6 ms·

I'm appreciative of somebody who also has OCD writing an article like this detailing how the disorder isn't at all like the stereotype of a neat freak. What's f

I'm appreciative of somebody who also has OCD writing an article like this detailing how the disorder isn't at all like the stereotype of a neat freak. What's funny is, I myself am actually a terribly messy person with books and papers always strewn about (among clothes not quite in the hamper, &c). What's interesting to me from a personal history viewpoint is that one of my earliest compulsions also centered around door knobs. However, in my case I had to cover the whole surface area of the knob (hah!) with my hand and yank it shut multiple times (the exact number was arbitrary; merely whatever "felt" right) until I was sufficiently satisfied that the damn door was indeed closed. I still do this when leaving my apartment. Hell, reading this article and writing this comment has "caused" (ie, compelled me to) do some of my own compulsions multiple times already because just thinking about doing them means I need to. Once I get into my head that I "have" to do X, Y, or Z then it's much harder to ignore than if the trigger (or what have you) came up in everyday life. I hope you HNers learned something so me sitting here in my underpants counting powers of 2 and repeatedly moving my head back and forth like a confused pigeon wasn't totally for naught! :) EDIT: For those more curious about this topic (all dozen of you) I wrote a short piece on my blog attempting to better illustrate the painful bizarrity of OCD through the vehicle of a fictional dialectic: https://salt.mattwie.se/essays/all-mad.html https://salt.mattwie.se/essays/all-mad.html

coderdude 8y ago
The trick to the home door locking thing is "I most likely did it" plus "it's all just crap, anyways." This let's you work around robbery and fires as well (if you live in California).
bpizzi 8y ago
Thanks for sharing. The complexities of the human brain will never cease to amaze me. There should be a way, in all this neuronal maze, to escape those compulsions, but I bet it's really well hidden.
- 193 8y ago
  Well, one way out is behavioral therapy. Obsessive compulsive disorder is a form of anxiety disorder. You are afraid of something (sickness, death, loosing control) - then you get obsessive about it and then you do some compulsive action to mentally ease that thought/anxiety. But now you have "learned" to behave in a certain way to feel better. And you are weighting the triggering thought as more important by giving that much attention to it. This is resulting in a self-enforcing feedback loop in the end. Behavioral therapy is a way to "unlearn" this behavior. Mostly by working against the initial anxiety. If you are unconcerned/neutral/bored of something, you cannot gain that much obsessive/compulsive momentum.
  - inertiatic 8y ago
    Unless you pull a logical trick to reduce every discomfort to fear, I don't agree that everyone that suffers from OCD is afraid of something and anxious about it.
    - 193 8y ago
      I don't think that fear and anxiety are exactly the same thing. (fear being a very basic response to a very concrete (perceived) threat, while anxiety is more diffuse, constant, covering larger timeframes) Assuming we are talking about the same thing (anxiety), why do you think that not everyone suffering from OCD has that as the cause? What other types do you know of? It is possible that I was focusing too much on intrusive thoughts and related issue, but my current understanding is that the OCD mechanism described above is the same for any type of OCD and that it is by definition an anxiety disorder. The discomfort you are describing could be the same thing as the anxiety I was speaking of, although discomfort is maybe not intense enough to describe the internal experience of the disorder. As always: these things are distributed on a spectrum with better/worse days and cases between people. It only becomes a disorder if you suffer from it on a regular basis in some phase of your life.
      - coldtea 8y ago
        >I don't think that fear and anxiety are exactly the same thing. (fear being a very basic response to a very concrete (perceived) threat, while anxiety is more diffuse, constant, covering larger timeframes) That could just be a historical product of the English language. Other languages don't necessarily discriminate this way between fear and anxiety. E.g. we can equally talk about someone "fearing" they have forgot the stove open or "being anxious" about it in this here parts.
- 56chan4 8y ago
