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I am having a hard time understanding that he has Indian background and how come he is aloof to ramifications of censorship? He is actively pushing censorship,

by iamshs 8y ago

I am having a hard time understanding that he has Indian background and how come he is aloof to ramifications of censorship? He is actively pushing censorship, what government will not want to have a censored version of web? One version for Sikh, different one for Muslim and a different one for Hindu. Well done Sundar, even thinking about it. You will be beholden to local laws, and local laws will always change towards repressive side very easily if that means accomodating this project.

xvector 8y ago
Literally all of your comments in this thread are on Indians, India, or Hindus. You've commented multiple times on "the damaging impact this might have on India down the line", but pay no heed to the subject of this whole topic: the immediate damaging effects on Chinese citizens. As an Indian myself, I'm completely baffled by your tangents and you choosing to actively ignore the main issue at hand. This is not an issue because it might hurt India. This is an issue because it will hurt Chinese citizens.
- iamshs 8y ago
  My comments are on Indian government, and not Indians or Hindus. Where have I insinuated anything about Hindus? It is absolutely certain to hurt Indians in future, if Google goes ahead and implements it in China. This is what I am doing, bringing in another viewpoint which I didn't see being brought up beforehand. It is a valid viewpoint. Stop getting all nationalistic on me, especially when it comes to defending censorship. If you have meaningful rebuttal of any of my points I will consider it, otherwise your reply is bringing in nothing except strawman arguments. India has a history of censoring and also vilifying its minorities.
  - xvector 8y ago
    > It is absolutely certain to hurt Indians in future, See, you're missing the point again. India is irrelevant to this discussion. It's tangential at best. Let's look at an example: mywacaday asked [1]: "Why should there be a different standard for Google and other tech companies to not expand into China" And you responded [2]: "Because it will degrade democracy in countries like India." No. That's not the reason. That is a completely disjointed and bizarre tangent. India is irrelevant to the real issues at hand here, but in each comment you try to find a way to shoehorn it into the discussion. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17661610 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17661610 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17662806 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17662806
    - iamshs 8y ago
      The censorship project won't remain confined to China. Absolutely and directly relevant, as countries that have germinating democracies right now will not continue on the path. If this project gets implemented in China, India is next and I have a right to bring my viewpoint to this discussion. India already loves censorship as it is. Looks like your issue is why India is being mentioned, I have no control over your emotions.
      - sidibe 8y ago
        >The censorship project won't remain confined to China. Another aspect of this is that once Google gets addicted to Chinese revenue, China will have leverage over them. It's much easier for Google (from shareholder-relations perspective) to stay out of China than it would be to start making tens of billions of dollars there and then pull out when China starts uncomfortably twisting their arm more. I wonder what concessions they are getting out of a company heavily relying on China, like Apple. Google would be even scarier.
      - xvector 8y ago
        > The censorship project won't remain confined to China. I agree, but this is not the immediate issue with the current decision being made - as you implied. The immediate issue is the enforcement of the loss of freedom for Chinese citizens.
        iamshs 8y ago
        The move has repercussions far beyond the immediate issue. This nefarious project can't be viewed in isolation with far worse ramifications that will follow. My viewpoint brings that in focus. I still don't know why you accused me "all of my comments are on Hindus", when none was in fact disparaging to Indians or Hindus.

by iamshs 8y ago

xvector 8y ago

Literally all of your comments in this thread are on Indians, India, or Hindus. You've commented multiple times on "the damaging impact this might have on India down the line", but pay no heed to the subject of this whole topic: the immediate damaging effects on Chinese citizens. As an Indian myself, I'm completely baffled by your tangents and you choosing to actively ignore the main issue at hand. This is not an issue because it might hurt India. This is an issue because it will hurt Chinese citizens.

iamshs 8y ago
My comments are on Indian government, and not Indians or Hindus. Where have I insinuated anything about Hindus? It is absolutely certain to hurt Indians in future, if Google goes ahead and implements it in China. This is what I am doing, bringing in another viewpoint which I didn't see being brought up beforehand. It is a valid viewpoint. Stop getting all nationalistic on me, especially when it comes to defending censorship. If you have meaningful rebuttal of any of my points I will consider it, otherwise your reply is bringing in nothing except strawman arguments. India has a history of censoring and also vilifying its minorities.
- xvector 8y ago
  > It is absolutely certain to hurt Indians in future, See, you're missing the point again. India is irrelevant to this discussion. It's tangential at best. Let's look at an example: mywacaday asked [1]: "Why should there be a different standard for Google and other tech companies to not expand into China" And you responded [2]: "Because it will degrade democracy in countries like India." No. That's not the reason. That is a completely disjointed and bizarre tangent. India is irrelevant to the real issues at hand here, but in each comment you try to find a way to shoehorn it into the discussion. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17661610 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17661610 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17662806 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17662806
  - iamshs 8y ago
    The censorship project won't remain confined to China. Absolutely and directly relevant, as countries that have germinating democracies right now will not continue on the path. If this project gets implemented in China, India is next and I have a right to bring my viewpoint to this discussion. India already loves censorship as it is. Looks like your issue is why India is being mentioned, I have no control over your emotions.
    - sidibe 8y ago
      >The censorship project won't remain confined to China. Another aspect of this is that once Google gets addicted to Chinese revenue, China will have leverage over them. It's much easier for Google (from shareholder-relations perspective) to stay out of China than it would be to start making tens of billions of dollars there and then pull out when China starts uncomfortably twisting their arm more. I wonder what concessions they are getting out of a company heavily relying on China, like Apple. Google would be even scarier.
    - xvector 8y ago
      > The censorship project won't remain confined to China. I agree, but this is not the immediate issue with the current decision being made - as you implied. The immediate issue is the enforcement of the loss of freedom for Chinese citizens.
      - iamshs 8y ago
        The move has repercussions far beyond the immediate issue. This nefarious project can't be viewed in isolation with far worse ramifications that will follow. My viewpoint brings that in focus. I still don't know why you accused me "all of my comments are on Hindus", when none was in fact disparaging to Indians or Hindus.