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I remember hating the whitespace thing so much when I started with Python circa 2.4, but have really come to love the language in a lot of domains since then.

I remember hating the whitespace thing so much when I started with Python circa 2.4, but have really come to love the language in a lot of domains since then. A huge, huge "thank you" to Mr. van Rossum for creating this quirky language that I've become so fond of and for the countless hours of his life he's given to the project.

irishcoffee 8y ago
from __future__ import braces I hated the white-space thing until I discovered that. For whatever reason this made me get over myself and learn to love the tab/space argument that is somewhat akin to the vi/emacs argument.
- throwaway5752 8y ago
  I know that now. 2.4 was a long time ago... there is some serious wisdom behind that decision/PEP-8/"import this" that took me a while to appreciate. Humans beings are the weak link in developing software, and language decisions that nudge towards highly readable code are productivity decisions.
- Waterluvian 8y ago
  You monster. Not a chance.
- mockingbirdy 8y ago
  Oh, I see. I use spaces and vim (I do, but who cares). Let's start a flamewar. /s Every time I think about tabs/spaces, I think about that episode in Silicon Valley [1]. Hilariously accurate, I have the exact same feeling when somebody uses the mouse to copy something or navigate. The cringe makes me feel alive (I guess this is the ultimate reason for those flamewars. And neurotic tendencies, of course). [1]: https://youtu.be/SsoOG6ZeyUI https://youtu.be/SsoOG6ZeyUI
  - aidos 8y ago
    Haha. When we watched that episode my wife was like, “...wait, what, is that a real thing?!” Only true computer geeks could possibly understand.
  - jacobwilliamroy 8y ago
    :set ts=8 sts=0 sw=8 expandtab I have secrets.
    - kjeetgill 8y ago
      Thank you for this. I've been typing out: :set tabstop=4 :set shiftwidth=4 :set expandtab Like a pleb for years. What's sts?
      - yorwba 8y ago
        :help 'sts Number of spaces that a <Tab> counts for while performing editing operations, like inserting a <Tab> or using <BS>. It "feels" like <Tab>s are being inserted, while in fact a mix of spaces and <Tab>s is used. This is useful to keep the 'ts' setting at its standard value of 8, while being able to edit like it is set to 'sts'. However, commands like "x" still work on the actual characters. When 'sts' is zero, this feature is off. You can also abbreviate expandtab to et.
      - gjvc 8y ago
        Put them in your .vimrc, and put your dotfiles in git. Hint: searching GitHub for "dotfiles" can be a fun and productive way to spend a Friday afternoon :-)
        kjeetgill 8y ago
        I mean locally yes, but I'm poking around on servers frequently enough and writing python there (Hey, I'm no saint) that it gets committed to memory eventually.
    - nazri1 8y ago
danso 8y ago
Same here. I remember that one of my first attempts at trying out Python, coming from Ruby, seeing that indentation compilation error made me immediately give up. Hard to give up the freewheeling nature of Ruby but I am very glad that I did. "Use whatever style makes you happy" has extremely diminishing returns the more you code in a language.
tryptophan 8y ago
I've grown to accept it. However, sometimes I wish we had something to replace braces like some IDE coloring schemes to clearly represent indentation levels. In larger programs it gets difficult to tell apart levels sometimes.

irishcoffee 8y ago

from __future__ import braces I hated the white-space thing until I discovered that. For whatever reason this made me get over myself and learn to love the tab/space argument that is somewhat akin to the vi/emacs argument.

throwaway5752 8y ago
I know that now. 2.4 was a long time ago... there is some serious wisdom behind that decision/PEP-8/"import this" that took me a while to appreciate. Humans beings are the weak link in developing software, and language decisions that nudge towards highly readable code are productivity decisions.
Waterluvian 8y ago
You monster. Not a chance.
mockingbirdy 8y ago
Oh, I see. I use spaces and vim (I do, but who cares). Let's start a flamewar. /s Every time I think about tabs/spaces, I think about that episode in Silicon Valley [1]. Hilariously accurate, I have the exact same feeling when somebody uses the mouse to copy something or navigate. The cringe makes me feel alive (I guess this is the ultimate reason for those flamewars. And neurotic tendencies, of course). [1]: https://youtu.be/SsoOG6ZeyUI https://youtu.be/SsoOG6ZeyUI
- aidos 8y ago
  Haha. When we watched that episode my wife was like, “...wait, what, is that a real thing?!” Only true computer geeks could possibly understand.
- jacobwilliamroy 8y ago
  :set ts=8 sts=0 sw=8 expandtab I have secrets.
  - kjeetgill 8y ago
    Thank you for this. I've been typing out: :set tabstop=4 :set shiftwidth=4 :set expandtab Like a pleb for years. What's sts?
    - yorwba 8y ago
      :help 'sts Number of spaces that a <Tab> counts for while performing editing operations, like inserting a <Tab> or using <BS>. It "feels" like <Tab>s are being inserted, while in fact a mix of spaces and <Tab>s is used. This is useful to keep the 'ts' setting at its standard value of 8, while being able to edit like it is set to 'sts'. However, commands like "x" still work on the actual characters. When 'sts' is zero, this feature is off. You can also abbreviate expandtab to et.
    - gjvc 8y ago
      Put them in your .vimrc, and put your dotfiles in git. Hint: searching GitHub for "dotfiles" can be a fun and productive way to spend a Friday afternoon :-)
      - kjeetgill 8y ago
        I mean locally yes, but I'm poking around on servers frequently enough and writing python there (Hey, I'm no saint) that it gets committed to memory eventually.
  - nazri1 8y ago

danso 8y ago

Same here. I remember that one of my first attempts at trying out Python, coming from Ruby, seeing that indentation compilation error made me immediately give up. Hard to give up the freewheeling nature of Ruby but I am very glad that I did. "Use whatever style makes you happy" has extremely diminishing returns the more you code in a language.

tryptophan 8y ago

I've grown to accept it. However, sometimes I wish we had something to replace braces like some IDE coloring schemes to clearly represent indentation levels. In larger programs it gets difficult to tell apart levels sometimes.