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The successful phase out of CFCs, despite the fact that no comparable refrigerents were available at the time, shows that political solutions can work, even in

The successful phase out of CFCs, despite the fact that no comparable refrigerents were available at the time, shows that political solutions can work, even in the face of adverse economics. The success of Europe in reducing emissions shows that even unilateral solutions have important impact, and they do not mean deindustrialization. Carbon taxes work exceptionally well. The developing world is surprisingly dependent on the west, because that's where their carbon embodying products are sold. They need leadership and soft pressure. The thing that's missing is a united front of developed nations, and the most important piece of that is the US, that's to busy devolving into the middle ages.

ars 8y ago
> The successful phase out of CFCs, despite the fact that no comparable refrigerents were available at the time, shows that political solutions can work, even in the face of adverse economics. It actually shows exactly the opposite: That it only works when technological solutions exist. If there had been no effective replacement for CFC's, we'd still be using them now.
- bumholio 8y ago
  The replacements were technically and economically inferior. Just like carbon neutral sources of energy. And the phase-out stimulated research for viable substitutes. It's a vicious/virtuous circle, we aren't hostages of an implacable march of science, we are in the driver's seat. If we want to go to the Moon, we go there, and if we decide it's not worth it, the Moon tech does not magically get better over time. So "we don't have the technology alternative" is just code word for "let's do nothing"; if better energy sources were magically available, the economics would simply work by itself and the problem of global warming would disappear. (That's not to say anything politicians think up is possible, but that political and scientific forces go hand in hand in such endeavors)

ars 8y ago

> The successful phase out of CFCs, despite the fact that no comparable refrigerents were available at the time, shows that political solutions can work, even in the face of adverse economics. It actually shows exactly the opposite: That it only works when technological solutions exist. If there had been no effective replacement for CFC's, we'd still be using them now.

bumholio 8y ago
The replacements were technically and economically inferior. Just like carbon neutral sources of energy. And the phase-out stimulated research for viable substitutes. It's a vicious/virtuous circle, we aren't hostages of an implacable march of science, we are in the driver's seat. If we want to go to the Moon, we go there, and if we decide it's not worth it, the Moon tech does not magically get better over time. So "we don't have the technology alternative" is just code word for "let's do nothing"; if better energy sources were magically available, the economics would simply work by itself and the problem of global warming would disappear. (That's not to say anything politicians think up is possible, but that political and scientific forces go hand in hand in such endeavors)