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Using a little known SF electrical code that allows DIY electrical work in a fully detached house If you did this in my property, when I found out what you did

Using a little known SF electrical code that allows DIY electrical work in a fully detached house If you did this in my property, when I found out what you did, you'd be in violation of the lease and paying me to have a licensed electrician out to inspect the work and do anything needed to bring it up to code. I can't imagine why your landlord is ok with a tenant's DIY electrical work, since the landlord is the one on the hook if it goes bad now or in the future.

ec109685 8y ago
They said they were insured, so presumably, the landlord is covered.
- Johnny555 8y ago
  That's not a safe presumption -- insurance companies can deny a claim based on unlicensed work. So unless the tenant was a professional electrician with his own liability insurance that would cover the work, it's quite possible that the landlord is not covered.
Faaak 8y ago
It's funny how some people seem to be afraid of DIY electrical work. In European countries it's really different. For example, in Switzerland, you can do it yourself, but it must pass the routine inspection. France is even laxer. If you follow most of the most important rules (Fuse, RCCB, cood conduit, proper cable), hardly anything can go wrong. Hell, you can easily destroy a house with a single cigarette, but nobody talks about it.
- Johnny555 8y ago
  In the USA, the landlord holds the bulk of the responsibility if shoddy electrical work injures or kills someone. While it is certainly possible for an amateur to follow the right procedures and do safe work, it's also possible (and even quite likely) that they don't know everything they need to do, and end up doing something unsafe. While you can easily destroy a house with a cigarette (though many landlords have non-smoking clauses here), a cigarette won't generally burn down the house a year from now after the tenant who did the work is long gone.
techsupporter 8y ago
Two points, one more "editorial" than the other: First, the person you replied to didn't say that they didn't have it inspected and didn't have to meet code. I just perused San Francisco's municipal ordinances. They follow the same ones I've seen elsewhere. The homeowner or lessee of a single-family detached house is allowed to pull permits on his or her own authority and do the work. The work must still follow the same inspection process from the city and must meet all relevant codes. It is not just that the tenant could slap wire wherever he or she chose; the relevant rules would still be followed. Second, and this is the editorial part, why do landlords--at least the ones I read on the Internet--have such an adversarial relationship with tenants? "My property," "what you did," "violation of the lease," and so on. The tenant is the one making the money for you; why immediately assume bad faith? If you're going to be all legalistic about it, when you signed the lease, you signed over most of the rights for "your property" to the tenant. Perhaps that should be a more harmonious relationship?
- Johnny555 8y ago
  I assumed he didn't pull permits because he said It cost me $100 in parts/wire -- nothing about permit fees. Because tenants, in general, don't have a long-term interest in the property and are willing to cut corners. Some things I've seen: Switching 15A breaker for a 20A breaker "because it trips too much". Wiring an extension cord into the panel and running it through a hole in the wall to the garage "because I needed another circuit (my grow lights kept tripping the other one)" Swapping hot/neutral when replacing outlets Using a wire nut that's too small and taping it to hold it in place. Not using a wire nut at all, just twisting wires together and taping them.

ec109685 8y ago

They said they were insured, so presumably, the landlord is covered.

Johnny555 8y ago
That's not a safe presumption -- insurance companies can deny a claim based on unlicensed work. So unless the tenant was a professional electrician with his own liability insurance that would cover the work, it's quite possible that the landlord is not covered.

Faaak 8y ago

It's funny how some people seem to be afraid of DIY electrical work. In European countries it's really different. For example, in Switzerland, you can do it yourself, but it must pass the routine inspection. France is even laxer. If you follow most of the most important rules (Fuse, RCCB, cood conduit, proper cable), hardly anything can go wrong. Hell, you can easily destroy a house with a single cigarette, but nobody talks about it.

Johnny555 8y ago
In the USA, the landlord holds the bulk of the responsibility if shoddy electrical work injures or kills someone. While it is certainly possible for an amateur to follow the right procedures and do safe work, it's also possible (and even quite likely) that they don't know everything they need to do, and end up doing something unsafe. While you can easily destroy a house with a cigarette (though many landlords have non-smoking clauses here), a cigarette won't generally burn down the house a year from now after the tenant who did the work is long gone.

techsupporter 8y ago

Two points, one more "editorial" than the other: First, the person you replied to didn't say that they didn't have it inspected and didn't have to meet code. I just perused San Francisco's municipal ordinances. They follow the same ones I've seen elsewhere. The homeowner or lessee of a single-family detached house is allowed to pull permits on his or her own authority and do the work. The work must still follow the same inspection process from the city and must meet all relevant codes. It is not just that the tenant could slap wire wherever he or she chose; the relevant rules would still be followed. Second, and this is the editorial part, why do landlords--at least the ones I read on the Internet--have such an adversarial relationship with tenants? "My property," "what you did," "violation of the lease," and so on. The tenant is the one making the money for you; why immediately assume bad faith? If you're going to be all legalistic about it, when you signed the lease, you signed over most of the rights for "your property" to the tenant. Perhaps that should be a more harmonious relationship?

Johnny555 8y ago
I assumed he didn't pull permits because he said It cost me $100 in parts/wire -- nothing about permit fees. Because tenants, in general, don't have a long-term interest in the property and are willing to cut corners. Some things I've seen: Switching 15A breaker for a 20A breaker "because it trips too much". Wiring an extension cord into the panel and running it through a hole in the wall to the garage "because I needed another circuit (my grow lights kept tripping the other one)" Swapping hot/neutral when replacing outlets Using a wire nut that's too small and taping it to hold it in place. Not using a wire nut at all, just twisting wires together and taping them.