4 ms·

It's not always possible to describe a problem in a way you will understand if you aren't already familiar with it. And that's ok! Reading something like "distr

by mrkurt 8y ago

It's not always possible to describe a problem in a way you will understand if you aren't already familiar with it. And that's ok! Reading something like "distributed, fault-tolerant pipeline for observability data" and ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ could be good response both for you and the people who built the thing. It's definitely ok that you have to dig a little more to wrap your head around it. In short, it's reasonable to expect that people who see a project already understand the problem space and write for the ones who can say "yep I need this". This particular project is probably only useful to people who know what observability data means.

aaronbrethorst 8y ago
Even though Albert Einstein seemingly didn't actually say this, I still think this aphorism is appropriate: If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.
- mrkurt 8y ago
  Is it? Because there's an awful lot of base knowledge you need to understand any kind of OSS project. Can you explain what nginx does to someone who doesn't have a smart phone in any kind of meaningful way?
  - aaronbrethorst 8y ago
    I have fifteen years of professional experience in software development and I didn't have the slightest clue what Veneur did from its description of "A distributed, fault-tolerant pipeline for observability data." - Distributed - Got this one, but it's an adjective and doesn't mean much on its own. - Fault-tolerant - Same. - Pipeline - OK, great, totally meaningless noun. I guess stuff goes in it? - Observability data - What the heck is observability data? Nginx is a web server, plus a heck of a lot more. Their website does a terrific job of explaining it. https://www.nginx.com/resources/glossary/nginx/ https://www.nginx.com/resources/glossary/nginx/
    - mrkurt 8y ago
      The scope of software development is so broad I think you could spend 100 years doing it and still not understand everything. For example, _I_ know what observability data is, but I'd have a difficult time explaining the problem Redux tackles. If you've spent most of your time building user facing apps + web apps, how would you immediately understand a problem that someone working on large scale payment infrastructure has to solve?
      - detaro 8y ago
        > but I'd have a difficult time explaining the problem Redux tackles. Do you think you couldn't understand a short description of the problem it tackles? Because if you could, then a short description in a readme would be valuable to you, and presumably the developers of the thing are able to explain the problem.
  - jmillikin 8y ago
    > Can you explain what nginx does to someone who doesn't > have a smart phone in any kind of meaningful way? Nginx was released in 2004 and the iPhone in 2007, so there's at least three years of proof that people without smartphones are still able to comprehend the purpose of a low-overhead HTTP server.
    - mrkurt 8y ago
      I didn't say you need to have a smartphone to get nginx. But someone who doesn't have a smartphone _now_ probably won't have any idea what the heck nginx does. And there's no way to Einstein it up and simplify it for them. You'd have to have a conversation.
tchaffee 8y ago
I agree it's not always possible. In this case it was possible and someone did explain it in a sentence or two in another response to my question. In most cases it's possible. Here's the opportunity: I've been programming for decades. I'm always on the lookout for new and better solutions. I might not have a use for the software today, but if I can understand what it does and bookmark it, there is a good chance I will come back when I do need to solve that problem. This means a lot to me and allows me to bookmark it both mentally and in my browser: "This package helps reduce DataDog (<-- link) costs by aggregating data before sending and increases monitoring reliability by being distributed and fault tolerant." Pretty much plain English, and now I can bookmark it because I know I will be evaluating my monitoring needs in a few months. I read the entire README and had no idea what the software did. At first I thought it might have something to do with RxJS and observables... > This particular project is probably only useful to people who know what observability data means. Sorry if I'm repeating myself, but no, it's useful to other people. Like me. The software might be useful to me because I am interested in monitoring an app pretty soon. I've never heard someone call it "observability data".The Wikipedia article on observability left me even more confused. This happens a lot, and it's a mistake that can usually be fixed, which is why I wanted to point it out. If it can't be fixed and the software truly is extremely niche, then zero problem.
luckydata 8y ago
Complete hogwash. It's always possible to describe a problem in a way that every reasonably educated person familiar with the field of application as long as the author makes a reasonable attempt at summarizing the following: 1. What problem does it solve 2. How it solves it 3. How is it better than the most common alternatives to solve the same problem Not bothering with doing that is just OSS malpractice.

