6 ms·

The best way to improve sleep is CBTI, definitely not Ambien. Ambien doesn’t induce sleep. It induces a non waking state.

by LeonB 8y ago

internet_user 8y ago
Maybe not quite Ambien, but have you ever had propofol sedation?
- russh 8y ago
  Best nap of my life.
CommieBobDole 8y ago
Do you have a cite for that? Ambien makes me slightly more drowsy; it's not like being under general anesthesia.
- kszxgz 8y ago
  "According to the new book Why We Sleep, by Matthew Walker, the director of the Sleep and Neuroimaging Lab at the University of California, Berkeley, the sleep people get on sleeping pills like Ambien is not true sleep. Drugs like these simply “switch off the top of your cortex, the top of your brain,” he explained to New York Magazine, “and put you into a state of unconsciousness.” That’s not sleep; that’s cryogenics. According to Walker, sleeping-pill sleep doesn’t have the same restorative powers—and there are lots, from an immune boost to emotional resilience—as good, old-fashioned zzzzs." https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2017/10/better-than-ambien/543771/ https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2017/10/better-th...
  - newsbinator 8y ago
    Does that apply to Melatonin pills? It seems like a more "normal" way to get your brain to sleep than Ambien.
    - DoreenMichele 8y ago
      No, melatonin is the actual thing your body produces to go to sleep. However, having used it, if your brain chemistry is sufficiently screwed up, you may find it hard to wake up fully if you don't also take Co q 10 in the morning. That's the coenzyme for melatonin. It wakes you up.
      - merinowool 8y ago
        Brain chemistry stuff was disproved ages ago. There is no such thing as chemical imbalance.
        DoreenMichele 8y ago
        A. I took enough (prescription) drugs for enough years that it isn't possible I got through that without deranging my brain in some manner. In fact, I think different, I dream different etc. I'm absolutely positive my brain was permanently altered by the experience. B. After all those drugs, I was incapable of sleeping well. In a nutshell, I fixed this with several years of Co q 10 in the morning, melatonin at night. I sleep pretty well most nights these days. C. Every time someone tells me I imagined the whole thing and it is placebo effect, my sons have a good chuckle about how that must make me the most powerful psychic on the planet that I apparently cured myself solely with the power of some idiotic, unscientific belief. (Darth Vader, fear me!)
        apatters 8y ago
        I don't see why anyone should doubt your observations about the quality of your sleep over time. You've surely paid closer attention than they have, what with it being your sleep. Causality is harder to prove though. Was it really long-term conditioning through melatonin and Coq10? I moved to a new apartment recently and my sleep improved. I thought it might be because of a brand new, very clean aircon. Then my sleep got worse again with nothing else obvious changing. Who knows what confounding variables may exist. Stress, diet, season, etc. As for the theory of placebo effect (where a placebo actually has some type of therapeutic impact), I don't think we've really concluded whether it exists or not -- I'm not a doctor but my understanding is that there is evidence in both directions and the debate is ongoing.
veidr 8y ago
Is that a reality-based statement, based on some sort of data? If so, please share. Since I can remember, I've had episodes of pretty gnarly insomnia, and have sought all manner of medical and other help, from mainstream to fairly ridiculous ones done out of desperation. I tried cardio, weight-lifting, slow-walking 5 miles a day; I quit drinking, quit smoking, tried drinking more, stopped caffeine, tried meditating, sex every day, minimal sex, vegan diet, paleo meat diet, calorie-restricted diet, melatonin in various dosages, all-lights-off-at-dusk, blue/fullspectrum light therapy, read only books for entertainment, play 4 hours of video games every day, ice baths in the morning, and lots of other last-ditch n-1 experiments. Ambien is the only thing that helped. I'm pretty leery of it, what with all the stories about people having sex with strangers in the park and not remembering. Also, I really really don't want to develop any new dependencies that make it even harder to sleep naturally. However, if I have 2-3 consecutive nights where I can't sleep more than 2-3 hours, I take an Ambien and then I sleep through the night. And the next day I feel like I slept through the night. That happens maybe on average once a month (but the cadence is more like 2-3 months no problem, then several bouts of insomnia in a month). So while I still have the insomnia problem like I always have (43% through my projected 100-year life span), the Ambien makes it manageable.

