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In 2004 it was trivial to get a New In Box IBM Model M keyboards in the US from online shops. It's fascinating to me how designer keyboards became a niche hobby
by Karrot_Kream 8y ago
In 2004 it was trivial to get a New In Box IBM Model M keyboards in the US from online shops. It's fascinating to me how designer keyboards became a niche hobby of its own, despite having little-to-no empirical testing on comfort or speed, in ~10 years. Back then my Model M was a weird curiosity, now it's a prize.
- tjr225 8y agoI have a coworker who hoarded quite a few when we were shutting down mainframes in an old dc way before my time. I often casually tell him that when he retires he had better give me one.
- myrandomcomment 8y agoWhen I worked at IBM parts were RED tagged or GREEN tagged. RED meant you had to account for them. Green meant that you did not. Keyboards were GREEN tagged. There are lots of ex-IBMers with a trunk load of Model M keyboards.
- TylerE 8y agoHonestly Model M's are little more than historical curiosities at this point. The state of the art has moved on. Once you get used a to a good modern keyboard - I'm partial to Topre switches, myself) - the actuation force of the Model M is just really excessive, nearly double. PS: If you really want them, you can get Unicomp boards built on the original IBM tooling for about $80. [1] Yes, I have a couple Model M's around, including a 1991 'vintage' IBM with a PS/2 connector that doesn't play nice with modern motherboards - they don't generally supply enough milliamps). [2] I don't much care for Cherry switches either.
- myrandomcomment 8y agoMy Model M says 1987. Works like a champ.
- Karrot_Kream 8y agoI'm also a huge fan of Topre switches, glad to see there's love for Topre out there :)
- _JamesA_ 8y agoAnother Topre (RealForce 87U) user here too.
- mvdwoord 8y agoRealForce represent! haha :D
- swah 8y agoIt has become harder to find those right? They are kinda my dream keyboard, but if I actually invest that much on a keyboard, I think a Kinesis ergonomic keyboard would be wiser...
- TylerE 8y agoNah, no harder. Both the Realforce and TypeHeaven boards are readily available from Amazon, and Topre has huge market share in the Japanese commercial market (Think things like POS terminals). They're just expensive. The Realforce 104 goes for ~$250, which is about what I paid for mine 3-4 years ago.
- deno 8y agoThat’s crazy for a keyboard. Brand new old stock Model Fs go for half that.
- TylerE 8y agoI guess it depends on your definition of crazy. Yes, it's expensive for a keyboard but for something you spend 8+ hours a day interacting with (and will last forever) it amortizes over time nicely. Or...to put it another way... I think $2.5 per switch is a perfectly reasonable price for an industrial-grade component that is rated at 50 million cycles of durability.
- mb_72 8y agoAnother 1987 model-M (compact mini to be precise) user here. I have never once even thought about how 'hard' it is to push down a key, hope you haven't just jinxed me! Yes, occasionally needing to unplug and replug the USB -> PS/2 interface when the keyboard is non-responsive is a pain, but I love it. It's a pleasant monthly ritual to remove the keys and clean them. In a time where everything is fast moving and development tools / environments / libraries seem to get old quickly, my keyboard is a timeless anchor that grounds my development work, and will also prove to be a handy melee weapon come zombie-apocalypse time...
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- kw71 8y agoI felt the same thing until after some years I started getting terrible pain in my wrists. It was the IBM keyboard I prized so much and held on to. Then I found some cherry keyboards in the trash in a pile of Point of Sale discards. Now for ten years, "garbage" as been the most prominent and stable feature of my workspace.
