6 ms·

This is very clever but makes me sad. It’s 2018 and the best, cleanest way of monitoring and storing my own transactions programmatically is by scraping an emai

This is very clever but makes me sad. It’s 2018 and the best, cleanest way of monitoring and storing my own transactions programmatically is by scraping an email.

orf 8y ago
*in America Banks provide an API in Europe. In fact it's a legal requirement that's coming into force in 2019, and there are a lot of 'mobile-first' banks like Monzo and Revolut which make this entirely un-needed in the first place (providing spending exports, decent analytics, push notifications, etc etc). Welcome to the future. Contact your local politician if you want to join us. Maybe also ask about chip and pin while you're at it!
- bhhaskin 8y ago
  Sure, but as other users like Rjevski have pointed out the PSD2 API is going to be nearly impossible for the common person to use. Unless you want to become pretty much PCI-DSS certified.
  - orf 8y ago
    So you're surprised or concerned that applications that wish to extract financial data abour consumers programmatically from their bank accounts need to conform to regulations regarding the storage of said data? Oh no. What a travesty.
    - jsjohnst 8y ago
      From GP: > API is going to be nearly impossible for the common person to use Reading what you are replying to and making an argument against that rather than a hypothetical straw man that GP didn’t imply or mean will get you further.
      - orf 8y ago
        Apologies, I misread it as him complaining that small, one man startups will not be able to compete due to the necessary regulatory burden.
        miracle2k 8y ago
        More importantly, the original post, the one you responded to somewhat arrogantly, stated: > This is very clever but makes me sad. It’s 2018 and the best, cleanest way of monitoring and storing my own transactions programmatically is by scraping an email. It would seem that, outside of Germany, which has FinTS, the cleanest way to monitor my own transactions programmatically may well remain email scraping.
        yacn 8y ago
        > somewhat that's generous.
- avianlyric 8y ago
  With Monzo you can just use IFTTT[1] for simple stuff like this, and the API[2] for complicated stuff. I personally use the API to automatically add flat bill directly to Splitwise. [1] https://monzo.com/features/ifttt/ https://monzo.com/features/ifttt/ [2] https://docs.monzo.com https://docs.monzo.com
  - simonvc 8y ago
    Have you opensourced that code? i'd be interested.. (i'm half the team that built IFTTT at Monzo)
- drstewart 8y ago
  Pretty condescending attitude you've got there. Since you're so far in the future, can you consider dragging Germany into it as well so I don't have to use cash everywhere I go?
  - orf 8y ago
    > Since you're so far in the future, can you consider dragging Germany into it as well so I don't have to use cash everywhere I go? I think that stems from an intense dislike of debt, specific to Germany more than anything. Not sure why that's relevant to my comment though, or why being 'so far in the future' means 'credit cards everywhere at all times'. Also the USA is still using cheques. They haven't even got to chip and pin yet. We are pretty much past that and onto contactless. How is that not futuristic compared to squiggling on a bit of paper to verify your identity?
    - perl4ever 8y ago
      "Also the USA is still using cheques. They haven't even got to chip and pin yet. We are pretty much past that and onto contactless." I'm not sure what you're talking about. All my cards have chips, and I'm in the US. And for several years, I've been living in an apartment which takes direct bank transfers for rent rather than paper checks. Landlords in my experience have been the last holdouts that don't want to stop using checks. Contactless payment I don't use, but I know it exists in the US because I see signs when I check out.
      - 549362-30499 8y ago
        Most American cards are chip and signature, not chip and pin. And they weren't even chip at all until recently.
        chrismeller 8y ago
        "until recently" meaning several years ago? Availability of terminals and support for the chip was what lagged, not the cards themselves (though that's a semantic argument in this case). I would also somewhat argue that "most" cards are chip and signature, not chip and PIN. While in the US my cards all prefer PIN, it wasn't until I got out of the US that for some reason they all wanted a signature - talk about irony. It's still far from ideal and not nearly as rigid as it is in Europe, but it's not quite as bad as you seem to think it is.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  Are you sure? Looking here[0], it seems the future is fake, and the EU is no better than the US in this regard. Even after 2019, I'll still have to scrape bank's website and manual exports to get my own data out in usable format. -- [0] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17718782 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17718782
  - skrause 8y ago
    Germany is better unless you use a crappy bank. HBCI is a 20 years old API supported by most major banks.
- Tharkun 8y ago
  > Banks provide an API in Europe. In fact it's a legal requirement that's coming into force in 2019 That's simply not true. You're probably referring to PSD2, which is not an API in the sense that anyone technical would use the term. And it's not meant for you or I. The requirements for gaining PSD2 API access are insane, and at least in some areas require permission from the national bank. Which you won't get unless you're a large corp with big bucks and lots of insurance.
- Havoc 8y ago
  Some parts of Europe suck too. eg HSBC Systems feel like they’ve recent advanced from 1995 to 1996.

