8 ms·

I am really surprised Microsoft isn't doing something like this. They are losing the OS war.

s73v3r_ 8y ago
They've already tried. There's no interest currently for a 3rd also-ran OS, especially from a vendor that would be changing up the toolkit yet again.
- Splognosticus 8y ago
  They're on like their fourth attempt, aren't they? They tried Pen Windows, then Windows CE and its derivatives, then there was the ARM version of Windows 8, and now they're hoping Intel tablets running Windows 10 can become a thing.
karmakaze 8y ago
If Fushia/Flutter gets adopted, it would be a better outcome than MS botched effort with universal desktop/mobile apps. The fragmented tooling and support was like it was made by sales/marketing types rather than engineers.
- karmakaze 8y ago
  Has anyone here had a good experience making a single UWP app for both mobile and desktop?
cptskippy 8y ago
They're taking a different approach. They're positioning .NET to be the Platform regardless of the underlying Hardware/OS.
pjmlp 8y ago
Not really, they are winning the desktop and tablets (2-1) war. Desktops aren't going away, and Macs are pretty much an US phenomenon, alongside a couple of other countries. Likewise, Android tablets aren't that good, with most of the apps being phone apps. Google now is playing with ChromeOS for tablets, which also remains to be seen where it goes. So, most consumer shops around here are now mostly selling iPads and Windows 10 tablets.
- bitmapbrother 8y ago
  >Not really, they are winning the desktop and tablets (2-1) war. According to tablet market share stats they are clearly not winning that war and not even a serious competitor. >Likewise, Android tablets aren't that good, with most of the apps being phone apps. Most of the Android apps I use on tablets all resize fine to use the extra space. I consider trying to use desktop apps that are not optimized for a touch interface a much worse experience.
  - pjmlp 8y ago
    We would appreciate to see the worldwide numbers of those stats. Well, that wasn't the message being discussed at Google IO, specially at the ChromeOS sessions regarding usability.
    - bitmapbrother 8y ago
      Global tablet market share held by tablet vendors from 2nd quarter 2011 to 1st quarter 2018. Microsoft is no where to be found. https://www.statista.com/statistics/276635/market-share-held-by-tablet-vendors/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/276635/market-share-held...
      - pjmlp 8y ago
        That marketshare is by brand, not OS. From what I see here there are lots of Windows tablets to be had, from various vendors. http://www.mediamarkt.de/de/category/_2in1-convertibles-542028.html http://www.mediamarkt.de/de/category/_2in1-convertibles-5420... https://www.saturn.de/de/category/_2-in-1-convertibles-468906.html https://www.saturn.de/de/category/_2-in-1-convertibles-46890... Which are the ones actually on display when I go to those shops.
        bitmapbrother 8y ago
        StatCounter also indicates that Windows tablets have nearly no marketshare. http://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/tablet/worldwide http://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/tablet/worldwide
muricula 8y ago
They tried to rewrite the OS in a C# derivative and could never meet the perf needed while still fighting backwards compatibility issues[0]. At this point mobile OS's are a lost cause, but the PC market is stable. Windows server has never been as big as Linux, but all of Azure runs the Windows hypervisor. I'm not sure they're losing at all actually. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midori_(operating_system) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midori_(operating_system)
- mr_toad 8y ago
  Hyper V is a type 1 hypervisor. It’s not a Windows hypervisor in any sense except that the license is bundled with Windows.
coding123 8y ago
I would have agreed with you a year or so ago. I've been on MBP for about 4 years, my next laptop is going to be a PC again.
- thinkingemote 8y ago
  Linux and Windows runs on personal computers
013a 8y ago
They are. The fact that HN doesn't follow it just speaks to the anti-Microsoft bias here. They've had the OneCore project back in 2015-2016 to unify the kernel and core OS pieces, which was a success and is now powering every Windows device out there from Xbox to the PC. They have the UWP, their unified app framework. They are also working on CShell, which is a unified UI/windowing/compositing system that will work across PC, Xbox, Mobile, etc. CShell + OneCore + UWP are essentially becoming part of a "brand new" OS they're calling Core OS, which will strip the Win32 backward compatibility requirements and just work with UWP apps, primarily targeted at devices like phones and low power tablets. You can search Project Polaris for more information
- JTbane 8y ago
  UWP is dead in the water.
  - ahartmetz 8y ago
    10th attempt or so to kill Win32, this time for real!

