4 ms·

I would take it further and say “why touchscreens for most devices don’t work” (hifi/stereo, thermostat, desk phone, etc) Who really wouldn’t rather use a 197

by sbr464 8y ago

I would take it further and say “why touchscreens for most devices don’t work” (hifi/stereo, thermostat, desk phone, etc) Who really wouldn’t rather use a 1970s-80s silver stereo with buttons, compared to a cloud/digital player today? If clutter is an issue, check the book “Dieter Rams: As little design as possible” Obviously the overall experience on an iPhone is better than a blackberry, but the sheer speed and “lookahead” actions, where the input speed can exceed the UI state, is on another level. The same holds true for a console type order entry screen (think old school pizza parlor unix). Of course the features are lacking, but using hotkeys and not waiting on UI, is an entirely different experience in regards to speed. Preaching to the choir here I realize. More related to the story, I have a 2017 Honda Civic and every time I change the volume, my dev hat activates, thinking just wtf from a safety perspective. Full disclosure: I’m 35, not too old and cranky yet

blauditore 8y ago
> Obviously the overall experience on an iPhone is better than a blackberry How is this obvious? My impression is that this only applies to casual users, i.e. Apple designs UIs mainly for lowly skilled users whereas others focus more on mid-range or power users.
- close04 8y ago
  When people call it generically "Blackberry" I assume they mean the keyboard models. Now I'll ask this as a long time fan of BB (in the past) and a person who's been using keyboard BB models daily with no interruption since the 6230 (circa 2003) up to this day: have you tried internet browsing on those things lately? It's better than nothing, I'll give you that, but just marginally. And that's not the only thing they don't do well. Even the age-old argument that physical keyboards are better/faster/whatever was destroyed a long time ago. Even after years of using the BB to the point I thought I'd get RSI I managed to be substantially more proficient with a virtual keyboard in no time. I can't imagine a scenario that's not the weirdest corner case where the BB does better. Probably the only thing they might do better is typing while driving. Something that is more likely to classify a person as a power-loser. And that's because as this article says, touchscreens and controlling multi-ton vehicles don't mix well. I think the argument of "professionals use Blackberry, amateurs use Apple" expired a looong time ago. Right around the time everybody gave up their Blackberry (including Blackberry) for an iOS or Android device. People should stop pushing that and try to find something else to make them feel important, smart, whatever. Doing things the cumbersome way doesn't make you a power user. Doing them fast and well does.
  - dingaling 8y ago
    I find typing on a physical keyboard substantially easier when moving, or when using a phone one-handed. But phones these days are primarily used for consumption and non-textual content creation.
    - close04 8y ago
      I'm sure each person will find scenarios that make sense with a specific hardware or UI. But considering the total usage scenarios of a modern day smartphone such a narrow advantage tends to pale. To the point where claiming that a modern touch UI (iOS/Android) is for "lowly skilled users" can only be gratuitously insulting a vast majority of people, or simply an attempt to artificially elevating your own image. While personal preference is up to each of us, issuing such blanket statements based on those preferences will invariably be wrong. If you need a Blackberry to tell people you're a "power user" then you are not a power user.
Steve44 8y ago
> Obviously the overall experience on an iPhone is better than a blackberry I don't know, the iPhone has more modern apps but for typing I've not found any touch screen phone which comes close to a BlackBerry 9900 keyboard, that was perfection to me. The newer models, such as the Priv and KeyOne, are not as nice to type on as the 9900 but still far superior to others.
WalterBright 8y ago
My '72 dodge has only two controls, the gas and the steering wheel. No need for anything else. (And I'm not convinced the steering wheel is actually necessary.)
bluetomcat 8y ago
European and Japanese cars of the early 90s had the best UI that just lets you concentrate on driving. No cupholders, usable storage space on the dashboard due to the lack of airbags, angular-everything, well laid-out knobs and switches orientated towards the driver. That's why I still keep my '95 Rover Coupe: https://imgur.com/a/qmu4KY3 https://imgur.com/a/qmu4KY3
- nexensis 8y ago
  This is why I love my 15-year-old Honda S2000 dashboard. http://www.performance-car-guide.co.uk/images/L-Honda-S2000-Dash.jpg http://www.performance-car-guide.co.uk/images/L-Honda-S2000-... Minimal interface with just 2 dials for vents and heating and 2 rockers for volume and fan speed, which are impossible to miss. Everything is tilted towards the driver so there's no reason to ever take your eyes off the road. Everything else just gets out of the way. I drive it daily without choosing between 8 suspension settings, 5 sport modes, the perfect climate control temperature, heated seats, driver position profiles, voice commands, cruise control, awkward bluetooth pairing or proprietary navigation systems, and I haven't missed any of those things during the last 3 years with the S2000. Touchscreens are a lazy solution to handle (or hide) the insane arms race of features imposed upon the UI designers to compete with the market. More settings in the 2019 model? Just add another tab! The Tesla Model 3 is a prime example - a super minimal car in every respect, until you use the touchscreen. There's zero consideration whether stripping features out would actually make a better car overall, so I can only see the trend continuing.
Sean1708 8y ago
I'm wondering if something that could make quite a difference is that from a design perspective touchscreens are far more forgiving than proper buttons, if you fuck up the interface all you need is a software update not a change to your manufacturing process. I obviously couldn't say for certain but something like this might end up making touchscreens a lot cheaper in the long run even if usability takes a hit.
- sbr464 8y ago
  I think this is a good point, but reminds me of a comment about space travel software/firmware (probably Elon or NPR astronaut interview) where you know you can’t push any more updates or hit redo. I think it changes the priority of design/features and you just don’t release bs, compare to the Apple maps/console game/xx where products literally ship broken becasuce you can always fix with a 5gb patch next week.
IanSanders 8y ago
Have you seen buttonless touchscreen card payment terminals. Those 7 inch ones. Oh god.

