3 ms·

> "It just doesn't do what I need it to do" Yet you're trying to use your personal needs to counter claims about whether the bulk of average, non-technical peo

by roc 16y ago

> "It just doesn't do what I need it to do" Yet you're trying to use your personal needs to counter claims about whether the bulk of average, non-technical people, are going to run into roadblocks. > "Simply doing things isn't really the same as "doing things"" Clearly, you need to try one out. The iPad is orders of magnitude more useful and effective than Windows slates. e.g. both can do photo editing and no-one's going to ask either to run photoshop, but regular people will get far more done, far more easily, with an iPad. It not only does these things, it does them usably well. As to your list: 1. Printing (unfortunately) will happen shortly. 2. USB keys are a notable bummer, but like with Flash, USB is a means to an end. It's horribly popular, so it is a pain point, but how often are regular people swapping USB sticks? In my experience, when you get an iOS device, you get a dropbox account shortly after. (Yes, even my mother. She loves Dropbox.) 3. People don't connect to domains. 4. Yeah, it connects to cameras. 5. Do people ask every device to host all of their media content? Most iPods aren't holding all of their owner's media. Most netbooks aren't holding all of their owner's media. That's never been much of a barrier. As long as a considerable swath can be held locally and the rest is accessible, regular people apparently couldn't care less.

kenjackson 16y ago
I love how you change the argument. But in any case. First, I have tried one. In fact I owned one. If you go back far enough in HN I even talk about it. I generally liked it, but found it too heavy. I'm waiting for the 7" version. With that said, I don't think it can do most of what a PC can do, but I don't think that's its goal either. And I never claimed that a Win7 slate is more effective than the iPad. In fact it was you who claimed that effectivness wasn't the metric being discussed, but purely capability. 1) So printing isn't there. 2) OK, so now an alternative is something that is slower, requires an account, and only really works at all with an internet connection. 3) I'm not even sure what that means. There are probably more AD users than there are owneers of all iOS devices combined. Certainly at least iPads. If you use your PC for work there is a very good chance your on a domain. 5) This isn't about "every device".... it's about PCs. Most people don't even claim netbooks are real PC replacements. They're meant to be a portable secondary device. No one I know has a netbook as their primary box. It just seems that many iPad owners contort themselves into pretzels to prove that the iPad is more powerful than any other device at any price point ever conceived. It's simply not. I realize you iPad may have fixed your paralysis, but you still can't print from it.
- roc 16y ago
  > "I love how you change the argument" I think I've been fairly consistent in defending the core statement. You're the one who appears to be consistently misunderstanding the statements you take issue with. To wit: > "I don't think it can do most of what a PC can do," No one claimed anything remotely close to that. What was said was: of the things that most PC users do, most of it can be done on an iPad. (implicitly: usably well; not in that kinda-sorta-technically way that accompanies talks about windows slates, symbian phones, etc.) How is it that you can recognize no-one expects netbooks to be PC replacements and you can dismiss their limitations due position as secondary devices, but you can't see the same of the iPad? A device that --unlike a netbook-- can't even be used unless you sync it with a primary PC? > "It just seems that many iPad owners contort themselves into pretzels to prove that the iPad is more powerful than any other device at any price point ever conceived." Again: No-one said anything remotely close to that in the article or in this thread.
  - kenjackson 16y ago
    Here's the quote again: "there's not much that most PC users actually do with their PC that they couldn't do with an iPad" I've listed several things. What exactly is "not much" and what are "most PC users", I don't know. I've listed several things that a lot of PC users do. I've given concrete things like Flash (or Silverlight). Not sure if there is JVM for it, but there's certainly no CLR. Of course these get dismissed as not being important. Hardcore gaming. Apparently a niche industry now. It's an industry big enough to help drive PC sales, but apparently a blip for iPads. Side-loading, USB keys, printing -- mere inconveniences, as minor as missing a mute button. Didn't even mention things like watch DVDs or CDs, but that's old technology right? What about BluRay? Streaming over iTunes is the way better solution anyways. Burning CDs/DVDs? Why would you do that when you can just put stuff on DropBox? And then less concrete things like workflow difficulty. Such as the current browser tabs being ridiculously slow, and the fact that one can't have a spreadsheet calculating in the background while reading a report. Because clearly unless you do things the way Apple prescribed, you're doing it wrong. The iPad doesn't fit this quote: "there's not much that most PC users actually do with their PC that they couldn't do with an iPad". A FAR better quote is, "The iPad does somethings your PC does, but some things it doesn't do. OTOH, some experiences are better on the iPad. It's a different kind of device".

