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I don't see how that is inaccurate. Can you explain?

macintux 8y ago
China made demands regarding data hosting of tech companies operating in their country. Worrisome, but by definition lawful. Apple complied while still retaining as much security as possible. They assert that the data is still encrypted, and they hold the keys: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/12/business/apple-china-data-center-cybersecurity.html https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/12/business/apple-china-data... Apple had, as I see it, two choices: disable current customers and refuse to sell any more devices, or comply with the law. So, yes, Apple could have walked away from their customers, but how would that have helped anyone? Their phones are still more secure from non-state actors than nearly anyone else's, and Chinese citizens, for better or worse, have to live with the dictatorship's rules. (And to preempt the inevitable comparison: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/sep/21/google-is-returning-to-china-it-never-really-left https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/sep/21/google-is...) So "They literally made a deal to spy on Chinese citizens as soon as that made them profit" is only true if you assume Apple is lying about the encryption and lying about their reasons for opening the new data center. It's also possible the OP is talking about some other Apple cooperation with China, but that seems to be the one most people throw at them.
- CaptSpify 8y ago
  I definitly see Apple as being capable as lying. They have a history of it, of course, so I dont see how this situation is any different. Additionally, Google is absolutely bad, but that is just whataboutism. If Apple valued privacy as much as they say they do, they would take a stand. Lost profits are part of taking a stand. I still don't see how that original statement is innacurrate.
  - macintux 8y ago
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ If you're going to assume Apple is lying about the situation, then sure, you can make any statement about them seem legitimate. It's still not clear what anyone gains by them walking away from China.
    - CaptSpify 8y ago
      Of course they lie. They could prove to us that they are being honest, but have chosen not to. Why would they do that if they didn't have something to hide? Sticking by your ethics isn't about what you gain, it is about being honest and trustworthy.
  - malshe 8y ago
    Can you give examples of Apple Inc., the company, knowingly lying about anything?
    - CaptSpify 8y ago
      "Your holding it wrong" "We slowed down your battery to make your phone last longer"

China made demands regarding data hosting of tech companies operating in their country. Worrisome, but by definition lawful. Apple complied while still retaining as much security as possible. They assert that the data is still encrypted, and they hold the keys: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/12/business/apple-china-data-center-cybersecurity.html https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/12/business/apple-china-data... Apple had, as I see it, two choices: disable current customers and refuse to sell any more devices, or comply with the law. So, yes, Apple could have walked away from their customers, but how would that have helped anyone? Their phones are still more secure from non-state actors than nearly anyone else's, and Chinese citizens, for better or worse, have to live with the dictatorship's rules. (And to preempt the inevitable comparison: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/sep/21/google-is-returning-to-china-it-never-really-left https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/sep/21/google-is...) So "They literally made a deal to spy on Chinese citizens as soon as that made them profit" is only true if you assume Apple is lying about the encryption and lying about their reasons for opening the new data center. It's also possible the OP is talking about some other Apple cooperation with China, but that seems to be the one most people throw at them.

CaptSpify 8y ago
I definitly see Apple as being capable as lying. They have a history of it, of course, so I dont see how this situation is any different. Additionally, Google is absolutely bad, but that is just whataboutism. If Apple valued privacy as much as they say they do, they would take a stand. Lost profits are part of taking a stand. I still don't see how that original statement is innacurrate.
- macintux 8y ago
  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ If you're going to assume Apple is lying about the situation, then sure, you can make any statement about them seem legitimate. It's still not clear what anyone gains by them walking away from China.
  - CaptSpify 8y ago
    Of course they lie. They could prove to us that they are being honest, but have chosen not to. Why would they do that if they didn't have something to hide? Sticking by your ethics isn't about what you gain, it is about being honest and trustworthy.
- malshe 8y ago
  Can you give examples of Apple Inc., the company, knowingly lying about anything?
  - CaptSpify 8y ago
    "Your holding it wrong" "We slowed down your battery to make your phone last longer"