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Do we really need remote code execution on the bios level? Is this a case of 'we can, but should we?'

nine_k 8y ago
Think about managing tens of thousands of server in a datacenter. An ability to do everything you can do form a local console (and preferably more), without physical access or a KV switch, is very important. Remotely managing a corporate desktop or laptop, e.g. fixing an OS-level problem remotely, may also be important. OTOH I'd prefer this functionality clearly delineated, usinf strong encryption, and with an explicit reliable "off" switch (preferably physical).
- pdkl95 8y ago
  > Think about managing tens of thousands of server in a datacenter. The proper solution is an optional management chip on the motherboard, not the CPU. PCI bus mastering NICs with wake-on-lan and other management features have existed for decades; it wouldn't be particularly difficult add the rest of the ME features.
- alexandercrohde 8y ago
  Frankly, I don't give a fuck about datacenters. I'd rather pay $100 more and NOT have remote functionality in my hardware. There is no universe where what we have now is a good solution. There is no universe where there aren't superior alternatives (like custom bios for datacenter users, like just spending a little bit more money and having two versions)
- Too 8y ago
  > fixing an OS-level problem remotely If this is a problem, configure your OS better, or get a better OS. Otherwise you'll soon get need another ME on top of your ME to "fix an ME-level problem remotely". How many layers of machines do we really need???! most datacenters already run in VMware with dockers inside running Java VM inside executing Javascript inside.
- mrweasel 8y ago
  How many people honestly use Intels ME for managing their servers (or large desktop installations)? I have yet to see or even hear someone defend the ME on the grounds that they use it daily. With a few SPARC servers as the exception, we have a 100+ Intel based servers and we don't feel the need for using Intels Management Engine.
brudgers 8y ago
It depends on how expansive "we" is. I don't need or want it. You probably don't need or want it. Large data center operators want it because it saves time and money. Those are Intel's important customers. That's why it exists.

Think about managing tens of thousands of server in a datacenter. An ability to do everything you can do form a local console (and preferably more), without physical access or a KV switch, is very important. Remotely managing a corporate desktop or laptop, e.g. fixing an OS-level problem remotely, may also be important. OTOH I'd prefer this functionality clearly delineated, usinf strong encryption, and with an explicit reliable "off" switch (preferably physical).

pdkl95 8y ago
> Think about managing tens of thousands of server in a datacenter. The proper solution is an optional management chip on the motherboard, not the CPU. PCI bus mastering NICs with wake-on-lan and other management features have existed for decades; it wouldn't be particularly difficult add the rest of the ME features.
alexandercrohde 8y ago
Frankly, I don't give a fuck about datacenters. I'd rather pay $100 more and NOT have remote functionality in my hardware. There is no universe where what we have now is a good solution. There is no universe where there aren't superior alternatives (like custom bios for datacenter users, like just spending a little bit more money and having two versions)
Too 8y ago
> fixing an OS-level problem remotely If this is a problem, configure your OS better, or get a better OS. Otherwise you'll soon get need another ME on top of your ME to "fix an ME-level problem remotely". How many layers of machines do we really need???! most datacenters already run in VMware with dockers inside running Java VM inside executing Javascript inside.
mrweasel 8y ago
How many people honestly use Intels ME for managing their servers (or large desktop installations)? I have yet to see or even hear someone defend the ME on the grounds that they use it daily. With a few SPARC servers as the exception, we have a 100+ Intel based servers and we don't feel the need for using Intels Management Engine.

brudgers 8y ago

It depends on how expansive "we" is. I don't need or want it. You probably don't need or want it. Large data center operators want it because it saves time and money. Those are Intel's important customers. That's why it exists.