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I suspect that the solution to the problem may look very different to the planes and drawings of planes shown in the article. I know nothing of aerodynamics bu

I suspect that the solution to the problem may look very different to the planes and drawings of planes shown in the article. I know nothing of aerodynamics but what I do know is that innovation in aerodynamics is more likely to come from the world of F1 than the bowels of Lockheed Martin these days. This has actually been the case since the 'Gurney Flap' that was the first innovation in aero to come from motor racing to make its way to regular aerospace. In 2017 at the Singapore Grand Prix the Force India F1 team surprised the fans with a new gadget to get extra downforce. In 2017 F1 cars had a 'sharkfin' engine cover and on top of this Force India had what looked like a hedge trimmer, this was 30 or so very small wings that worked together to create two powerful vortexes with the mini-winglets reinforcing the same vortex created by the mini-winglets at the front of this 'hedge trimmer' arrangement. From this they were able to get good downforce from an area of the engine cover/sharkfin that was not supposed to be downforce creating. The innovation obviously had to be banned and this is no longer a feature in 2018 cars. F1 max speeds are lower than a plane and the aero is not about getting airborne, however, due to the rules there is constant innovation. Regular planes look as aerodynamically sophisticated as F1 cars from the 1980's. I suspect that to do supersonic without the boom then aerospace will have to borrow more than just the Gurney Flap from F1. Furthermore, incentives have to be better than pork barrel politics or else the Lockheed Martins of this world will be on this gravy train forever.

NLips 8y ago
The key point you're missing is that subsonic and supersonic flows are very different - in terms of fluid dynamics, supersonic planes are not just faster than subsonic planes. Commercial jets and F1 cars are optimised for subsonic flows. To handle supersonic flight, you need to do things which are strange and suboptimal for subsonic travel. This is partly why subsonic planes don't look like concorde. That's not to say cars won't have an effect on the design. Two avenues I can think of in particular are: 1) Concorde's shape made it _extremely_ noisey upon take-off. That's subsonic travel, so other subsonic vehicles might provide design inspiration (even though in some cases going supersonic may mean the inspiration has to be ignored) 2) Projects like Bloodhound SSC might provide inspiration.
- Theodores 8y ago
  I think I mentioned that F1 cars go a little bit slowly, however, the point I was making is that some thinking outside of the box is needed, from some area of engineering that is actually innovative. Innovation isn't just about funding, no amount of money sponged off the taxpayer and given to NASA and their greedy contractors will solve the problem. You need engineering talent and people who can bend the rules and do things that go beyond what can be learned from studying textbooks.
  - NLips 8y ago
    You did mention that "F1 cars go a little bit slowly". The difference is that speed is pretty much irrelevant. It's sub/trans/super-sonic that matters.
fabricexpert 8y ago
> I know nothing of aerodynamics then don't comment on aerodynamics

NLips 8y ago

The key point you're missing is that subsonic and supersonic flows are very different - in terms of fluid dynamics, supersonic planes are not just faster than subsonic planes. Commercial jets and F1 cars are optimised for subsonic flows. To handle supersonic flight, you need to do things which are strange and suboptimal for subsonic travel. This is partly why subsonic planes don't look like concorde. That's not to say cars won't have an effect on the design. Two avenues I can think of in particular are: 1) Concorde's shape made it _extremely_ noisey upon take-off. That's subsonic travel, so other subsonic vehicles might provide design inspiration (even though in some cases going supersonic may mean the inspiration has to be ignored) 2) Projects like Bloodhound SSC might provide inspiration.

Theodores 8y ago
I think I mentioned that F1 cars go a little bit slowly, however, the point I was making is that some thinking outside of the box is needed, from some area of engineering that is actually innovative. Innovation isn't just about funding, no amount of money sponged off the taxpayer and given to NASA and their greedy contractors will solve the problem. You need engineering talent and people who can bend the rules and do things that go beyond what can be learned from studying textbooks.
- NLips 8y ago
  You did mention that "F1 cars go a little bit slowly". The difference is that speed is pretty much irrelevant. It's sub/trans/super-sonic that matters.

fabricexpert 8y ago

> I know nothing of aerodynamics then don't comment on aerodynamics