rom making crowd.
Unseelie 16y ago
Even not knowing what an OS is, a user is incredibly frustrated by crashes, lag, and sms errors. There may not be an 'android phone' but there is 'the alternative to the IPhone' which isn't, outside of the business market, the blackberry. Users use. And they do compare how well things work, and migrate. So in the larger sense, users should care about fragmentation. Eventually, its going to limit their choices.
- uxp 16y ago
  Especially when manufacturers and vendors start selling devices with different Android versions, as they are now. Someone that physically breaks their Motorolla DroidX running 2.2 and buys a replacement Samsung Galaxy that runs 1.5 (now 1.6 I hear), and then realizes that the majority of the apps that they purchased aren't compatible with the lower version of the phone, and that the phone has a terrible UI (compared to the improved 2.2), is going to be mighty disappointed in both the carrier and the Android name. The average user doesn't know how to root and upgrade the phone software to unofficial versions. The average user only knows that it is Android, and that Android now "sucks" in that situation.
  - Calamitous 16y ago
    If they downgrade from a DroidX to a Samsung Galaxy, and it sucks, are they going to blame the OS or the phone? Put another way, are you more likely to hear "My phone sucks" or "This lower version number of the OS I was previously happy with sucks"? The market will drum out the bad apples who try to leave their Android phones stuck at ancient versions.
    - forgottenpaswrd 16y ago
      The same way people has complained for years about Linux drivers support. They don't care their printer or modems, or webcams manufacturers don't give technical info about their devices, they just want their devices to work as they are used to. Ironically, now Linux support way more devices than Windows, and let you do things that no commercial vendor is going to let you do(e.g I have used an old scanner as spectrogram with very little money).
runjake 16y ago
Except that many of the latest and greatest and most hyped apps use Android's latest features and thus don't run on older versions of Android. This is why users will care.

deleted 16y ago

[deleted]

endlessvoid94 16y ago

Agreed. This is similar to the iPhone antenna problem: bloggers and developers making a shitstorm out of something almost nobody feels the effects of.

wvenable 16y ago

As a user, I care about what OS version I have because that determines the features my phone has, its performance, its compatibility, and its stability. What you describe is the ideal for the manufacturers and the carriers -- they want to keep people in the dark about the software. But the reality is that everyone knows, every phone review includes it, and it's critically important to the end user. Every Android user I've talked to knows exactly what version their phone runs. Many are patiently waiting for upgrades. Every single phone review tells me exactly what OS version the HTC EVO, Samsung Galaxy, Motorola Droid run and I doubt anyone here wouldn't consider that piece of information extremely important in their purchasing decision.

daten 16y ago
Plenty of users buy phones without knowing what Android is or even what an "operating system" is. All thee know is compared to their old phone with a random proprietary OS, this phone has a much more polished interface and apps similar to their friends iPhone. I'm sure most of the people that read HN care about the details you listed, but I wouldn't assume your average mall-shopper that walks into a cell phone store not knowing the difference between any two phones knows or cares about version numbers or compatibility. Most non-technical people I've talked to about it have been so confused about the marketing of a phone named "droid" that they think any reference to "android" means that phone.
- wvenable 16y ago
  I disagree with your top statement. Every user knows what an operating system is -- they've been educated on that fact for decades. And any user of a "smartphone" knows they're really getting a little computer. The iPhone probably has the broadest market of non-technical users and even they periodically get OS upgrades -- you think their users don't know what that is? The problem with this conversation is lumping together mobile phones and smartphones. There are very few Android phones marketed to "non-technical people". But they will come, they will be cheap, and nobody will care what OS they run. But the top of line phones, the expensive phones, and the profitable phones will be sold to semi-technical people who know what they're getting.
  - daten 16y ago
    I still think your perspective on general knowledge is off. I think plenty of people with phones still don't know what an operating system is, especially people over the age of 30 who didn't grow up with the internet and ubiquitous computers in school. But I could be wrong. If it's true that only technical users are buying Android phones because it's still exclusive to the smart-phone market, what your saying makes sense. I wouldn't be suprised if non-technical users with money to burn buy smart phones they don't understand just for the sake of vanity though.
  - semanticist 16y ago
    I worked as Nokia's UK and Ireland technical support, both tier 1 and 2, and you are entirely wrong. Almost no users, including people buying smartphones, have any idea what a phone operating system is. Most users, including people buying smartphones, struggle to tell you what their computer operating system is. Phones, including smartphones, are not sold like computers. Lots of people buy smartphones because they have the best cameras, or because they're the 'top end' phone, or because 'they want a blackberry' and can't tell a Nokia E61 from a BlackBerry device. Also, at least in the UK, there's a lot of smartphones - including Android devices - being marketed at the general consumer market. There's not really any phones sold to 'technical' people - the distinction you want to make is 'consumer' versus 'business'. Windows Mobile and BlackBerry are 'business' (traditionally). The iPhone is 'consumer', albeit high-end. Android phones tend to be consumer-focussed, competing against the iPhone. There's a few Android phones that are priced to the mid- and low-end of the market, and there's a lot of Nokia S60 smartphones in this range. (A lot more than Android or iOS, actually. Nokia are still the #1 smartphone manufacturer.) Most people buying these devices are 'non-technical' and if they understand the difference between 'Android 1.5' and 'Android 2.1', they just don't care.
usaar333 16y ago
It's a good thing then that you are on Hacker News. As a tech person who wants the latest software, you can spend a few minutes rooting your phone and installing a custom ROM with the latest Android version.
- borisk 16y ago
  A few minutes if someone (who hasn't wasted his time on HN :D ) already compiled the latest version for your device. Otherwise one can spent months trying to get the poorly documented and sometimes incomplete code to work.
  - usaar333 16y ago
    Good point. Definitely don't buy a device that isn't already popular with the rom making crowd.

Unseelie 16y ago

Even not knowing what an OS is, a user is incredibly frustrated by crashes, lag, and sms errors. There may not be an 'android phone' but there is 'the alternative to the IPhone' which isn't, outside of the business market, the blackberry. Users use. And they do compare how well things work, and migrate. So in the larger sense, users should care about fragmentation. Eventually, its going to limit their choices.

uxp 16y ago
Especially when manufacturers and vendors start selling devices with different Android versions, as they are now. Someone that physically breaks their Motorolla DroidX running 2.2 and buys a replacement Samsung Galaxy that runs 1.5 (now 1.6 I hear), and then realizes that the majority of the apps that they purchased aren't compatible with the lower version of the phone, and that the phone has a terrible UI (compared to the improved 2.2), is going to be mighty disappointed in both the carrier and the Android name. The average user doesn't know how to root and upgrade the phone software to unofficial versions. The average user only knows that it is Android, and that Android now "sucks" in that situation.
- Calamitous 16y ago
  If they downgrade from a DroidX to a Samsung Galaxy, and it sucks, are they going to blame the OS or the phone? Put another way, are you more likely to hear "My phone sucks" or "This lower version number of the OS I was previously happy with sucks"? The market will drum out the bad apples who try to leave their Android phones stuck at ancient versions.
  - forgottenpaswrd 16y ago
    The same way people has complained for years about Linux drivers support. They don't care their printer or modems, or webcams manufacturers don't give technical info about their devices, they just want their devices to work as they are used to. Ironically, now Linux support way more devices than Windows, and let you do things that no commercial vendor is going to let you do(e.g I have used an old scanner as spectrogram with very little money).

runjake 16y ago

Except that many of the latest and greatest and most hyped apps use Android's latest features and thus don't run on older versions of Android. This is why users will care.