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>It has to be mutually beneficial, otherwise drivers would be doing something else. We don't have slavery in this country anymore. I want to be clear here, and

by britch 8y ago

>It has to be mutually beneficial, otherwise drivers would be doing something else. We don't have slavery in this country anymore. I want to be clear here, and I'd appreciate it if you did not put words in my mouth. I never claimed rideshare drivers were slaves. I was questioning the degree to which the arrangement was beneficial to both parties. If everyone was perfectly rational, I would agree with you. But many of these additional costs are hidden. Uber advertises ~$8 an hour, which sounds pretty good. But they don't mention the wear and tear on the car, the increased cost of mechanics, etc. I'm not convinced most drivers are aware of that or look into it. Clearly it is somewhat beneficial for the drivers. $4 an hour is better than $0 an hour, but I still think it's worth pointing out it's not even minimum wage in the US.

peacetreefrog 8y ago
No worries, not suggesting you think it's slavery. I think that would be a pretty extreme position to take. I do agree people aren't always rational, and there are certainly other costs in terms of wear and tear etc. But I think people are (1) relatively more rational when it comes to money, (2) get more rational with experience (i.e. as they observe having to take their cars in more after driving a while). Uber has > 160k active drivers, I think it's very paternalistic to suggest they aren't rational enough to realize how screwed they're getting and think gov or some other third party needs to step in. I think it should also give us pause that many of the loudest voices saying these things (especially locally) are associated with the taxi industry. These researchers say it's $8.55. Some people argue it should be more (like $13), but -- like I said in another comment -- a job is a bundle of things including pay but also: flexibility, liking who you work with, feeling like you accomplished something, etc. Uber provides very high flexibility (literally can almost work on demand), which economists have estimated gives drivers twice the surplus over similar paying, less flexible options.
- britch 8y ago
  I agree with your numbers after doing some more reading, i was definitely off the mark going in. I would point to the high turnover rate as an indication that people do realize that maybe they aren't making what they thought they would when they started. I think people catch on, but that doesn't stop others from signing up without realizing it. However I'm not convinced the drivers are being exploited to the degree I originally claimed. You make good points and have given me much to consider

by britch 8y ago

peacetreefrog 8y ago

No worries, not suggesting you think it's slavery. I think that would be a pretty extreme position to take. I do agree people aren't always rational, and there are certainly other costs in terms of wear and tear etc. But I think people are (1) relatively more rational when it comes to money, (2) get more rational with experience (i.e. as they observe having to take their cars in more after driving a while). Uber has > 160k active drivers, I think it's very paternalistic to suggest they aren't rational enough to realize how screwed they're getting and think gov or some other third party needs to step in. I think it should also give us pause that many of the loudest voices saying these things (especially locally) are associated with the taxi industry. These researchers say it's $8.55. Some people argue it should be more (like $13), but -- like I said in another comment -- a job is a bundle of things including pay but also: flexibility, liking who you work with, feeling like you accomplished something, etc. Uber provides very high flexibility (literally can almost work on demand), which economists have estimated gives drivers twice the surplus over similar paying, less flexible options.

britch 8y ago
I agree with your numbers after doing some more reading, i was definitely off the mark going in. I would point to the high turnover rate as an indication that people do realize that maybe they aren't making what they thought they would when they started. I think people catch on, but that doesn't stop others from signing up without realizing it. However I'm not convinced the drivers are being exploited to the degree I originally claimed. You make good points and have given me much to consider