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What he is experiencing is the reality of most people's lives. The boredom and drudgery of doing the hard yards every day. Most people do not have the luxury of

What he is experiencing is the reality of most people's lives. The boredom and drudgery of doing the hard yards every day. Most people do not have the luxury of doing what is interesting to them. It is a case of just having to knuckle down and complete what has been started. From my personal perspective, it's nice to have side projects that are interesting and learning exercises. The reality is that if these side projects are actually worth it then they need to be completed. Otherwise they are just a fad and not really worth the effort that might be put into them. If something is worth starting then it is worth finishing.

Waterluvian 8y ago
I struggled with side projects that I never completed until I decided that I would never do a side project that can't be done in one or two afternoons. There are people out there that can chip away at a project over months or years and I think I just took a while to learn that I'm not one of them.
- oldandtired 8y ago
  Most of us have side projects that we can be troubled by. We also don't put them out for everyone to see, nor do we say publicly that we are giving up because the hard work is now upon us. I have lots of side projects that I may live to see finished. However, any that I say I am working on get assigned time to move them forward - they may take years to complete, but they will be worked on over time. From my perspective, he would have been better off saying that due to time constraints further work will be done when he is able to allocate time and leave it at that. There are plenty of projects that only get updated irregularly over years and can have years between updates. That's fine. However, if you stop a public project because you just don't want to handle the hard work now involved, that becomes something different. You are making a public statement about your character which you probably weren't intending.
goatslacker 8y ago
Yes and no. Sometimes it's not about the destination but about experiencing the journey. From the post it seems like the author extracted the value they wanted to extract over the years. Knowing when to give up is difficult, especially when you've sunk a lot of cost into the project and feel like you have to finish it. The thing is, you don't have to and it's perfectly acceptable to put it on hold indefinitely. In the end you'll still have all those experiences with you and that's what you paid for with your time.
- oldandtired 8y ago
  The problem here is that the project was made public for others to use/view. If someone wants to do a private project that impacts no-one else, it is then completely up to them as to whether they continue or not as it their choice. However, when one starts a project and says "look at me and the fabulous stuff I am doing" then it does not show them in a good light when they give up because they are now in the drudge work. In a public situation, they are essentially saying that they are not worth their hire when the normal drudge work starts. I can understand stepping back from a project for all sorts of reasons, except for the reason that it is hard work to continue because drudgery. Most of the work that most of us have to do is not exciting, not learning new things, not even interesting. It is just drudgery that needs to be done to get to the eventual goal that we started with. This is life. The thing is that even drudgery work can be viewed in a very positive light if we continue to see it as essential for the final goal we started with. We will see the need for it and we work willingly towards the completion of it for the purpose of what we will achieve in the end. The journey is a part of the destination and it is an essential part of the whole process. A journey without a destination and a destination without a journey are both meaningless without the other. Both are the two sides of each other.
  - projektir 8y ago
