5 ms·

Can Silicon Valley workers rein in big tech from within?

12 points by SmkyMt 8y ago

bwestergard 8y ago
I'm quoted in the article as one of the engineers fired for unionizing and as an advocate of experimenting with a hiring hall model of organization. Happy to discuss either here.
- pmoriarty 8y ago
  Did you have any problems getting hired at your next job because you made waves at your last? Does the company you're currently working for have a union?
  - bwestergard 8y ago
    When I and all of my coworkers were fired, and the office we worked in shut down, it came as an immense shock. I was terrified I'd never do the work I loved again, particularly after I became the de facto spokesperson for the group. As it happens, I did not have any difficulty finding another job. I had interviews with several companies within four weeks of being fired (despite spending a great deal of time cooperating with the NLRB investigation in addition to job hunting). I was sitting at my desk at a new job less than eight weeks after being fired. I worked with a recruiter, who was not particularly interested in why my last employer had terminated me after hearing that all non-supervisory engineers had been terminated. I don't know whether the recruiter shopped me around to employers who decided to pass on me for having supported a union. When asked by prospective employers why I'd left my last job I replied that the company had characterized the situation as a "lay off" of all engineers due to a "change in direction". I was never pressed for more information. One employer brought up unions in an oblique way, presumably because they'd googled my name and read coverage of the case. They made me an offer anyway. My former coworkers, none of whom went public the way I did while looking for a job, didn't seem to have any problems either. I believe all but one have found new jobs better than or comparable to their old jobs. No employer could know who did and did not support the union, so everyone but me had plausible deniability. To my knowledge none were asked about it. The company I'm working for now is a fairly typical media company and is not unionized.
    - pmoriarty 8y ago
      Are you going to press for the formation of a union at your new job as you did on your last? If not, could you talk about why not?
      - bwestergard 8y ago
        No. I don't believe in "salting" (taking jobs with an eye to certifying a union). I think I want what most devs want: a job where I spend most of my time writing code to solve interesting problems, to have opportunities to deepen my understanding of mathematics and computer science, etc. People have problems at work all the time; they usually try to solve them as individuals. Sometimes that works, more often it doesn't -- they just come to expect less out of life. At Lanetix, collective action was well underway by the time I became involved. The real catalyst of organization was the firing of an excellent engineer who had become the de facto spokesperson for grievances in one office (see: https://gist.github.com/bwestergard/a5ddc5583d37554cc40a0e2b86511371 https://gist.github.com/bwestergard/a5ddc5583d37554cc40a0e2b...). It was only after management's effort to suppress a collective response that I became involved. I was one of several who advocated for the NLRA route; I would not have done so in any "hot shop" situation.
atomic77 8y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betteridge's_law_of_headlines https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betteridge's_law_of_headlines This is why we have governments with the power to enact regulations. I'd like to think no one still believes in any sort of market fundamentalism that believes firms will self-regulate against their own financial interest.
aaroninsf 8y ago
Not without conspiracy or organization. Those who say yes when asked to engage in profit-generating yet morally ambiguous or immoral behaviors will rise and be rewardedm; those who say no will be marginalized and removed. This is an essentially inevitable outcome for anything other than a nonprofit or benefit corp. Witness the decay of Google's moral compass, and more recently, the outright contempt for ethics at darlings like Uber.

12 points by SmkyMt 8y ago

I'm quoted in the article as one of the engineers fired for unionizing and as an advocate of experimenting with a hiring hall model of organization. Happy to discuss either here.

pmoriarty 8y ago
Did you have any problems getting hired at your next job because you made waves at your last? Does the company you're currently working for have a union?
- bwestergard 8y ago
  When I and all of my coworkers were fired, and the office we worked in shut down, it came as an immense shock. I was terrified I'd never do the work I loved again, particularly after I became the de facto spokesperson for the group. As it happens, I did not have any difficulty finding another job. I had interviews with several companies within four weeks of being fired (despite spending a great deal of time cooperating with the NLRB investigation in addition to job hunting). I was sitting at my desk at a new job less than eight weeks after being fired. I worked with a recruiter, who was not particularly interested in why my last employer had terminated me after hearing that all non-supervisory engineers had been terminated. I don't know whether the recruiter shopped me around to employers who decided to pass on me for having supported a union. When asked by prospective employers why I'd left my last job I replied that the company had characterized the situation as a "lay off" of all engineers due to a "change in direction". I was never pressed for more information. One employer brought up unions in an oblique way, presumably because they'd googled my name and read coverage of the case. They made me an offer anyway. My former coworkers, none of whom went public the way I did while looking for a job, didn't seem to have any problems either. I believe all but one have found new jobs better than or comparable to their old jobs. No employer could know who did and did not support the union, so everyone but me had plausible deniability. To my knowledge none were asked about it. The company I'm working for now is a fairly typical media company and is not unionized.
  - pmoriarty 8y ago
    Are you going to press for the formation of a union at your new job as you did on your last? If not, could you talk about why not?
    - bwestergard 8y ago
      No. I don't believe in "salting" (taking jobs with an eye to certifying a union). I think I want what most devs want: a job where I spend most of my time writing code to solve interesting problems, to have opportunities to deepen my understanding of mathematics and computer science, etc. People have problems at work all the time; they usually try to solve them as individuals. Sometimes that works, more often it doesn't -- they just come to expect less out of life. At Lanetix, collective action was well underway by the time I became involved. The real catalyst of organization was the firing of an excellent engineer who had become the de facto spokesperson for grievances in one office (see: https://gist.github.com/bwestergard/a5ddc5583d37554cc40a0e2b86511371 https://gist.github.com/bwestergard/a5ddc5583d37554cc40a0e2b...). It was only after management's effort to suppress a collective response that I became involved. I was one of several who advocated for the NLRA route; I would not have done so in any "hot shop" situation.

atomic77 8y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betteridge's_law_of_headlines https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betteridge's_law_of_headlines This is why we have governments with the power to enact regulations. I'd like to think no one still believes in any sort of market fundamentalism that believes firms will self-regulate against their own financial interest.

aaroninsf 8y ago

Not without conspiracy or organization. Those who say yes when asked to engage in profit-generating yet morally ambiguous or immoral behaviors will rise and be rewardedm; those who say no will be marginalized and removed. This is an essentially inevitable outcome for anything other than a nonprofit or benefit corp. Witness the decay of Google's moral compass, and more recently, the outright contempt for ethics at darlings like Uber.