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As a driver and a cyclist, it seems to me simply that many drivers have a tremendous sense of entitlement. Everything else stems from that, otherwise poor behav

• another-cuppa 8y ago
  I believe the sense of entitlement to come from the fact that most drivers have only ever experienced the road in a car. As a driver and a cyclist, I'm not sure about registration of cyclists, but I am sure that everyone should be required to do a minimum number of hours on a bicycle before they are allowed anywhere near a car, in the same way that pilots must gain experience before they upgrade. I am certain this would have numerous benefits.
• maxxxxx 8y ago
  In all fairness a lot of cyclists behave like idiots too. I would never ride at night without lights. I don't run stop signs at full speed expecting that cars stop for me.
• daxorid 8y ago
  many drivers have a tremendous sense of entitlement It seems to me to be precisely the opposite. It is extremely common to see cyclists have a full 4-5 foot shoulder to ride on, but they always choose to ride as close to vehicular traffic as possible. Sometimes even on the white line. By doing so, they endanger everybody, and the only explanation for this behavior is entitlement. So, cyclists, please change my mind: when you have a wide shoulder to occupy, and you choose to ride so close to the left of it that your handlebars are in serious danger of being clipped by vehicular traffic, why? Why not the middle of the shoulder, or, god forbid, the right side of it? edit: thanks for the enlightening replies.
  • JoeAltmaier 8y ago
    Clearly not a cyclist. Cyclists are not idiots. They are the product of roads that severely punish those that don't attend to drains, grates, glass and metal trash from car accidents strewn liberally in the margin of the road. They make tires called 'gator skins' for a reason. Go ahead and ride in the gutter, do it tomorrow. And see if that bike makes it a mile, much less all the way to work.
  • titanomachy 8y ago
    Often, there is more gravel or sand or other crap as you get closer to right edge of the shoulder. Also, potholes are more common at the edge of the road in some places. The leftmost part of the shoulder is usually the clearest and smoothest. And if there are cars parked on the right, it's good to have some clearance in case someone throws open their door without looking. I'll try to ride as far right as possible, especially on a busy street. But those other dangers are quite real, especially once you've picked up a bit of speed. In the areas I ride, cars can't really go much faster than bikes anyway (except they accelerate faster). So the relative speed of a car in motion is less than all the stationary stuff on the right that can hurt me. My city has a lot of cyclists and bike-friendly roads, so drivers are relatively alert and used to slowing down for cyclists. As a driver, the only time I find cyclists annoying is when they ride on the roads without shoulders or bike lanes and take a whole lane.
  • itsmenotyou 8y ago
    Obviously I can't speak for all situations but often I'll ride towards the centre or vehicular edge of the path if there is a risk of pedestrian hazards, or parked cars on the other side. People jumping out in front of you or opening car doors is all to frequent, and almost impossible to avoid, particularly in areas where cycling is not so popular.
  • Frqy3 8y ago
    As a pedestrian, I am annoyed that after spending a lot of money to create nice fully separated bike paths near where I live, some of the lycra clad cyclists still insist on racing along the footpath.
  • dillonisacunt 8y ago
    I'd say its diffiuclt for those only experiencing the roads from a motor vehicle to know what roads are like when youre that much closer, frequently you have to maneuver awkwardly, deeper into the road, if you want your bike to last longer than your current trip. Though I doubt that will change your mind and it certaintly doesnt excuse cyclists who ride dangerously or carelessly. As someone who drives frequently and cycles everyday through London to work (and loves both activities) the perspective ive always shared is that cycling makes you see the worst in all other forms of transport. CYcling to to work there are days where I hate pedestrians, hate drivers and days where i definitely hate other cyclists. I've nearly struck careless pedestrians who were jaywalking looking at their phone and ive been struck by a car at a junction where i had right of way (and thankfully lived to tell the tale). There are assholes in all camps, but I suspect its amplified dpeending on which activity youre engaged in
  • jdietrich 8y ago
    >So, cyclists, please change my mind: when you have a wide shoulder to occupy, and you choose to ride so close to the left of it that your handlebars are in serious danger of being clipped by vehicular traffic, why? Why not the middle of the shoulder, or, god forbid, the right side of it? Cyclists need much more road width than you might intuitively expect, because we're less able to safely ride over debris or potholes. An obstacle that you would barely notice in a car could cause a cyclist to crash. The shoulder is often littered with debris, because the wheels of vehicles tend to sweep debris out to the edge of their usual track; the shoulder doesn't benefit from this sweeping action. We know that we might need to swerve unexpectedly for reasons that aren't obvious to following traffic, so we want to make sure that we have sufficient space to swerve away from traffic rather than towards it. Riding well to the left gives the cyclist more control over their distance from passing traffic, because they maintain a buffer of safety that they can use if an inattentive or aggressive driver passes dangerously close. Some cyclists might take this principle to an extreme, but the opposite is usually true - timid and inexperienced cyclists tend to ride right in the gutter rather than staking out a survival zone, severely limiting their options if they need to avoid a hazard or a vehicle is passing dangerously close. On narrower roads without a shoulder, safe cyclists will take a variety of road positions based on the conditions; the reasons aren't always obvious to following drivers. We always keep at least four feet away from parked cars, because of the risk that someone unexpectedly opens their door in our path. Hitting a door is often fatal, because the top edge of the door is at around head height to a cyclist. We might tuck in to the right to maintain a safe distance when being passed, but we might also move out to the left of the lane to indicate to motorists that it would be unsafe to squeeze past us in the same lane on that section of road. Riding in the tracks followed by car wheels is usually safer, because those parts of the road are swept clean of debris and less likely to be contaminated with spilled oil or diesel.
• jeffwass 8y ago
  As a pedestrian and driver in London (mostly pedestrian), it seems to me that many cyclists have a sense of entitlement. I’ve had cyclists plow through zebra crossings (crosswalks where stopping is mandatory) at full speed just inches away from me. Or blow through red lights for them that are green walk signals for pedestrians.
• dang 8y ago
  Of all the classic flamewar topics, the cyclists v. drivers death match has the most surprising levels of vitriol. That plus the tedium of rehashing the same old arguments for the unbelievableth time makes for some of the worst HN threads we see. If anything should be globally off topic here, it's this. I don't mean to pick on you personally! It's a systemic failure of the community to keep its hivemind. We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17731908 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17731908 and marked it off-topic.
  • st26 8y ago
    Sorry. My comment was specifically talking about, why all the vitriol? But I suppose that's just another comment in the sea of the flamewar.