  I would want to measure dietary Taurine levels in the body for a start. Experiments consuming 3g/day have shown no side effects, but your main source is limited to energy drinks so you have to contend with caffeine, and Taurine does not last long in the body (can start to be expelled in urine within 10mins), much like many of the water soluble chemicals classed as vitamins or minerals. Cooking actually destroys it from organ meats and some scientific studies have shown a link between vegetarianism and a variety of mental health issues including OCD. You wont find any substantial levels of Taurine in vegetables, but you will in raw liver, kidneys and brains. From my own experience, 3 or 4 Redbulls a day (1g of Taurine per can) can change many repetitive behaviours. Taurine also has many other positive effects on the body like including VO2 max, improving cholesterol profiles, improving bile acid patterns, reducing depression, improving sleep, improving memory, reducing atherosclerosis, reducing fatty liver disease, reversing some types of cataracts, reducing stones especially in women, to name some of the observed scientific improvements to human health. Its probably why its now added to formula milk for babies since the 80's (but at levels lower than breast milk) and has subsequently improved their cognitive abilities.
  - Chazprime 8y ago
    Ironic, in this case, as taurine was once extracted from bull semen.
    - 1996 8y ago
      so what if it is good for the health? I do not ask how hot dogs are made, and I care even less for things I take for my health
      - Chazprime 8y ago
        It’s ironic when the author describes a fear of food contamination by semen, that possible relief might come in the form of bull semen, that’s all.
  - TheSpiceIsLife 8y ago
    > From my own experience, 3 or 4 Redbulls a day This seems like an incredibly bad idea. You would be far better off using taurine powder.
rndmwlk 8y ago
I have the exact same compulsion with locking my door. If I leave my apartment and I don't do my little ritual then I'll either be worried all day, or some times I'll drive back to my apartment and "properly" close the door.
- liberte82 8y ago
  Oh yeah I've had this one big time in the past. It sort of comes and goes, hasn't been bothering me much lately. But a few times at my old job I drove all the way back into work to verify I'd locked the door when leaving for the night even though I was _very_ conscious about locking it - I just wasn't was totally certain as I felt I needed to be. If this starts bugging me again I'm going to start taking pictures of the locked doors for myself. :)
  - stephengillie 8y ago
    Have you tried balancing this urge to return, against self-anger and humiliation at all the time and gas you're wasting by driving back to check? When I get irrational urges, I make the urges battle my insecurities and get out of the way. Insecurities usually win.
- jjtheblunt 8y ago
  I used to do it too. I figured it was a short term memory flaw, then it became a habit, so it just feels "off" to not double check. I'm actually comforted seeing i wasn't the only one.
Retric 8y ago
Would it help if you had a webcam pointed at the door so you could remotely verify it's closed and locked? Or do you need some the actual feeling of the door being closed to end the fixation?
- victorbojica 8y ago
  Really want to see an answer on this
  - stubish 8y ago
    I expect it would just move the goal posts, and you would end up staring at the screen to confirm the door is closed or checking the camera to ensure it is pointed at the correct door or some similar way of getting the 'hit' that the door checking gives you.
- jcranendonk 8y ago
  It may help in the moment, but any action that reinforces the (faulty) belief that your obsessive thoughts are relevant and worth paying attention to will worsen OCD over time. The right approach is to teach yourself to be OK with the uncertainty of the door being locked or not. This is what behavioral therapy for OCD, specifically ERP, aims to do.
- matthewwiese 8y ago
  You hit the hail on the head with your latter idea. At least in my case, it all comes down to the "feel" of the door being locked and shut; I yank the door around pretty violently some days if I'm especially stressed. At some point, the compulsion was about the door being closed for the security of the apartment, but now it's been bastardized over the years into just being a fixation on the door itself. Also, as jcranendonk pointed out in a separate reply to your comment, reinforcing the behavior does more harm than good in the long run. In my case, I've been able to reduce some of the mental strain by following CBT principles in a therapy session and also on my own; I can't comment on ERP personally, but I do know it's shown widespread promise in the literature. My previous therapist incorporated some of its techniques into our sessions as well, but was principally following CBT practice.

