6 ms·
Organic solar cells set 'remarkable' energy record
- thinkingkong 8y agoAmazing. I dont understand nearly enough about materials science to grok how you iterate to such a discovery. Does anyone else have intimate knowledge of the grind?
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- pjc50 8y agoThe best description I've read of the iterative process of chemistry development is good old "Ignition!" by John D Clark, on the subject of rocket fuels. Generally what happens is a simple theoretical model predicts what the most efficient compounds to try are - but not all their properties can be predicted theoretically. So somebody has to try them and find out what all the handling and fabrication difficulties are, then develop solutions for the sub-problems. (Does anyone have the scihub link to the actual study referenced in the article?)
- tim333 8y agohttp://sci-hub.tw/http://science.sciencemag.org/content/early/2018/08/08/science.aat2612 http://sci-hub.tw/http://science.sciencemag.org/content/earl...
- dvh 8y ago17%
- mikeyouse 8y agoAnd on one of my favorite charts, that red triangle at the very bottom is about to jump substantially up the Y-axis: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/28/PVeff%28rev180716%29.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/28/PVeff%28...
- acchow 8y agoFTA: "Commercial solar photovoltaics usually covert 15-22% of sunlight, with a world record of 26.6% reached in Japan in 2016." And yet your linked chart shows datapoints >40%. What gives?
- joshuahaglund 8y agoThe article isn't very good is what.
- hcknwscommenter 8y agoNo. The >40% are "exotic" in some fashion and very expensive compared to what is commercially available. Think of "hero" cells where the best cell from an entire production run is tested or a cell is produced using techniques that are incompatible with mass production. Now, add in tandem (multijunction) on top of that, and you get to >40%.
- ksec 8y agomultijunctiion.
- jabl 8y agoWell, isn't this new device essentially a multijunction organic solar cell? That's what I gathered from the BBC article. I guess the hope is that they will command less of a relative premium compared to multijunction silicon cells?
- Brakenshire 8y agoInorganic multijunction devices are very difficult and costly to make, because the materials have to be evaporated into place. Organics in principle can be printed using standard solvents.
- 8y ago
- ChuckMcM 8y agoI hope this makes it into production at some point. I had a lot of hope for the CIGS stuff[1] but they haven't been able to get to the point where they have enough efficiency at at low enough cost to flip them into the mainstream to get mass market economics of scale to work for them. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper_indium_gallium_selenide_solar_cells https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper_indium_gallium_selenide...
- innocentfelon 8y agoCIGS, like CdTe, has always been limited by material economics. As demand goes up, the world economy’s limited production of these exotic byproducts can’t keep up. Believe it or don’t, the last time I crunched the numbers, it was the Selenium in CIGS that they’re having the most trouble unlocking more of.
- ChuckMcM 8y agoThat is surprising, the early 2000's there was a huge uproar over all of the selenium runoff going into the San Francisco bay. At the time I wondered if there was an economic use for selenium and if extracting it from water was economically feasible.
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- ksec 8y agoLight Reflection, which is one of the problem with Solar panel installation in cities areas. You could literally beam light into other buildings windows. I wonder if Organic Solar Cells fix this? Or some day where we could produce Windows Glasses that absorb some of the UV and turns it into electricity for cheap. I know we have the tech but it seems still to expensive for now.
- stubish 8y agoI don't think light reflection is at all a problem with solar panel installation in city areas. Buildings are already reflective, and mirror surfaces on glass towers have been the fashion for decades. Even if light pollution laws exist, they are only in effect at night, and the usual solution is blinds or curtains rather than blocking the source.
- GoToRO 8y agoReflected light is lost energy. As long as a solar panel looks like a mirror, it is not efficient. When you will see a solar panel that is very dark, then it might be efficient. I think this is what the parent poster is referring to.
- jandrese 8y agoSolar cells only absorb on specific wavelengths. They also lose efficiency if they get too hot. It actually makes sense to reflect away the wavelengths you can't use to keep the panels cooler.