    This seems like a very strange perspective. > The problem here is that the project was made public for others to use/view. This literally doesn't matter if we're talking about someone's character, because whether it's public or not is irrelevant regarding the " they give up because they are now in the drudge work" point. Either that point is valid or it's not, but the public knowing about it is beside the point. And I would say the point is not valid. Someone starting a personal project for a language and then discontinuing it is still much better off than someone not starting a project at all. I don't think most engineers share the perspective that this shows them in a bad light or something, this is honestly the first time I've seen this perspective in years. > Most of the work that most of us have to do is not exciting, not learning new things, not even interesting. It is just drudgery that needs to be done to get to the eventual goal that we started with. This is life. There's nothing good about this, nor anything good about reinforcing it. Godspeed to those who can avoid it. The author of the language does not owe it to anyone to start, continue, or finishing any projects they have in mind, definitely not to anyone sitting around and judging them for daring to do something at all.
JadeNB 8y ago
This post seems to be just a collection of generalities judging the way that someone else has chosen to spend his time. You seem both to be saying that he shouldn't have started and that, since he started, he shouldn't stop. Well, presumably the author once got some value out of the effort, so that it was worth starting; and found that he was now no longer getting enough value out of it, so that it was worth stopping. Do you really think that it's valid (or even important) for you to judge either of those decisions by someone else?
- oldandtired 8y ago
  For a private endeavour, whether he finishes or not is completely up to him. When he puts it out for all to see, this then changes the dynamic under which he is moving forward. If he had said he was stopping due to life commitments or family situations, etc, then these kinds of things take priority, as they should. No problems or issues should arise from that. But he has stated that he is giving up because it now involves doing the hard yards to complete the project - this does not show him in a good light. In essence, he is saying that once something has become non-interesting in whatever way, then he will give up and move onto something else that will hold his interest. In other words, he is committed to a course of action only when it holds his focus, but that he will happily drop it when it becomes hard work. I really don't think that he was intentionally going out to say that he is undependable. This is what he has said though.
  - MisterOctober 8y ago
    ^ I don't see it as indicating undesirable character at all. I read the piece as more an indication that the guy knows when to cut his losses and stop allocating resources to unprofitable activity. Which to me, from a business perspective, is a sign of someone with their head screwed on straight. I also don't grasp the logic behind the notion that once a creator shows his work -- or work-in-progress -- to the public that he is somehow bound by duty, honor, respect for his 'followers', or some other compelling consideration, to finish that work. If Beethoven starts writing a string quartet, and posts the first movement on the internet, but then realizes that the Duke isn't going to commission it and he'd rather be writing a sonata anyway, does it really reflect badly on LvB if he abandons the quartet?
adrianmsmith 8y ago
I don't agree. If I'm doing the boring parts of a project at work, at least I get paid for it. If I'm doing the boring parts of a side-project, where the only benefit to me is that it's fun, what's the point?
- oldandtired 8y ago
  The point is the completion of the project. Most parts of most projects that we do, whether we are paid to do those projects or not, are boring and tedious. Without those parts, nothing is ever built or completed.
  - Dayshine 8y ago
    >Most parts of most projects that we do, whether we are paid to do those projects or not, are boring and tedious ...to you. You find most parts of your projects boring and tedious. Many people don't. I definitely don't find any of my work boring, and only very small parts tedious.
frenchy 8y ago
> If something is worth starting then it is worth finishing. Perhaps that's true, but I think it's often quite difficult to know whether a project will be worth finishing before you start working on it.