This is very clever but makes me sad. It’s 2018 and the best, cleanest way of monitoring and storing my own transactions programmatically is by scraping an email.

orf 8y ago

*in America Banks provide an API in Europe. In fact it's a legal requirement that's coming into force in 2019, and there are a lot of 'mobile-first' banks like Monzo and Revolut which make this entirely un-needed in the first place (providing spending exports, decent analytics, push notifications, etc etc). Welcome to the future. Contact your local politician if you want to join us. Maybe also ask about chip and pin while you're at it!

bhhaskin 8y ago
Sure, but as other users like Rjevski have pointed out the PSD2 API is going to be nearly impossible for the common person to use. Unless you want to become pretty much PCI-DSS certified.
- orf 8y ago
  So you're surprised or concerned that applications that wish to extract financial data abour consumers programmatically from their bank accounts need to conform to regulations regarding the storage of said data? Oh no. What a travesty.
  - jsjohnst 8y ago
    From GP: > API is going to be nearly impossible for the common person to use Reading what you are replying to and making an argument against that rather than a hypothetical straw man that GP didn’t imply or mean will get you further.
    - orf 8y ago
      Apologies, I misread it as him complaining that small, one man startups will not be able to compete due to the necessary regulatory burden.
      - miracle2k 8y ago
        More importantly, the original post, the one you responded to somewhat arrogantly, stated: > This is very clever but makes me sad. It’s 2018 and the best, cleanest way of monitoring and storing my own transactions programmatically is by scraping an email. It would seem that, outside of Germany, which has FinTS, the cleanest way to monitor my own transactions programmatically may well remain email scraping.
        yacn 8y ago
        > somewhat that's generous.
avianlyric 8y ago
With Monzo you can just use IFTTT[1] for simple stuff like this, and the API[2] for complicated stuff. I personally use the API to automatically add flat bill directly to Splitwise. [1] https://monzo.com/features/ifttt/ https://monzo.com/features/ifttt/ [2] https://docs.monzo.com https://docs.monzo.com
- simonvc 8y ago
  Have you opensourced that code? i'd be interested.. (i'm half the team that built IFTTT at Monzo)
drstewart 8y ago
Pretty condescending attitude you've got there. Since you're so far in the future, can you consider dragging Germany into it as well so I don't have to use cash everywhere I go?
- orf 8y ago
  > Since you're so far in the future, can you consider dragging Germany into it as well so I don't have to use cash everywhere I go? I think that stems from an intense dislike of debt, specific to Germany more than anything. Not sure why that's relevant to my comment though, or why being 'so far in the future' means 'credit cards everywhere at all times'. Also the USA is still using cheques. They haven't even got to chip and pin yet. We are pretty much past that and onto contactless. How is that not futuristic compared to squiggling on a bit of paper to verify your identity?
  - perl4ever 8y ago
    "Also the USA is still using cheques. They haven't even got to chip and pin yet. We are pretty much past that and onto contactless." I'm not sure what you're talking about. All my cards have chips, and I'm in the US. And for several years, I've been living in an apartment which takes direct bank transfers for rent rather than paper checks. Landlords in my experience have been the last holdouts that don't want to stop using checks. Contactless payment I don't use, but I know it exists in the US because I see signs when I check out.
    - 549362-30499 8y ago
      Most American cards are chip and signature, not chip and pin. And they weren't even chip at all until recently.
      - chrismeller 8y ago
        "until recently" meaning several years ago? Availability of terminals and support for the chip was what lagged, not the cards themselves (though that's a semantic argument in this case). I would also somewhat argue that "most" cards are chip and signature, not chip and PIN. While in the US my cards all prefer PIN, it wasn't until I got out of the US that for some reason they all wanted a signature - talk about irony. It's still far from ideal and not nearly as rigid as it is in Europe, but it's not quite as bad as you seem to think it is.
TeMPOraL 8y ago
Are you sure? Looking here[0], it seems the future is fake, and the EU is no better than the US in this regard. Even after 2019, I'll still have to scrape bank's website and manual exports to get my own data out in usable format. -- [0] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17718782 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17718782
- skrause 8y ago
  Germany is better unless you use a crappy bank. HBCI is a 20 years old API supported by most major banks.
Tharkun 8y ago
> Banks provide an API in Europe. In fact it's a legal requirement that's coming into force in 2019 That's simply not true. You're probably referring to PSD2, which is not an API in the sense that anyone technical would use the term. And it's not meant for you or I. The requirements for gaining PSD2 API access are insane, and at least in some areas require permission from the national bank. Which you won't get unless you're a large corp with big bucks and lots of insurance.
Havoc 8y ago
Some parts of Europe suck too. eg HSBC Systems feel like they’ve recent advanced from 1995 to 1996.