by mrkurt 8y ago

aaronbrethorst 8y ago

Even though Albert Einstein seemingly didn't actually say this, I still think this aphorism is appropriate: If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.

mrkurt 8y ago
Is it? Because there's an awful lot of base knowledge you need to understand any kind of OSS project. Can you explain what nginx does to someone who doesn't have a smart phone in any kind of meaningful way?
- aaronbrethorst 8y ago
  I have fifteen years of professional experience in software development and I didn't have the slightest clue what Veneur did from its description of "A distributed, fault-tolerant pipeline for observability data." - Distributed - Got this one, but it's an adjective and doesn't mean much on its own. - Fault-tolerant - Same. - Pipeline - OK, great, totally meaningless noun. I guess stuff goes in it? - Observability data - What the heck is observability data? Nginx is a web server, plus a heck of a lot more. Their website does a terrific job of explaining it. https://www.nginx.com/resources/glossary/nginx/ https://www.nginx.com/resources/glossary/nginx/
  - mrkurt 8y ago
    The scope of software development is so broad I think you could spend 100 years doing it and still not understand everything. For example, _I_ know what observability data is, but I'd have a difficult time explaining the problem Redux tackles. If you've spent most of your time building user facing apps + web apps, how would you immediately understand a problem that someone working on large scale payment infrastructure has to solve?
    - detaro 8y ago
      > but I'd have a difficult time explaining the problem Redux tackles. Do you think you couldn't understand a short description of the problem it tackles? Because if you could, then a short description in a readme would be valuable to you, and presumably the developers of the thing are able to explain the problem.
- jmillikin 8y ago
  > Can you explain what nginx does to someone who doesn't > have a smart phone in any kind of meaningful way? Nginx was released in 2004 and the iPhone in 2007, so there's at least three years of proof that people without smartphones are still able to comprehend the purpose of a low-overhead HTTP server.
  - mrkurt 8y ago
    I didn't say you need to have a smartphone to get nginx. But someone who doesn't have a smartphone _now_ probably won't have any idea what the heck nginx does. And there's no way to Einstein it up and simplify it for them. You'd have to have a conversation.

tchaffee 8y ago

I agree it's not always possible. In this case it was possible and someone did explain it in a sentence or two in another response to my question. In most cases it's possible. Here's the opportunity: I've been programming for decades. I'm always on the lookout for new and better solutions. I might not have a use for the software today, but if I can understand what it does and bookmark it, there is a good chance I will come back when I do need to solve that problem. This means a lot to me and allows me to bookmark it both mentally and in my browser: "This package helps reduce DataDog (<-- link) costs by aggregating data before sending and increases monitoring reliability by being distributed and fault tolerant." Pretty much plain English, and now I can bookmark it because I know I will be evaluating my monitoring needs in a few months. I read the entire README and had no idea what the software did. At first I thought it might have something to do with RxJS and observables... > This particular project is probably only useful to people who know what observability data means. Sorry if I'm repeating myself, but no, it's useful to other people. Like me. The software might be useful to me because I am interested in monitoring an app pretty soon. I've never heard someone call it "observability data".The Wikipedia article on observability left me even more confused. This happens a lot, and it's a mistake that can usually be fixed, which is why I wanted to point it out. If it can't be fixed and the software truly is extremely niche, then zero problem.

luckydata 8y ago

Complete hogwash. It's always possible to describe a problem in a way that every reasonably educated person familiar with the field of application as long as the author makes a reasonable attempt at summarizing the following: 1. What problem does it solve 2. How it solves it 3. How is it better than the most common alternatives to solve the same problem Not bothering with doing that is just OSS malpractice.