Waterluvian 8y ago

I struggled with side projects that I never completed until I decided that I would never do a side project that can't be done in one or two afternoons. There are people out there that can chip away at a project over months or years and I think I just took a while to learn that I'm not one of them.

oldandtired 8y ago
Most of us have side projects that we can be troubled by. We also don't put them out for everyone to see, nor do we say publicly that we are giving up because the hard work is now upon us. I have lots of side projects that I may live to see finished. However, any that I say I am working on get assigned time to move them forward - they may take years to complete, but they will be worked on over time. From my perspective, he would have been better off saying that due to time constraints further work will be done when he is able to allocate time and leave it at that. There are plenty of projects that only get updated irregularly over years and can have years between updates. That's fine. However, if you stop a public project because you just don't want to handle the hard work now involved, that becomes something different. You are making a public statement about your character which you probably weren't intending.

goatslacker 8y ago

Yes and no. Sometimes it's not about the destination but about experiencing the journey. From the post it seems like the author extracted the value they wanted to extract over the years. Knowing when to give up is difficult, especially when you've sunk a lot of cost into the project and feel like you have to finish it. The thing is, you don't have to and it's perfectly acceptable to put it on hold indefinitely. In the end you'll still have all those experiences with you and that's what you paid for with your time.

oldandtired 8y ago
The problem here is that the project was made public for others to use/view. If someone wants to do a private project that impacts no-one else, it is then completely up to them as to whether they continue or not as it their choice. However, when one starts a project and says "look at me and the fabulous stuff I am doing" then it does not show them in a good light when they give up because they are now in the drudge work. In a public situation, they are essentially saying that they are not worth their hire when the normal drudge work starts. I can understand stepping back from a project for all sorts of reasons, except for the reason that it is hard work to continue because drudgery. Most of the work that most of us have to do is not exciting, not learning new things, not even interesting. It is just drudgery that needs to be done to get to the eventual goal that we started with. This is life. The thing is that even drudgery work can be viewed in a very positive light if we continue to see it as essential for the final goal we started with. We will see the need for it and we work willingly towards the completion of it for the purpose of what we will achieve in the end. The journey is a part of the destination and it is an essential part of the whole process. A journey without a destination and a destination without a journey are both meaningless without the other. Both are the two sides of each other.
- projektir 8y ago
  This seems like a very strange perspective. > The problem here is that the project was made public for others to use/view. This literally doesn't matter if we're talking about someone's character, because whether it's public or not is irrelevant regarding the " they give up because they are now in the drudge work" point. Either that point is valid or it's not, but the public knowing about it is beside the point. And I would say the point is not valid. Someone starting a personal project for a language and then discontinuing it is still much better off than someone not starting a project at all. I don't think most engineers share the perspective that this shows them in a bad light or something, this is honestly the first time I've seen this perspective in years. > Most of the work that most of us have to do is not exciting, not learning new things, not even interesting. It is just drudgery that needs to be done to get to the eventual goal that we started with. This is life. There's nothing good about this, nor anything good about reinforcing it. Godspeed to those who can avoid it. The author of the language does not owe it to anyone to start, continue, or finishing any projects they have in mind, definitely not to anyone sitting around and judging them for daring to do something at all.

JadeNB 8y ago

This post seems to be just a collection of generalities judging the way that someone else has chosen to spend his time. You seem both to be saying that he shouldn't have started and that, since he started, he shouldn't stop. Well, presumably the author once got some value out of the effort, so that it was worth starting; and found that he was now no longer getting enough value out of it, so that it was worth stopping. Do you really think that it's valid (or even important) for you to judge either of those decisions by someone else?

oldandtired 8y ago
For a private endeavour, whether he finishes or not is completely up to him. When he puts it out for all to see, this then changes the dynamic under which he is moving forward. If he had said he was stopping due to life commitments or family situations, etc, then these kinds of things take priority, as they should. No problems or issues should arise from that. But he has stated that he is giving up because it now involves doing the hard yards to complete the project - this does not show him in a good light. In essence, he is saying that once something has become non-interesting in whatever way, then he will give up and move onto something else that will hold his interest. In other words, he is committed to a course of action only when it holds his focus, but that he will happily drop it when it becomes hard work. I really don't think that he was intentionally going out to say that he is undependable. This is what he has said though.
- MisterOctober 8y ago
  ^ I don't see it as indicating undesirable character at all. I read the piece as more an indication that the guy knows when to cut his losses and stop allocating resources to unprofitable activity. Which to me, from a business perspective, is a sign of someone with their head screwed on straight. I also don't grasp the logic behind the notion that once a creator shows his work -- or work-in-progress -- to the public that he is somehow bound by duty, honor, respect for his 'followers', or some other compelling consideration, to finish that work. If Beethoven starts writing a string quartet, and posts the first movement on the internet, but then realizes that the Duke isn't going to commission it and he'd rather be writing a sonata anyway, does it really reflect badly on LvB if he abandons the quartet?

adrianmsmith 8y ago

I don't agree. If I'm doing the boring parts of a project at work, at least I get paid for it. If I'm doing the boring parts of a side-project, where the only benefit to me is that it's fun, what's the point?

oldandtired 8y ago
The point is the completion of the project. Most parts of most projects that we do, whether we are paid to do those projects or not, are boring and tedious. Without those parts, nothing is ever built or completed.
- Dayshine 8y ago
  >Most parts of most projects that we do, whether we are paid to do those projects or not, are boring and tedious ...to you. You find most parts of your projects boring and tedious. Many people don't. I definitely don't find any of my work boring, and only very small parts tedious.

frenchy 8y ago

> If something is worth starting then it is worth finishing. Perhaps that's true, but I think it's often quite difficult to know whether a project will be worth finishing before you start working on it.