by sbr464 8y ago

blauditore 8y ago

> Obviously the overall experience on an iPhone is better than a blackberry How is this obvious? My impression is that this only applies to casual users, i.e. Apple designs UIs mainly for lowly skilled users whereas others focus more on mid-range or power users.

close04 8y ago
When people call it generically "Blackberry" I assume they mean the keyboard models. Now I'll ask this as a long time fan of BB (in the past) and a person who's been using keyboard BB models daily with no interruption since the 6230 (circa 2003) up to this day: have you tried internet browsing on those things lately? It's better than nothing, I'll give you that, but just marginally. And that's not the only thing they don't do well. Even the age-old argument that physical keyboards are better/faster/whatever was destroyed a long time ago. Even after years of using the BB to the point I thought I'd get RSI I managed to be substantially more proficient with a virtual keyboard in no time. I can't imagine a scenario that's not the weirdest corner case where the BB does better. Probably the only thing they might do better is typing while driving. Something that is more likely to classify a person as a power-loser. And that's because as this article says, touchscreens and controlling multi-ton vehicles don't mix well. I think the argument of "professionals use Blackberry, amateurs use Apple" expired a looong time ago. Right around the time everybody gave up their Blackberry (including Blackberry) for an iOS or Android device. People should stop pushing that and try to find something else to make them feel important, smart, whatever. Doing things the cumbersome way doesn't make you a power user. Doing them fast and well does.
- dingaling 8y ago
  I find typing on a physical keyboard substantially easier when moving, or when using a phone one-handed. But phones these days are primarily used for consumption and non-textual content creation.
  - close04 8y ago
    I'm sure each person will find scenarios that make sense with a specific hardware or UI. But considering the total usage scenarios of a modern day smartphone such a narrow advantage tends to pale. To the point where claiming that a modern touch UI (iOS/Android) is for "lowly skilled users" can only be gratuitously insulting a vast majority of people, or simply an attempt to artificially elevating your own image. While personal preference is up to each of us, issuing such blanket statements based on those preferences will invariably be wrong. If you need a Blackberry to tell people you're a "power user" then you are not a power user.

Steve44 8y ago

> Obviously the overall experience on an iPhone is better than a blackberry I don't know, the iPhone has more modern apps but for typing I've not found any touch screen phone which comes close to a BlackBerry 9900 keyboard, that was perfection to me. The newer models, such as the Priv and KeyOne, are not as nice to type on as the 9900 but still far superior to others.

WalterBright 8y ago

My '72 dodge has only two controls, the gas and the steering wheel. No need for anything else. (And I'm not convinced the steering wheel is actually necessary.)

bluetomcat 8y ago

European and Japanese cars of the early 90s had the best UI that just lets you concentrate on driving. No cupholders, usable storage space on the dashboard due to the lack of airbags, angular-everything, well laid-out knobs and switches orientated towards the driver. That's why I still keep my '95 Rover Coupe: https://imgur.com/a/qmu4KY3 https://imgur.com/a/qmu4KY3

nexensis 8y ago
This is why I love my 15-year-old Honda S2000 dashboard. http://www.performance-car-guide.co.uk/images/L-Honda-S2000-Dash.jpg http://www.performance-car-guide.co.uk/images/L-Honda-S2000-... Minimal interface with just 2 dials for vents and heating and 2 rockers for volume and fan speed, which are impossible to miss. Everything is tilted towards the driver so there's no reason to ever take your eyes off the road. Everything else just gets out of the way. I drive it daily without choosing between 8 suspension settings, 5 sport modes, the perfect climate control temperature, heated seats, driver position profiles, voice commands, cruise control, awkward bluetooth pairing or proprietary navigation systems, and I haven't missed any of those things during the last 3 years with the S2000. Touchscreens are a lazy solution to handle (or hide) the insane arms race of features imposed upon the UI designers to compete with the market. More settings in the 2019 model? Just add another tab! The Tesla Model 3 is a prime example - a super minimal car in every respect, until you use the touchscreen. There's zero consideration whether stripping features out would actually make a better car overall, so I can only see the trend continuing.

Sean1708 8y ago

I'm wondering if something that could make quite a difference is that from a design perspective touchscreens are far more forgiving than proper buttons, if you fuck up the interface all you need is a software update not a change to your manufacturing process. I obviously couldn't say for certain but something like this might end up making touchscreens a lot cheaper in the long run even if usability takes a hit.

sbr464 8y ago
I think this is a good point, but reminds me of a comment about space travel software/firmware (probably Elon or NPR astronaut interview) where you know you can’t push any more updates or hit redo. I think it changes the priority of design/features and you just don’t release bs, compare to the Apple maps/console game/xx where products literally ship broken becasuce you can always fix with a 5gb patch next week.

IanSanders 8y ago

Have you seen buttonless touchscreen card payment terminals. Those 7 inch ones. Oh god.