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I think it's more that they've got a surplus of young men with no other options; historically, in any society where that occurs, you get violence sooner or late

I think it's more that they've got a surplus of young men with no other options; historically, in any society where that occurs, you get violence sooner or later. Young men with nothing to do cause trouble, no matter where they are.

jeffdavis 8y ago
There are many factors, I was asking specifically about the funding.
- abrahamepton 8y ago
  My point (poorly articulated) was that, in an environment where the cost of labor is driven to zero, there doesn't necessarily need to be much revenue involved at all. And of course Chicago is a major cartel nexus, so there's plenty of illicit money sloshing around.
  - jeffdavis 8y ago
    Nexus of what kinds of cartels? I guess that's my question.
    - abrahamepton 8y ago
      It's a major shipping/transportation hub, with a huge number of spanish-speaking people, so i think cartels have historically found it a useful place. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinaloa_Cartel#Operations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinaloa_Cartel#Operations
      - AnimalMuppet 8y ago
        You're not answering jeffdavis's question. The answer is "drug cartels", which is jeffdavis's point. They aren't just some generic cartels; they're specifically drug cartels. But you have a bit of a point, too. If you have tons of time and no money, there are a fair number of ways you can earn some money outside the law. Drugs are the most profitable currently, but if they were made legal, the action would probably move to other kinds of illegal activity.
        abrahamepton 8y ago
        I guess the way I see it, the drugs are incidental. Historically they haven't been, and for now the mix of drugs is changing - less weed, more opiates and meth - but I don't think just getting rid of the drug war would end gang life in Chicago. Let me be clear that I think the drug war is a terrible idea for a million reasons and should be ended tomorrow, or like, yesterday. But I don't think its end would be the end of gangs in places like Chicago, where the supply of young men is abundant and has no other alternative. Gangs will just find some other criminal activity, as the cartels themselves have started to do.

jeffdavis 8y ago

There are many factors, I was asking specifically about the funding.

abrahamepton 8y ago
My point (poorly articulated) was that, in an environment where the cost of labor is driven to zero, there doesn't necessarily need to be much revenue involved at all. And of course Chicago is a major cartel nexus, so there's plenty of illicit money sloshing around.
- jeffdavis 8y ago
  Nexus of what kinds of cartels? I guess that's my question.
  - abrahamepton 8y ago
    It's a major shipping/transportation hub, with a huge number of spanish-speaking people, so i think cartels have historically found it a useful place. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinaloa_Cartel#Operations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinaloa_Cartel#Operations
    - AnimalMuppet 8y ago
      You're not answering jeffdavis's question. The answer is "drug cartels", which is jeffdavis's point. They aren't just some generic cartels; they're specifically drug cartels. But you have a bit of a point, too. If you have tons of time and no money, there are a fair number of ways you can earn some money outside the law. Drugs are the most profitable currently, but if they were made legal, the action would probably move to other kinds of illegal activity.
      - abrahamepton 8y ago
        I guess the way I see it, the drugs are incidental. Historically they haven't been, and for now the mix of drugs is changing - less weed, more opiates and meth - but I don't think just getting rid of the drug war would end gang life in Chicago. Let me be clear that I think the drug war is a terrible idea for a million reasons and should be ended tomorrow, or like, yesterday. But I don't think its end would be the end of gangs in places like Chicago, where the supply of young men is abundant and has no other alternative. Gangs will just find some other criminal activity, as the cartels themselves have started to do.