coderdude 8y ago

The trick to the home door locking thing is "I most likely did it" plus "it's all just crap, anyways." This let's you work around robbery and fires as well (if you live in California).

bpizzi 8y ago

Thanks for sharing. The complexities of the human brain will never cease to amaze me. There should be a way, in all this neuronal maze, to escape those compulsions, but I bet it's really well hidden.

193 8y ago
Well, one way out is behavioral therapy. Obsessive compulsive disorder is a form of anxiety disorder. You are afraid of something (sickness, death, loosing control) - then you get obsessive about it and then you do some compulsive action to mentally ease that thought/anxiety. But now you have "learned" to behave in a certain way to feel better. And you are weighting the triggering thought as more important by giving that much attention to it. This is resulting in a self-enforcing feedback loop in the end. Behavioral therapy is a way to "unlearn" this behavior. Mostly by working against the initial anxiety. If you are unconcerned/neutral/bored of something, you cannot gain that much obsessive/compulsive momentum.
- inertiatic 8y ago
  Unless you pull a logical trick to reduce every discomfort to fear, I don't agree that everyone that suffers from OCD is afraid of something and anxious about it.
  - 193 8y ago
    I don't think that fear and anxiety are exactly the same thing. (fear being a very basic response to a very concrete (perceived) threat, while anxiety is more diffuse, constant, covering larger timeframes) Assuming we are talking about the same thing (anxiety), why do you think that not everyone suffering from OCD has that as the cause? What other types do you know of? It is possible that I was focusing too much on intrusive thoughts and related issue, but my current understanding is that the OCD mechanism described above is the same for any type of OCD and that it is by definition an anxiety disorder. The discomfort you are describing could be the same thing as the anxiety I was speaking of, although discomfort is maybe not intense enough to describe the internal experience of the disorder. As always: these things are distributed on a spectrum with better/worse days and cases between people. It only becomes a disorder if you suffer from it on a regular basis in some phase of your life.
    - coldtea 8y ago
      >I don't think that fear and anxiety are exactly the same thing. (fear being a very basic response to a very concrete (perceived) threat, while anxiety is more diffuse, constant, covering larger timeframes) That could just be a historical product of the English language. Other languages don't necessarily discriminate this way between fear and anxiety. E.g. we can equally talk about someone "fearing" they have forgot the stove open or "being anxious" about it in this here parts.
56chan4 8y ago
I would want to measure dietary Taurine levels in the body for a start. Experiments consuming 3g/day have shown no side effects, but your main source is limited to energy drinks so you have to contend with caffeine, and Taurine does not last long in the body (can start to be expelled in urine within 10mins), much like many of the water soluble chemicals classed as vitamins or minerals. Cooking actually destroys it from organ meats and some scientific studies have shown a link between vegetarianism and a variety of mental health issues including OCD. You wont find any substantial levels of Taurine in vegetables, but you will in raw liver, kidneys and brains. From my own experience, 3 or 4 Redbulls a day (1g of Taurine per can) can change many repetitive behaviours. Taurine also has many other positive effects on the body like including VO2 max, improving cholesterol profiles, improving bile acid patterns, reducing depression, improving sleep, improving memory, reducing atherosclerosis, reducing fatty liver disease, reversing some types of cataracts, reducing stones especially in women, to name some of the observed scientific improvements to human health. Its probably why its now added to formula milk for babies since the 80's (but at levels lower than breast milk) and has subsequently improved their cognitive abilities.
- Chazprime 8y ago
  Ironic, in this case, as taurine was once extracted from bull semen.
  - 1996 8y ago
    so what if it is good for the health? I do not ask how hot dogs are made, and I care even less for things I take for my health
    - Chazprime 8y ago
      It’s ironic when the author describes a fear of food contamination by semen, that possible relief might come in the form of bull semen, that’s all.
- TheSpiceIsLife 8y ago
  > From my own experience, 3 or 4 Redbulls a day This seems like an incredibly bad idea. You would be far better off using taurine powder.

rndmwlk 8y ago

I have the exact same compulsion with locking my door. If I leave my apartment and I don't do my little ritual then I'll either be worried all day, or some times I'll drive back to my apartment and "properly" close the door.

liberte82 8y ago
Oh yeah I've had this one big time in the past. It sort of comes and goes, hasn't been bothering me much lately. But a few times at my old job I drove all the way back into work to verify I'd locked the door when leaving for the night even though I was _very_ conscious about locking it - I just wasn't was totally certain as I felt I needed to be. If this starts bugging me again I'm going to start taking pictures of the locked doors for myself. :)
- stephengillie 8y ago
  Have you tried balancing this urge to return, against self-anger and humiliation at all the time and gas you're wasting by driving back to check? When I get irrational urges, I make the urges battle my insecurities and get out of the way. Insecurities usually win.
jjtheblunt 8y ago
I used to do it too. I figured it was a short term memory flaw, then it became a habit, so it just feels "off" to not double check. I'm actually comforted seeing i wasn't the only one.

Retric 8y ago

Would it help if you had a webcam pointed at the door so you could remotely verify it's closed and locked? Or do you need some the actual feeling of the door being closed to end the fixation?

victorbojica 8y ago
Really want to see an answer on this
- stubish 8y ago
  I expect it would just move the goal posts, and you would end up staring at the screen to confirm the door is closed or checking the camera to ensure it is pointed at the correct door or some similar way of getting the 'hit' that the door checking gives you.
jcranendonk 8y ago
It may help in the moment, but any action that reinforces the (faulty) belief that your obsessive thoughts are relevant and worth paying attention to will worsen OCD over time. The right approach is to teach yourself to be OK with the uncertainty of the door being locked or not. This is what behavioral therapy for OCD, specifically ERP, aims to do.
matthewwiese 8y ago
You hit the hail on the head with your latter idea. At least in my case, it all comes down to the "feel" of the door being locked and shut; I yank the door around pretty violently some days if I'm especially stressed. At some point, the compulsion was about the door being closed for the security of the apartment, but now it's been bastardized over the years into just being a fixation on the door itself. Also, as jcranendonk pointed out in a separate reply to your comment, reinforcing the behavior does more harm than good in the long run. In my case, I've been able to reduce some of the mental strain by following CBT principles in a therapy session and also on my own; I can't comment on ERP personally, but I do know it's shown widespread promise in the literature. My previous therapist incorporated some of its techniques into our sessions as well, but was principally following CBT practice.