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Since ISP's are not government enterprises should they be able to ban users they don't like? Legally, maybe you're right, but socially I don't think the argume

Since ISP's are not government enterprises should they be able to ban users they don't like? Legally, maybe you're right, but socially I don't think the argument is as clear cut as you make it sound.

themagician 8y ago
I mean, that actually IS a good question. ISPs are pseudo government enterprises—that is, they become government enterprises when they need to be. It's really on a whole different level though. ISPs are access to infrastructure. Should ISPs be able to ban people? I'm not sure. It's a valid question though. I tend to think that they shouldn't, but I'm not sure it would be a violation of free speech if they did. Good question though mate. It's also worth nothing that they DO ban people. If you don't pay an ISP can ban you, outright, permanently.
iamdave 8y ago
Question about that, if it's something that takes us too far into the weeds I'll stuff it and save it for later in the interest of keeping us on topic: When people make the argument of-wrt suppression or censorship of speech "Legally no but socially/in the court of public opinion yes", I often want to fire back "But...are not our laws a distilled and concentrated output of what we value in social publics? If we start allowing exemptions and exceptions to that value system to get an outcome that takes away liberties in social publics, are we unwittingly creating the 'case' to erode those values in (the grander) legal establishment-given enough time?" (This might be a long winded argument of 'slipper slope', unsure. Someone call me out on this if so) Maybe it's a question of ethics versus law, or perhaps ethics in the context of buffers between person/individual and state/government?
- shoguning 8y ago
  I think you're right. My suspicion is that if FB/TWTR go totally ban-happy, the social discussion will evolve into a legal one and move towards overt regulation a la utilities. EDIT: IANAL, but if these platforms start favoring one political group over others, it seems potentially illegal, as it could be considered in-kind political donations.

Since ISP's are not government enterprises should they be able to ban users they don't like? Legally, maybe you're right, but socially I don't think the argument is as clear cut as you make it sound.

themagician 8y ago

I mean, that actually IS a good question. ISPs are pseudo government enterprises—that is, they become government enterprises when they need to be. It's really on a whole different level though. ISPs are access to infrastructure. Should ISPs be able to ban people? I'm not sure. It's a valid question though. I tend to think that they shouldn't, but I'm not sure it would be a violation of free speech if they did. Good question though mate. It's also worth nothing that they DO ban people. If you don't pay an ISP can ban you, outright, permanently.

iamdave 8y ago

Question about that, if it's something that takes us too far into the weeds I'll stuff it and save it for later in the interest of keeping us on topic: When people make the argument of-wrt suppression or censorship of speech "Legally no but socially/in the court of public opinion yes", I often want to fire back "But...are not our laws a distilled and concentrated output of what we value in social publics? If we start allowing exemptions and exceptions to that value system to get an outcome that takes away liberties in social publics, are we unwittingly creating the 'case' to erode those values in (the grander) legal establishment-given enough time?" (This might be a long winded argument of 'slipper slope', unsure. Someone call me out on this if so) Maybe it's a question of ethics versus law, or perhaps ethics in the context of buffers between person/individual and state/government?

shoguning 8y ago
I think you're right. My suspicion is that if FB/TWTR go totally ban-happy, the social discussion will evolve into a legal one and move towards overt regulation a la utilities. EDIT: IANAL, but if these platforms start favoring one political group over others, it seems potentially illegal, as it could be considered in-kind political donations.