- deno 8y agoI don’t want to sound like Apple but you are probably using it wrong. I’ve seen people get used to typing on flat chicklet laptop keyboards and then taking those habits over to the proper old style keyboard. An IBM keyboard is not meant for a typist that keeps their palms resting on desk while slumping in their chair. It’s meant for you to sit up straight and hover your palms over the keyboard. If you type like that then it seems effortless and the keys feel light and you’ll never have any wrist issues. Reaching the numpad area is also easy because your hand is already in the air. A proper typing technique is like jiu jitsu—it leverages the weight of your entire hand and arm to assist with the key presses. Your hand is loose and mobile, so nerve compression is less likely. On a chicklet keyboard your fingers are mobile but the palms are “glued” in place. This encourages lots of “flexing” the fingers to reach farther placed keys, instead of just moving your entire hand in the “hover” typist approach. My guess is this creates ideal conditions for nerve compression. The pain is good thing because it lets you know you’re doing something wrong. Using keyboard with low actuation force is just masking the problem. If you do something wrong with less force you will not feel any pain immediately. Same thing as people using shitload of fluffy pillows instead of fixing their sleeping posture. If you sleep on floor it might be uncomfortable at first but it also forces you into better posture, instead of making it bearable to hold a wrong one.
- blattimwind 8y ago"Topre is mechanical" https://i.redd.it/f5yvlfm16ab01.png https://i.redd.it/f5yvlfm16ab01.png
- peteretep 8y agoThere seem to be about 50 injokes here I'm not getting. I know that "Chad" is incel-speak for a good-looking guy, but the rest of it's a complete mystery. Is it worth having someone explain to me?
- blfr 8y agoIt's a play on the Virgin-Chad meme. https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/265/329/e83.png https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/265/329/e83... https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/virgin-vs-chad https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/virgin-vs-chad
- Fnoord 8y agoI walk and look pretty much exactly like virgin, and I've been walking and looking like that since like forever (pre-teen). Back when I was pre-teen I was a virgin; nowadays I'm mid 30s and I'm a parent hence I have empirical proof I'm no virgin (not that it is very important..). The reason why my walk is typical might be related to ASD (yes, I have a diagnosis). It has nothing to do with virginity.
- blattimwind 8y agoAIUI these particular memes came from 4chan and as such have no basis in reality whatsoever anyway.
- deno 8y agoThat’s quite a bold statement to make after the recent presidential election.
- 8y ago
- intrasight 8y agoI will have to try these Topre switches
- jgalentine007 8y agoI liked topre for a while but switched to cherry mx red (leopold 660) because the keys spring up faster and have the same 45g actuation force. I can easily type 100+ wpm on the cherry but would easily get out of rhythm on my realforce. You might like the reds.
- blanderman 8y agoI believe that it's a combination of a satisfying sound (to the user), a complete disregard for the comfort of those within earshot of the user, and a lot of marketing to justify luxury pricing for what is now a commodity item. The target demographic for these skews younger from what I've seen.
- azthec 8y ago"a complete disregard for the comfort of those within earshot of the user" I have a feeling the issue here is not the keyboard...
- DennisP 8y agoI used a board with Cherry Browns at work in a cubicle, with zero complaints. They aren't all that loud, especially once you've learned to mostly avoid bottoming out the keys. I'm not a younger demographic, and I was getting pain in my finger joints while typing. Switching to a mech fixed that.
- Lendal 8y agoLogitech's Romer-G keyboards are my choice, because they have no sound but they do have the tactile feedback and longevity that I want. It sounds like you're forced to work with some annoying people, but that doesn't make the market "commodity." That's just objectively wrong. Tell those people to get the quieter keys. Don't let them tell you it isn't possible. It is.
- blanderman 8y agoSorry I wasn't clear, I meant that keyboards are a commodity. They're mass produced low margin items and there's little differentiation for the most part. There's rarely a compelling event that causes someone to replace their existing keyboard. The industry always wants more profits and better margins so creating the perception of mechanical being better and therefore more expensive allows them to extract more money from an already mature market through the illusion of superiority. I do find the whole thing annoying but I suppose it's good for the economy, so more power to anyone that cares for them.
- intrasight 8y agoI have three computers and all have IBM Model M keyboards. I have tried newer mechanical keyboards, but I've always returned to my Model M. I'm sure they will outlive me and become part of my estate.
- ivl 8y ago> despite having little-to-no empirical testing on comfort or speed Although it's not empirical, I think there's a pretty big consensus that not having to bottom out on the keystroke is a pretty big benefit in terms of comfort.
- mmjaa 8y agoKind of follows the model of a lot of geek toys - case in point, synthesisers - which have gone through many cycles of the above, many times over the years, and it doesn't look like its going to change any time soon...