They've already tried. There's no interest currently for a 3rd also-ran OS, especially from a vendor that would be changing up the toolkit yet again.

Splognosticus 8y ago
They're on like their fourth attempt, aren't they? They tried Pen Windows, then Windows CE and its derivatives, then there was the ARM version of Windows 8, and now they're hoping Intel tablets running Windows 10 can become a thing.

karmakaze 8y ago

If Fushia/Flutter gets adopted, it would be a better outcome than MS botched effort with universal desktop/mobile apps. The fragmented tooling and support was like it was made by sales/marketing types rather than engineers.

karmakaze 8y ago
Has anyone here had a good experience making a single UWP app for both mobile and desktop?

cptskippy 8y ago

They're taking a different approach. They're positioning .NET to be the Platform regardless of the underlying Hardware/OS.

pjmlp 8y ago

Not really, they are winning the desktop and tablets (2-1) war. Desktops aren't going away, and Macs are pretty much an US phenomenon, alongside a couple of other countries. Likewise, Android tablets aren't that good, with most of the apps being phone apps. Google now is playing with ChromeOS for tablets, which also remains to be seen where it goes. So, most consumer shops around here are now mostly selling iPads and Windows 10 tablets.

bitmapbrother 8y ago
>Not really, they are winning the desktop and tablets (2-1) war. According to tablet market share stats they are clearly not winning that war and not even a serious competitor. >Likewise, Android tablets aren't that good, with most of the apps being phone apps. Most of the Android apps I use on tablets all resize fine to use the extra space. I consider trying to use desktop apps that are not optimized for a touch interface a much worse experience.
- pjmlp 8y ago
  We would appreciate to see the worldwide numbers of those stats. Well, that wasn't the message being discussed at Google IO, specially at the ChromeOS sessions regarding usability.
  - bitmapbrother 8y ago
    Global tablet market share held by tablet vendors from 2nd quarter 2011 to 1st quarter 2018. Microsoft is no where to be found. https://www.statista.com/statistics/276635/market-share-held-by-tablet-vendors/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/276635/market-share-held...
    - pjmlp 8y ago
      That marketshare is by brand, not OS. From what I see here there are lots of Windows tablets to be had, from various vendors. http://www.mediamarkt.de/de/category/_2in1-convertibles-542028.html http://www.mediamarkt.de/de/category/_2in1-convertibles-5420... https://www.saturn.de/de/category/_2-in-1-convertibles-468906.html https://www.saturn.de/de/category/_2-in-1-convertibles-46890... Which are the ones actually on display when I go to those shops.
      - bitmapbrother 8y ago
        StatCounter also indicates that Windows tablets have nearly no marketshare. http://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/tablet/worldwide http://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/tablet/worldwide

muricula 8y ago

They tried to rewrite the OS in a C# derivative and could never meet the perf needed while still fighting backwards compatibility issues[0]. At this point mobile OS's are a lost cause, but the PC market is stable. Windows server has never been as big as Linux, but all of Azure runs the Windows hypervisor. I'm not sure they're losing at all actually. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midori_(operating_system) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midori_(operating_system)

mr_toad 8y ago
Hyper V is a type 1 hypervisor. It’s not a Windows hypervisor in any sense except that the license is bundled with Windows.

coding123 8y ago

I would have agreed with you a year or so ago. I've been on MBP for about 4 years, my next laptop is going to be a PC again.

thinkingemote 8y ago
Linux and Windows runs on personal computers

013a 8y ago

They are. The fact that HN doesn't follow it just speaks to the anti-Microsoft bias here. They've had the OneCore project back in 2015-2016 to unify the kernel and core OS pieces, which was a success and is now powering every Windows device out there from Xbox to the PC. They have the UWP, their unified app framework. They are also working on CShell, which is a unified UI/windowing/compositing system that will work across PC, Xbox, Mobile, etc. CShell + OneCore + UWP are essentially becoming part of a "brand new" OS they're calling Core OS, which will strip the Win32 backward compatibility requirements and just work with UWP apps, primarily targeted at devices like phones and low power tablets. You can search Project Polaris for more information

JTbane 8y ago
UWP is dead in the water.
- ahartmetz 8y ago
  10th attempt or so to kill Win32, this time for real!