- hcknwscommenter 8y agoSolar panels do not look like mirrors. Like the first hit on google images --> https://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/wacotrib.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/d/82/d8224f9b-3e8f-53cd-9983-55e118b7daef/5938f08f98903.image.jpg https://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/wacotrib.com/co...
- 8y ago
- Nasrudith 8y agoI wonder about the endurance of these organic cells aside from their strides in efficiency. I recall hearing a few "exotic" solar cell materials having the issue of being too ephemeral especially for the toxic materials involved despite technically better efficiency in operation and they got beaten out by cheap silicon. The applications of these would be remarkable if they lack additional complications. The title set up sounds like a lazy scientist joke : technically you can call planting a forest, call them organic solar cells and burn them later for a non-direct electricity solution without doing any research.
- ohiovr 8y agoHow do plastic solar panels stand up to UV radiation over a long time? UV radiation degrades most plastics.
- Brakenshire 8y agoThe two problems historically have been efficiency and endurance. Endurance has been in the range of 2-5 years, so not good. Although I think that’s more to do with reactivity in the presence of oxygen than UV. If UV was the problem you could always just filter it out, albeit at an efficiency cost, whereas total encapsulation is more difficult and expensive.
- agumonkey 8y agoIt's also important to take the fabrication process into account. I'd love OPV to be less polluting (or less costly to recycle waste) than polysilicon or thin-film. Even at 17% efficiency.
- michaels9876 8y agoSolar energy is very problematic and for now, isn't going to solve the world's energy problems. For one thing, it generates energy for just when the sun is shining and no clouds overhead, which aren't usually peak hours. There are other problems as well. https://sciencing.com/future-solar-power-obstacles-problems-21852.html https://sciencing.com/future-solar-power-obstacles-problems-... I'm waiting for Fusion power...
- rileyphone 8y agoYou'll be waiting 10 years for the rest of your life.
- FlyMoreRockets 8y agoProgress! First, it was always 30 years away, then 15 years, now it's down to 10 years. Not sure how to determine the asymptote, but it'll doubtless happen with the Singularity. Links: Why Nuclear Fusion Is Always 30 Years Away http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/crux/2016/03/23/nuclear-fusion-reactor-research/ http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/crux/2016/03/23/nuclear-fu... Nuclear fusion is 15 years away from reality, say MIT engineers https://www.thechemicalengineer.com/news/nuclear-fusion-is-15-years-away-from-reality-say-mit-engineers/ https://www.thechemicalengineer.com/news/nuclear-fusion-is-1...
- jandrese 8y agoThere's still the big question mark of "will it be economically viable?" By the time Fusion is ready we might be heavily transitioning to cheaper renewable energy sources and not want to subsidize expensive power.
- FlyMoreRockets 8y agoVery good point. Doubtless though, if it ever achieves technical viability, fusion will have a niche, because not all applications require economic viability. Can't beat the energy density it provides, either. Would be great for outer solar system missions.
- jartelt 8y ago17% efficiency is a very nice result for OPV. I studied OPV tech for my PhD in 2010-2015. The field really started to shrink once perovskite solar cells were discovered and quickly beat out OPV in performance. Many people were predicting that OPV research was dead at that point. Glad to see that some researchers are still pushing hard and making progress!
- selimthegrim 8y agoI'm still holding out hope that these multiphoton singlet fission systems are made to work.
- froogie 8y agoPicked my curiousity, care to elaborate for me and others?
- thebluehawk 8y agoI think you mean "piqued".
- selimthegrim 8y agohttps://www.oe.phy.cam.ac.uk/research/photovoltaics/ultrasing https://www.oe.phy.cam.ac.uk/research/photovoltaics/ultrasin...
- yread 8y agoMust hve been hard for you to do PhD in a shrinking field. Did you follow career in solar cells?
- driverdan 8y agoDon't OPVs still have the problem of breaking down too quickly? > "I am very positive for OPV, and it may not need five years," he added. Ah, the magic five years. Whenever you see someone say it's five years away it means they have no idea when, or if it'll come to market.