by roc 16y ago

kenjackson 16y ago

I love how you change the argument. But in any case. First, I have tried one. In fact I owned one. If you go back far enough in HN I even talk about it. I generally liked it, but found it too heavy. I'm waiting for the 7" version. With that said, I don't think it can do most of what a PC can do, but I don't think that's its goal either. And I never claimed that a Win7 slate is more effective than the iPad. In fact it was you who claimed that effectivness wasn't the metric being discussed, but purely capability. 1) So printing isn't there. 2) OK, so now an alternative is something that is slower, requires an account, and only really works at all with an internet connection. 3) I'm not even sure what that means. There are probably more AD users than there are owneers of all iOS devices combined. Certainly at least iPads. If you use your PC for work there is a very good chance your on a domain. 5) This isn't about "every device".... it's about PCs. Most people don't even claim netbooks are real PC replacements. They're meant to be a portable secondary device. No one I know has a netbook as their primary box. It just seems that many iPad owners contort themselves into pretzels to prove that the iPad is more powerful than any other device at any price point ever conceived. It's simply not. I realize you iPad may have fixed your paralysis, but you still can't print from it.

roc 16y ago
> "I love how you change the argument" I think I've been fairly consistent in defending the core statement. You're the one who appears to be consistently misunderstanding the statements you take issue with. To wit: > "I don't think it can do most of what a PC can do," No one claimed anything remotely close to that. What was said was: of the things that most PC users do, most of it can be done on an iPad. (implicitly: usably well; not in that kinda-sorta-technically way that accompanies talks about windows slates, symbian phones, etc.) How is it that you can recognize no-one expects netbooks to be PC replacements and you can dismiss their limitations due position as secondary devices, but you can't see the same of the iPad? A device that --unlike a netbook-- can't even be used unless you sync it with a primary PC? > "It just seems that many iPad owners contort themselves into pretzels to prove that the iPad is more powerful than any other device at any price point ever conceived." Again: No-one said anything remotely close to that in the article or in this thread.
- kenjackson 16y ago
  Here's the quote again: "there's not much that most PC users actually do with their PC that they couldn't do with an iPad" I've listed several things. What exactly is "not much" and what are "most PC users", I don't know. I've listed several things that a lot of PC users do. I've given concrete things like Flash (or Silverlight). Not sure if there is JVM for it, but there's certainly no CLR. Of course these get dismissed as not being important. Hardcore gaming. Apparently a niche industry now. It's an industry big enough to help drive PC sales, but apparently a blip for iPads. Side-loading, USB keys, printing -- mere inconveniences, as minor as missing a mute button. Didn't even mention things like watch DVDs or CDs, but that's old technology right? What about BluRay? Streaming over iTunes is the way better solution anyways. Burning CDs/DVDs? Why would you do that when you can just put stuff on DropBox? And then less concrete things like workflow difficulty. Such as the current browser tabs being ridiculously slow, and the fact that one can't have a spreadsheet calculating in the background while reading a report. Because clearly unless you do things the way Apple prescribed, you're doing it wrong. The iPad doesn't fit this quote: "there's not much that most PC users actually do with their PC that they couldn't do with an iPad". A FAR better quote is, "The iPad does somethings your PC does, but some things it doesn't do. OTOH, some experiences are better on the iPad. It's a different kind of device".