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Just got back from Italy. We hadn't really noticed the noise levels while there, but when we got back and ate out, we were like "OMG, what happened?" It was a

Just got back from Italy. We hadn't really noticed the noise levels while there, but when we got back and ate out, we were like "OMG, what happened?" It was almost impossible to have a conversation. And, it seems like all of the newest restaurants are insanely loud. We went to Seasons 52 and a couple ladies at a table next to us almost knocked us out of our seats especially with their laughs and screams. But, it's funny because so many Americans think Italians are loud. They're much quieter when eating out. And other cultures, like the English and Dutch talk basically in whispers. And living in California where there's a law for everything. It's gotta be bad for your hearing. Which brings me to another question. I wonder why CALOSHA hasn't done anything about it? Maybe the same reason that the fire department doesn't do anything about all the locked doors with the sign above that says "These doors shall remain unlocked during business hours". Apparently public servants are only required enforce laws against the homeless and kids riding without helmets to junior life guards ... and people who point out stuff they're supposed to be doing...Uh oh.

mdemare 8y ago
The Dutch talk in whispers? Just ... no. (I’m Dutch). The Belgians and especially the French do talk very softly.
- rapsey 8y ago
  In comparison to americans everyone talks in whispers.
  - dazc 8y ago
    You've been to Spain?
    - dgsb 8y ago
      Yes indeed, several times. I've only travelled in NYC, but nothing really compare to the loudness I've been exposed in the there.
- inoop 8y ago
  Dutch guy living in New York here. Americans are way, way louder than us. Not only do they talk and laugh louder, they also interrupt each other a lot. It took me a long time to get used to when I first moved here, and I still walk into restaurants and immediately leave again because of the noise level. I want to have a nice dinner, not spend the next two hours shouting at people. My girlfriend is American and I don't think she realized the difference until I called her attention to it. It's just a cultural issue.
  - PappaPatat 8y ago
    I once read a lovely observation from an American who came to live in Germany and was surprised to be called out for being so loud all the time. Then she learned about the "1 meter voice" that her kids get thought in school. Once she got the concept she too was able to speak in a "decent voice". Load voices are partly culture, partly self awareness.
    - HarryHirsch 8y ago
      Yes, in Germany they'll call you out if you or your child are too loud. Stateside, on the other hand, asking someone to keep their/their offspring's voice down doesn't go down too well, especially if it's someone's out-of-control child.
  - bogomipz 8y ago
    So you moved to New York and are surprised and upset that it's loud? What were you expecting? This is a bit like going to a Caribbean island and complaining about all the sun. I've spent much time in the Netherlands in cafes, restaurants and bars and never once have I been struck by just how much quieter it was or the Dutch were. >"My girlfriend is American and I don't think she realized the difference until I called her attention to it. It's just a cultural issue." Honestly, this and the rest of your comments sound more like a "cultural superiority" issue on your part.
- toolslive 8y ago
  Belgian here. Yes we consider the Dutch loud but Americans louder. On top of it, they seem to share the illusion that if someone does not understand them, it helps to increase the volume. I've observed this in a restaurant in Italy: > D: "Betalen? Kunnen we betalen?" > I: "Scusi?" > D: "BE-TALEN! IK WIL AF-RE-KE-NEN!" > I: "?"
  - _dps 8y ago
    I spent much of my childhood in Greece, and thus around tourists from all over the world. In my experience speaking loudly and slowly reliably improves enunciation. It also often comes with exaggerated mouth shaping which gives useful visual cues that are interpreted subconsciously (see the McGurk effect [0]) but manifest in what you hear. Obviously this isn't going to overcome complete ignorance of a language. But especially in touristy areas it's common for locals to know a few dozen words in several languages. My experience has been that people speaking loudly and slow makes it much easier for others to latch on to the few words they do know. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McGurk_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McGurk_effect
JohnStrangeII 8y ago
It's true, I live in Portugal where there are many tourists and Americans talk by far the loudest in my experience. Mind you, they are not 'being loud', they usually don't annoy at all and don't intend to, they just talk with louder voices than anyone else. Particularly young American men (at 20 or so) talk with loud booming voices that you can barely hear anywhere else. I don't think there are any physiological reasons, it just seems to be a minor cultural difference, but I wonder what the reasons are. The school system, maybe? College? Another small difference I've noticed over the years, and, again, I don't mean this in any disrespectful way: Some if not many US Americans don't know how to use knife and fork in the "European way". They don't know how to turn the fork elegantly after cutting meat. Instead, they cut everything first and then use the fork in the right hand for eating. This must have historical reasons, maybe it also differs from state to state?
- lovemenot 8y ago
  >> they cut everything first and then use the fork in the right hand for eating I am European too, but I heard this from an American. A knife is a weapon. They try to quickly get it out of their hand, in order that everyone else is able to relax.
  - arkades 8y ago
    No, that’s not a thing here. Your American was pulling stuff out of his keister. Many Americans don’t learn to properly use a knife and fork because of the ubiquity of fast food - many of us never really have to. Go to a part of the country that’s upper SES, everyone knows how to properly use a knife and fork.
- swah 8y ago
  Its a known thing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNE2DhQ1AZ4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNE2DhQ1AZ4 I think I eat the "American way" here in Brazil. I eat rice and beans almost every lunch and I just have to use the fork as a spoon.. -edit- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fypq2qhRZnI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fypq2qhRZnI Also worth noting that both ways are considered good etiquette in this video, but considered childish by most people commenting. The european way seems to a piece of meat in the end of the fork to "hold" the vegetables/rice - but this would depend on always having meat available until you finish the plate? Its complex...
distances 8y ago
In some European countries the neighbouring table may ask you to keep your voice down if you're talking too loud. It would be nice if this habit became more widespread, as I believe many people aren't loud intentionally -- they just never realized the disturbance they are causing.