The best way to improve sleep is CBTI, definitely not Ambien. Ambien doesn’t induce sleep. It induces a non waking state.

by LeonB 8y ago

The best way to improve sleep is CBTI, definitely not Ambien. Ambien doesn’t induce sleep. It induces a non waking state.

internet_user 8y ago

Maybe not quite Ambien, but have you ever had propofol sedation?

russh 8y ago
Best nap of my life.

CommieBobDole 8y ago

Do you have a cite for that? Ambien makes me slightly more drowsy; it's not like being under general anesthesia.

kszxgz 8y ago
"According to the new book Why We Sleep, by Matthew Walker, the director of the Sleep and Neuroimaging Lab at the University of California, Berkeley, the sleep people get on sleeping pills like Ambien is not true sleep. Drugs like these simply “switch off the top of your cortex, the top of your brain,” he explained to New York Magazine, “and put you into a state of unconsciousness.” That’s not sleep; that’s cryogenics. According to Walker, sleeping-pill sleep doesn’t have the same restorative powers—and there are lots, from an immune boost to emotional resilience—as good, old-fashioned zzzzs." https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2017/10/better-than-ambien/543771/ https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2017/10/better-th...
- newsbinator 8y ago
  Does that apply to Melatonin pills? It seems like a more "normal" way to get your brain to sleep than Ambien.
  - DoreenMichele 8y ago
    No, melatonin is the actual thing your body produces to go to sleep. However, having used it, if your brain chemistry is sufficiently screwed up, you may find it hard to wake up fully if you don't also take Co q 10 in the morning. That's the coenzyme for melatonin. It wakes you up.
    - merinowool 8y ago
      Brain chemistry stuff was disproved ages ago. There is no such thing as chemical imbalance.
      - DoreenMichele 8y ago
        A. I took enough (prescription) drugs for enough years that it isn't possible I got through that without deranging my brain in some manner. In fact, I think different, I dream different etc. I'm absolutely positive my brain was permanently altered by the experience. B. After all those drugs, I was incapable of sleeping well. In a nutshell, I fixed this with several years of Co q 10 in the morning, melatonin at night. I sleep pretty well most nights these days. C. Every time someone tells me I imagined the whole thing and it is placebo effect, my sons have a good chuckle about how that must make me the most powerful psychic on the planet that I apparently cured myself solely with the power of some idiotic, unscientific belief. (Darth Vader, fear me!)
        apatters 8y ago
        I don't see why anyone should doubt your observations about the quality of your sleep over time. You've surely paid closer attention than they have, what with it being your sleep. Causality is harder to prove though. Was it really long-term conditioning through melatonin and Coq10? I moved to a new apartment recently and my sleep improved. I thought it might be because of a brand new, very clean aircon. Then my sleep got worse again with nothing else obvious changing. Who knows what confounding variables may exist. Stress, diet, season, etc. As for the theory of placebo effect (where a placebo actually has some type of therapeutic impact), I don't think we've really concluded whether it exists or not -- I'm not a doctor but my understanding is that there is evidence in both directions and the debate is ongoing.

veidr 8y ago

Is that a reality-based statement, based on some sort of data? If so, please share. Since I can remember, I've had episodes of pretty gnarly insomnia, and have sought all manner of medical and other help, from mainstream to fairly ridiculous ones done out of desperation. I tried cardio, weight-lifting, slow-walking 5 miles a day; I quit drinking, quit smoking, tried drinking more, stopped caffeine, tried meditating, sex every day, minimal sex, vegan diet, paleo meat diet, calorie-restricted diet, melatonin in various dosages, all-lights-off-at-dusk, blue/fullspectrum light therapy, read only books for entertainment, play 4 hours of video games every day, ice baths in the morning, and lots of other last-ditch n-1 experiments. Ambien is the only thing that helped. I'm pretty leery of it, what with all the stories about people having sex with strangers in the park and not remembering. Also, I really really don't want to develop any new dependencies that make it even harder to sleep naturally. However, if I have 2-3 consecutive nights where I can't sleep more than 2-3 hours, I take an Ambien and then I sleep through the night. And the next day I feel like I slept through the night. That happens maybe on average once a month (but the cadence is more like 2-3 months no problem, then several bouts of insomnia in a month). So while I still have the insomnia problem like I always have (43% through my projected 100-year life span), the Ambien makes it manageable.