mdemare 8y ago

The Dutch talk in whispers? Just ... no. (I’m Dutch). The Belgians and especially the French do talk very softly.

rapsey 8y ago
In comparison to americans everyone talks in whispers.
- dazc 8y ago
  You've been to Spain?
  - dgsb 8y ago
    Yes indeed, several times. I've only travelled in NYC, but nothing really compare to the loudness I've been exposed in the there.
inoop 8y ago
Dutch guy living in New York here. Americans are way, way louder than us. Not only do they talk and laugh louder, they also interrupt each other a lot. It took me a long time to get used to when I first moved here, and I still walk into restaurants and immediately leave again because of the noise level. I want to have a nice dinner, not spend the next two hours shouting at people. My girlfriend is American and I don't think she realized the difference until I called her attention to it. It's just a cultural issue.
- PappaPatat 8y ago
  I once read a lovely observation from an American who came to live in Germany and was surprised to be called out for being so loud all the time. Then she learned about the "1 meter voice" that her kids get thought in school. Once she got the concept she too was able to speak in a "decent voice". Load voices are partly culture, partly self awareness.
  - HarryHirsch 8y ago
    Yes, in Germany they'll call you out if you or your child are too loud. Stateside, on the other hand, asking someone to keep their/their offspring's voice down doesn't go down too well, especially if it's someone's out-of-control child.
- bogomipz 8y ago
  So you moved to New York and are surprised and upset that it's loud? What were you expecting? This is a bit like going to a Caribbean island and complaining about all the sun. I've spent much time in the Netherlands in cafes, restaurants and bars and never once have I been struck by just how much quieter it was or the Dutch were. >"My girlfriend is American and I don't think she realized the difference until I called her attention to it. It's just a cultural issue." Honestly, this and the rest of your comments sound more like a "cultural superiority" issue on your part.
toolslive 8y ago
Belgian here. Yes we consider the Dutch loud but Americans louder. On top of it, they seem to share the illusion that if someone does not understand them, it helps to increase the volume. I've observed this in a restaurant in Italy: > D: "Betalen? Kunnen we betalen?" > I: "Scusi?" > D: "BE-TALEN! IK WIL AF-RE-KE-NEN!" > I: "?"
- _dps 8y ago
  I spent much of my childhood in Greece, and thus around tourists from all over the world. In my experience speaking loudly and slowly reliably improves enunciation. It also often comes with exaggerated mouth shaping which gives useful visual cues that are interpreted subconsciously (see the McGurk effect [0]) but manifest in what you hear. Obviously this isn't going to overcome complete ignorance of a language. But especially in touristy areas it's common for locals to know a few dozen words in several languages. My experience has been that people speaking loudly and slow makes it much easier for others to latch on to the few words they do know. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McGurk_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McGurk_effect

JohnStrangeII 8y ago

It's true, I live in Portugal where there are many tourists and Americans talk by far the loudest in my experience. Mind you, they are not 'being loud', they usually don't annoy at all and don't intend to, they just talk with louder voices than anyone else. Particularly young American men (at 20 or so) talk with loud booming voices that you can barely hear anywhere else. I don't think there are any physiological reasons, it just seems to be a minor cultural difference, but I wonder what the reasons are. The school system, maybe? College? Another small difference I've noticed over the years, and, again, I don't mean this in any disrespectful way: Some if not many US Americans don't know how to use knife and fork in the "European way". They don't know how to turn the fork elegantly after cutting meat. Instead, they cut everything first and then use the fork in the right hand for eating. This must have historical reasons, maybe it also differs from state to state?

lovemenot 8y ago
>> they cut everything first and then use the fork in the right hand for eating I am European too, but I heard this from an American. A knife is a weapon. They try to quickly get it out of their hand, in order that everyone else is able to relax.
- arkades 8y ago
  No, that’s not a thing here. Your American was pulling stuff out of his keister. Many Americans don’t learn to properly use a knife and fork because of the ubiquity of fast food - many of us never really have to. Go to a part of the country that’s upper SES, everyone knows how to properly use a knife and fork.
swah 8y ago
Its a known thing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNE2DhQ1AZ4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNE2DhQ1AZ4 I think I eat the "American way" here in Brazil. I eat rice and beans almost every lunch and I just have to use the fork as a spoon.. -edit- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fypq2qhRZnI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fypq2qhRZnI Also worth noting that both ways are considered good etiquette in this video, but considered childish by most people commenting. The european way seems to a piece of meat in the end of the fork to "hold" the vegetables/rice - but this would depend on always having meat available until you finish the plate? Its complex...

distances 8y ago

In some European countries the neighbouring table may ask you to keep your voice down if you're talking too loud. It would be nice if this habit became more widespread, as I believe many people aren't loud intentionally -- they just never realized the disturbance they are causing.